King Mapes
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I was more counting years I guess but with that said Wayne also played more of the high scoring 80s.
Ovechkin passes Selanne,Super Mario,Yzerman and Messier for career goals. 2 more for 700 goal club.
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JasonRoseEh
Registered User
- Oct 23, 2018
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I'd say the same, move out of the dark ages and start observing the sport like a rational person would. Comparing raw totals across eras is astronomically silly.whatever helps you sleep at night
GreatGonzo
Surrounded by Snowflakes
I mean either way both didn’t play any significant time in the DPE and both did play in higher scoring eras regardless.
GreatGonzo
Surrounded by Snowflakes
It’s a big misconception that Yzerman went from purely offensive to changing to a more defensive role, but Yzerman wasn’t bad defensively on those early wings teams, he just wasn’t utilized like that because well.....why would he be? He was out of his offensive prime by the time he focused more of defense and the wings had more offense to compliment him. He was a great leader on those teams, but what defines a “good” leader is how often they win, and when he started winning more, his legacy grew.
ThanksYou’re probably looking at ‘adjusted stats’, don’t feel bad, a lot of posters here take those pretty seriously
madinsomniac
Registered User
no it really is not... it’s actually well documented... it directly led to his “garage league” comments in 92. He would later be supported by hull and eventually even Gretzky as it got worse and worse... hell the flyers basically admitted that was tgeir plan in the 89 playoffs cause they had no way to contain him...
when you actually hear ex players talk about what he went through it lends credence to this take... i watched a metric ton of hockey back then and that guy spent half the time getting tackled away from the puck for way too long...
I just say about Ovechkin what i have objectively seen from him and hockey skill/hockey sense just doesnt show especially at internatonal level very mediocre player. His stats in NHL are amazingly good for player who doesnt seem to have much skills. I mean obviously shot is good and especially he has like twister kind of shot's that go in from armpits it deceives goalies, but aside from that he is quite clumsy player> he doesnt have good motor Skills and balance is not good either his skating style is bit like ramping moose eventough he is explosive but technichal wise skating is not great level and puck controll/handling is not great eventough he has couple good moves like toe drag he has not bad hands but not good either compared to Patrick Kane he is stone hand. So he has some good qualities good shot he is big and quite strong and explosive, but he is quite fat and has bad stamina so he just floats around half shift and only concentrates on certain rushes where he goes 100% when there is offensive opportunity. He is playing long shifts and kind of resting and waiting while others defend and that's not just attitude think he weight's 110kg he is not capable to play those long shifts and play all in he has to be selective. He is too heavy to play 2 way game 100% only if he played short shifts like 20-30 seconds and overall playing time like 10 minutes per game it could be possible. So how he has these amounts of goals in NHL eventough he doesnt have special skills/talent overall? I think its that he was clearly at his best when he was young he matured early he was like 25 year olds body at 16 year old so he dominated his peers at under 18 level others were boys he was man. In Russian league he was not anythink special just another player, but then in NHL he was made like rock star kind of charachter in Washington given all freedoms and so on and it build from that. Much of his succees is WWE kind of enterntaiment stuff because NHL is like 50% sports 50% entertaiment. Ovechkin scores so many goals because fans want to see him score and come to see it. Had Ovechkin played his career in European hockey he would not be that kind of star at all in CCCP stylish enviroment he would be just regular player.
I know this is an AO thread but have to comment on Lemieux. In the category of all time talents that had durability issues that prevented game played..and having been watching NHL hockey since '88 (caps fan) I can easily say the hands down the most talented player I've ever seen was Lemieux. God knows what the record book would be if he had some russianmachineneverbreaks durability dna.
That said the durability factor just, imho, separates the two when attempting to compare to AO and also the position factor.
That said the durability factor just, imho, separates the two when attempting to compare to AO and also the position factor.
AD1066
Registered User
- Sep 30, 2011
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I think I have a new favorite copypasta.
RageQuit77
Registered User
Amazing playmaker this Ovechkin. According the topic he passed first Teemu Selänne's career goals (684) and then Mario Lemieux (690), or is it just a pass for one goal, because math doesn't work if he passed all Mario's goals. Yzerman has 1063 career assists and Messier 1193, but OV has to have now at least 1374 assists if he passed all career goals of both Selänne and Lemieux. There is some error in that part of the title, but considering he passed all Selänne's goals how he could then have been passed only one Mario's goal? I believe that was the case and unfortunate mistake in the title mess that up. Anyway, in good faith and with proper interpretation we all can see that this Oveckin guy is pretty awesome hockey player with his combined career totals of
692+1374=2066 points
He carried both Teemu and Mario in their goals scoring, and ridiculess Yzie and Mark with his playmaking skills too.
692+1374=2066 points
He carried both Teemu and Mario in their goals scoring, and ridiculess Yzie and Mark with his playmaking skills too.
Strangle
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- May 4, 2009
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Sometimes, simpler really is better. This is one of those times.
When the question is “how many goals did he score in the NHL?” It’s not asking what the degree of difficulty the goals were. It’s a simple question, with a simple answer.
JasonRoseEh
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- Oct 23, 2018
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In no way is simpler better when it comes to the NHL. It has changed more than any other professional sport in terms of how it is played and how often players score, the evidence is all there for you to see. Using flat totals is a ridiculous archaic way to compare players across eras when we have the ability to see how much higher scoring was on average comparatively.
Luigi Lemieux
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- Sep 26, 2003
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Over the entirety of their careers Lemieux played in a lower scoring era on average. Which is why his adjusted points per game is slightly higher than Gretzky's, but his raw points per game is slightly lower.
GreatGonzo
Surrounded by Snowflakes
True, although not by much, but still lower. Both played within the time where the average was a bit over 3 goals.
Video Nasty
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- Mar 12, 2017
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Good to see him come out of the break still hot.
Alone in 9th place all time now.
Also a nice tribute to Kobe.
Alone in 9th place all time now.
Also a nice tribute to Kobe.
He really just won't slow down. Helps to have the kind of talent he has around him too. Pick your poison defending the Caps.
Syckle78
Registered User
Hate to see your childhood hero passed. But at least it was by another player that is a huge favorite of mine while doing something really classy wearing the number 24. Keep it going!
- Feb 10, 2010
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Yzerman with a very classy message for Ovie.
Selanne with a very classy message for Ovie.
Lemieux....selfish as ever.
Selanne with a very classy message for Ovie.
Lemieux....selfish as ever.
third man in
Registered User
I've always respected the first two.
Sombastate
Registered User
Ducks in a row
Go Ducks Quack Quack
KoozNetsOff 92
Hala Madrid
- Apr 6, 2016
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Lemieux has always been a whiny baby.
I think Lemieux finds it just amusing that player like Ovetskin has passed him in goals surely Legend like Mario won't Be bitter about it he knows his superiority..
bleedgreen
Registered User
It was pretty common knowledge back then you could do anything you want to Mario, no one could stop him so they let everything go. It was a different mentality then. I’m not a Pens fan but I was around then and he forced you to acknowledge the brilliance.
I love Ovy. I love the passion and the consistency. This is becoming a stats driven argument that has no bearing on actually watching them play. There is no comparison between Mario and Ovy. None. Ovy is amazing at mostly one aspect of offense. Mario controlled the game, and could play it any way you wanted to. There’s actually a list of guys in their prime I would have take one shot if the game was on the line over Ovy. Mario to me doesn’t have anyone, and I’d prefer if he was the one the grabbing the puck behind his own net to start the play.
