Ovechkin - all time winger rank

[Brucelenok]

Where do you guys think, Ovi currently rank in terms of wingers (RW/LW) all time? And where he can end up? (if of course he can move up at this point). For me he passed Bobby and the greatest LW ever already. Discuss

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[Buf fan in Nash]

Top 3

 

[elmaco]

2nd behind Jagr, at this moment.

 

[ESH]

He’s right in that 2nd category (after Howe) with Hull, Richard, and Jagr.

Maybe top-3, definitely top-5.

 

[Regal]

Howe is clearly better, then I can see arguments for Richard, Hull, Jagr and Ovechkin in different orders. He's for sure top 5. Bossy and Lafleur don't have the longevity.

 

[TheGoldenGod]

GOAT

 

[BayStreetBully]

4th or 5th. Behind Howe, Hull and Richard. I could accept Ovechkin above Jagr, but could see Jagr over Ovechkin too.

 

[filinski77]

Probably 2nd or 3rd right now, a few more seasons of being top 1-10 in goals should help push the narrative on Ovi's length of dominance.

It'll be really hard to compare, since Howe played most of his career with only 6 teams and way less overall talent in the league.

 

[um]

For me its:

Howe
Jagr
Hull
Ovechkin
Richard

Ovechkin can pass both Hull and Jagr if he can keep it up for a few more years.

 

[hamzarocks]

If Crosby is behind Howe then so is Ovechkin. I have him 3rd.

Behind Howe and Hull. He will pass Hull and end up 2nd best all time. Will be the 9th or 10th best player all time when he retires.

 

[TheGuiminator]

1st All-Time or 2nd to Howe when it's all said and done. Depends on how his career goes from then on. If he breaks Gretzky's goal record, then Ovechkin becomes 1st

Currently he's probably 2nd or 3rd. The Stanley Cup & the solid Conn Smythe win from last year really cemented his legacy and right now he's still the best at what he does which is scoring goals.

 

[tony d]

Top 5 for me right now- Behind Howe, Hull, Richard and Jagr. I think he's going to end up in the top 2 all time wingers though and be the best left winger ever.

 

[Leafsrock95]

I’ll say 3rd at best. Don’t see an argument for him over Jagr.

 

[KoozNetsOff 92]

Howe
Hull
Ovechkin
Jagr

OV will pass Hull soon enough though but he'll never catch Howe.

 

[Plural]

Howe
Hull
Richard
Jagr
OV

Although I will rank Ovechkin ahead of Jagr after this season.

 

[JackSlater]

Top five. I have him comfortably at 4 right now, with him tracking well toward passing Hull and quite possibly Jagr. He won't be catching Howe. I expect that he'll wind up in second among wingers.

 

[alexgreeen]

GOAT

Ovi
Howe
Jagr
Hull

 

[amnesiac]

Howe
Hull
Richard
Jagr
Ovie
Lafleur

 

[Varan]

If Crosby is behind Howe then so is Ovechkin. I have him 3rd.

Behind Howe and Hull. He will pass Hull and end up 2nd best all time. Will be the 9th or 10th best player all time when he retires.

wow. even in a winger ranking, 87 is brought up.

crazy bruh

 

[Tuna Tatarrrrrr]

2nd behind Jagr, at this moment.

LOL 2nd behind Howe instead. And even I'd still say behind Hull and Richard too at the moment.

 

[Mickey Marner]

Howe comfortably ahead. He's in that Hull/Jagr/Richard tier rounding out the top-5.

 

[jetsforever]

2nd behind Jagr, at this moment.

Gordie Howe?

 

[LeafingTheWay]

I'm too young to know about Howe's dominance in the game. All I know are the regular stories of him and the hype around him.

What makes him a better winger than Ovechkin?

 

[Zuluss]

On the History board, I did an analysis of Bobby Hull vs Jagr vs Ovechkin a year ago:
Where does Crosby, Ovechkin and Malkin rank all-time right now?

Brief summary: Jagr has a very different career arc from Hull and Ovechkin.

If one looks at their best three consecutive seasons, Jagr benchmarks to 41 goal, 100 point player, peak Hull to 58 goal, 90 point player, and peak Ovechkin to 51 goal, 95 point player (in 16/17 points, when #10 in points had 75 points and #10 in goals had 34 goals). To me, all those stat lines look very similar, as I would trade 10 extra goals for 5 extra points (so 51 goals, 95 points is to me exactly the same thing as 41 goals, 100 points).

Where Jagr has an edge over both Hull and Ovechkin is in his 4th-best to 7th-best seasons: on average, in their best 7 non-consecutive seasons, prime Jagr looks like 100 point, 42 goal player, while prime Ovechkin looks like 89 point, 52 goal player, and prime Bobby Hull is, on average, 88 point, 53 goal player.

What Jagr lacks, compared to Hull and Ovechkin, is elite seasons outside of his best 7 seasons.
Take All-star teams selections:
Hull 10*1st, 2*2nd
Jagr 7*1st, 1*2nd
Ovechkin 7*1st, 4*2nd (and 2*3rd)

So, my conclusion a year ago (before Ovechkin locked his 7th and 8th Richard and won Cup plus Conn Smythe) was that Hull>Jagr=Ovechkin.
I think the needle has moved since then and Hull>Ovechkin>Jagr. I also think Ovechkin>Richard, since with his 8th goal-scoring title Ovechkin is clearly a better goal-scorer than Richard, and goal-scoring is the biggest pillar of Richard's legacy, but I will probably do a thorough analysis some day.

I voted Ovechkin as top3 behind Howe and Hull.

 

[Regal]

I'm too young to know about Howe's dominance in the game. All I know are the regular stories of him and the hype around him.

What makes him a better winger than Ovechkin?

6 Art Ross Trophies to 1
6 Hart Trophies to 3
Another 6 top 3 Hart finishes to 2
3 Assist Titles to none
12 First Team All Stars to 7
9 Second Team All Stars to 3

Ovechkin will likely lead the league in goals an 8th time this season, while Howe only did it 5 times, but even then, Howe was 2nd 5 more times, meaning he has more top 2 finishes,10-8, since Ovechkin never finished 2nd. He also leads 12-10 in top 3 finishes, and 14-12 in top 5 finishes.

While goals is close, assists are not, with Howe being top 5 in assists 17 times to Ovechkin's 3 top 10 finishes.

In points, Howe was top 3 11 times and top 5 for 20 consecutive seasons, while Ovechkin was top 3 5 times and top 10 8 times.

Even if we look at peak, Howe had an insane 4 year peak from '50 to '54 where he led the league in scoring by huge margins each year, led the league in goals three of those years and led in assists three years as well.

If we reduce it to his best three from '50-51 to '52-53, he had 139 goals and 267 points in 210 games (all 70 game seasons), to lead the league in goals, assists, points, GPG, APG and PPG in that time frame. In that time frame, Maurice Richard was second in goals with 97, and Ted Lindsay was 2nd in points with 199. So he led 2nd place in goals by 43%, and 2nd place in points by 34%. He also led Richard in GPG by 25%, and Lindsay in PPG by 32%.

If we just look at individual years, Howe had 49 goals in '53 when second place Lindsay had 32, and 95 points when second place Lindsay had 71.

Howe basically dominated over his peers for 4 seasons that only Gretzky and Lemieux topped among forwards, and even Lemieux only did it per game, and then continued to be a Crosby type scorer, always being among the leaders for another 16 seasons. This is while being a good defensive player and one of the nost feared players in the league.

Now of course issues of a 6 team league means fewer outlier years pushing for top scoring spots, and his finishes likely get worse in a larger and more integrated league. But a larger talent pool likely doesn't change his peak much, and while some top 5 finishes might end up more top 10 or top 15s, his advantage there over Ovechkin is too great to give Ovechkin the edge.