Post-Game Talk: Our rings vs their rings

[txpd]

I never said that. You said he couldn’t finish. I disagreed.

That’s moving the goalposts, amigo.

Nah. Its a matter of degrees. Stephenson cant finish at all. I didn't mean that. I am sorry that I confused you. Panik is not a finisher. Maybe I should have put it that way, amigo. Why would you put an elite passer on a line with two 10-15 goal scorers??

I am sorry if I wrote that in a way that made it seem like I was saying they were both hands of stone.

 

[Futures Passed]

yeah I was thinking the Caps have some offensive wealth to spread and there is no sense in having a third line without a top 6 type guy. If opposing teams put out their third pairings, Vrana or Kuz will be hard to handle.

IMO you could afford to put Vrana or Kuz on the third line not as a demotion but as an offensive driver.

Oshie Kuz Panik
Vrana Eller Hags

-or-

Vrana Eller Oshie
Hagelin Kuz Panik

I see Hagelin’s value as the #1 PK guy on the team, etc., but I still hope we upgrade with another speedy wing at the deadline and put Hags on the 4th. If we did that, I could maybe see Vrana moving down to play with Eller and Panik.I really don’t want to waste Kuzy’s talent on a Hags and Panik combo though.

I could see maybe Panik switching with Oshie and you have Vrana-Kuzy-Panik plus Hags-Eller-Oshie. FWIW, Reirden did mention the other day that he felt that historically Eller and Oshie have had good chemistry, so there’s that. It sounds a lot nicer if we upgrade Hags with a rental and move him to the 4th though.

 

[Raikkonen]

I see Hagelin’s value as the #1 PK guy on the team, etc., but I still hope we upgrade with another speedy wing at the deadline and put Hags on the 4th. If we did that, I could maybe see Vrana moving down to play with Eller and Panik.I really don’t want to waste Kuzy’s talent on a Hags and Panik combo though.

I could see maybe Panik switching with Oshie and you have Vrana-Kuzy-Panik plus Hags-Eller-Oshie. FWIW, Reirden did mention the other day that he felt that historically Eller and Oshie have had good chemistry, so there’s that. It sounds a lot nicer if we upgrade Hags with a rental and move him to the 4th though.

No cap space for any upgrade this season. Zero. Defense is cheap as hell already, there is little fat to trim. The only cap space that Caps can get will come as LTIR.

 

[twabby]

Jensen looked bad on the first goal but are we really ready to say he’s not capable of 2RD based on one goal against? Every player makes mistakes, even the best players. I’d give it a little more time especially since I thought he was very good the remaining 59 minutes of the game and given the quality of his play in Detroit.

 

[txpd]

I see Hagelin’s value as the #1 PK guy on the team, etc., but I still hope we upgrade with another speedy wing at the deadline and put Hags on the 4th. If we did that, I could maybe see Vrana moving down to play with Eller and Panik.I really don’t want to waste Kuzy’s talent on a Hags and Panik combo though.

I could see maybe Panik switching with Oshie and you have Vrana-Kuzy-Panik plus Hags-Eller-Oshie. FWIW, Reirden did mention the other day that he felt that historically Eller and Oshie have had good chemistry, so there’s that. It sounds a lot nicer if we upgrade Hags with a rental and move him to the 4th though.

I would make the case that Vrana is a difference maker. He was completely in your face with his game last night. That guy stepping up one more level might be the key to another cup. He is far more dangerous with a guy like Kuzy getting him the puck and Oshie there to provide puck retrieval and finish.

 

[Futures Passed]

No cap space for any upgrade this season. Zero. Defense is cheap as hell already, there is little fat to trim. The only cap space that Caps can get will come as LTIR.

Yeah, it would have to be the right circumstances, which makes it harder, but it could something like Boyd or Leipsic out for a cheap rental with an expiring contract who had a good season and the other team could retain 50%. Admittedly, that’s still not much flexibility though. It would really have to be someone who broke out in their last contract prior to UFA.

 

[Futures Passed]

I would make the case that Vrana is a difference maker. He was completely in your face with his game last night. That guy stepping up one more level might be the key to another cup. He is far more dangerous with a guy like Kuzy getting him the puck and Oshie there to provide puck retrieval and finish.

Yeah, I agree that Vrana can be a difference maker for sure. I am mostly just entertaining hypotheticals, because it’s fun and because an alternate lineup to spread out the offense is not a bad thing to have in your playbook if the team gets in a rut. Oshie could make that third line a lot more dangerous too.

I could see Panik being effective in the puck retrieval role. He obviously doesn’t have Oshie’s finish, but he does score playoff style dirty goals in close to the net. It would be a sacrifice for the line of course. I am actually really excited about the Vrana-Kuzy-Oshie line though. I think that line is going to be a real force this season.

I think the bigger question marks are the bottom six. That’s really why folks are asking about spreading out the offense I think. Then again, we should probably give that line a chance to perform with Eller first before we start searching for alternatives. Getting Eller back will be a major upgrade over Stephenson obviously. I think they’ll at least have a strong 200 foot game as a line and be fairly reliable with a better forecheck than last season, so that’s a nice foundation to build off of.

 

[txpd]

Jensen looked bad on the first goal but are we really ready to say he’s not capable of 2RD based on one goal against? Every player makes mistakes, even the best players. I’d give it a little more time especially since I thought he was very good the remaining 59 minutes of the game and given the quality of his play in Detroit.

Jensen looked bad on the first goal. He look good on the Orlov goal. Jensen is the guy. If Gudas ends up at 2RD, the Caps are in trouble. The Caps long term plan is in trouble.

Meanwhile, Am I wrong or did Carlson skate at least one shift with all 5 other defensemen?

 

[Carlzner]

He played a game-high 27 minutes.

So yeah, probably.

 

[hb12xchamps]

Jensen looked bad on the first goal but are we really ready to say he’s not capable of 2RD based on one goal against? Every player makes mistakes, even the best players. I’d give it a little more time especially since I thought he was very good the remaining 59 minutes of the game and given the quality of his play in Detroit.

Exactly. If we were willing to get rid of guys based on a bad shift or two, Carlson would have been shipped out years ago.

Jensen, like the rest of the team, settled in after the first period when St. Louis was flying. Understandable considering their adrenaline from the banner raising ceremony

 

[Midnight Judges]

I see Hagelin’s value as the #1 PK guy on the team, etc., but I still hope we upgrade with another speedy wing at the deadline and put Hags on the 4th. If we did that, I could maybe see Vrana moving down to play with Eller and Panik.I really don’t want to waste Kuzy’s talent on a Hags and Panik combo though.

I could see maybe Panik switching with Oshie and you have Vrana-Kuzy-Panik plus Hags-Eller-Oshie. FWIW, Reirden did mention the other day that he felt that historically Eller and Oshie have had good chemistry, so there’s that. It sounds a lot nicer if we upgrade Hags with a rental and move him to the 4th though.

yeah I was thinking in terms of defense though - 2 strong defensive players per line allowing one guy to have more freedom (Ovie, Vrana, Kuznetsov).

Agree Hagelin is better as a fourth liner. (I was annoyed when they broke up Bura-Eller-Connolly for Hags last season). Hags's offense is bad but I wonder if with the right combination he could thrive like he did with the HBK line in Pittsburgh.

Vrana Eller Oshie was really good though, but it's hard to imagine a way to make that stick once Kuz comes back.

 

[tenken00]

I like what Panik has shown so far in his first game and in preseason, but he needs to get it in his head that he needs to shoot more. He has a decent shot from what I've seen so far during preseason (although VERY small sample size).

But he has to realize that his responsibility here is a little different than what it was in Arizona. I'm not saying just shoot it haphazardly, but if there is an opening and if he has time and space then dont hesitate. He seemed to be a little wary of doing so last game.

Especially if hes going to be on a line with Hagelin and Eller very soon. Let Hags go get it after the shot, just shoot!

 

[txpd]

yeah I was thinking in terms of defense though - 2 strong defensive players per line allowing one guy to have more freedom (Ovie, Vrana, Kuznetsov).

Agree Hagelin is better as a fourth liner. (I was annoyed when they broke up Bura-Eller-Connolly for Hags last season). Hags's offense is bad but I wonder if with the right combination he could thrive like he did with the HBK line in Pittsburgh.

Vrana Eller Oshie was really good though, but it's hard to imagine a way to make that stick once Kuz comes back.

The Caps with Hagelin Eller and Panik now have a line other than Backstrom's to match up against the opposing 1st line.

 

[Midnight Judges]

The Caps with Hagelin Eller and Panik now have a line other than Backstrom's to match up against the opposing 1st line.

Right, but that line could become an offensive black hole.

 

[Silky mitts]

Right, but that line could become an offensive black hole.

They were centered by an offensive black hole last night and they looked like a devastating line centered by an offensive black hole

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

Jensen looked bad on the first goal but are we really ready to say he’s not capable of 2RD based on one goal against? Every player makes mistakes, even the best players. I’d give it a little more time especially since I thought he was very good the remaining 59 minutes of the game and given the quality of his play in Detroit.

He’s a bit cavalier in his own zone for my liking. I like that he takes risks and that he’s confident with his stick checks and reads but his zone coverage leaves something to be desired. He strikes me as a guy who needs to get the puck out of the zone quickly, or prevent entries altogether, because he’s certainly not at his best defending for a sustained period of time.

I do think he can be effective but I’m not sure Orlov is the right partner for him. Kempny actually makes the most sense to me as a fit next to Jensen.

 

[txpd]

He’s a bit cavalier in his own zone for my liking. I like that he takes risks and that he’s confident with his stick checks and reads but his zone coverage leaves something to be desired. He strikes me as a guy who needs to get the puck out of the zone quickly, or prevent entries altogether, because he’s certainly not at his best defending for a sustained period of time.

I do think he can be effective but I’m not sure Orlov is the right partner for him. Kempny actually makes the most sense to me as a fit next to Jensen.

You want Carlson with Orlov?

 

[twabby]

He’s a bit cavalier in his own zone for my liking. I like that he takes risks and that he’s confident with his stick checks and reads but his zone coverage leaves something to be desired. He strikes me as a guy who needs to get the puck out of the zone quickly, or prevent entries altogether, because he’s certainly not at his best defending for a sustained period of time.

I do think he can be effective but I’m not sure Orlov is the right partner for him. Kempny actually makes the most sense to me as a fit next to Jensen.

I guess I’m just not ready to make the leap to say that he struggles with in-zone coverage given the totality of his work to date, especially as an extremely effective PKer in Detroit where the bulk of his duty is in-zone coverage and positioning versus puck-moving and transition.

Don’t get me wrong I like Gudas as a player too (minus the penalties) so I certainly think he should get a chance alongside Orlov to see how effective that pairing is. But there’s nothing I’ve seen so far that indicates Orlov-Jensen will be ineffective. They shouldered the heavy defensive load last night and came out way ahead against a swarming Blues team. If anything, that’s a data point in favor of keeping them together.

 

[Ridley Simon]

Nah. Its a matter of degrees. Stephenson cant finish at all. I didn't mean that. I am sorry that I confused you. Panik is not a finisher. Maybe I should have put it that way, amigo. Why would you put an elite passer on a line with two 10-15 goal scorers??

I am sorry if I wrote that in a way that made it seem like I was saying they were both hands of stone.

Roger that.

I simply think Panik could eclipse his 22G career best with Kuz. And Kuz could stand to shoot more as well. Hags would be the puck retriever.

But I’m not standing on ceremony towards the idea. I just think it’s worth exploring these first 10 games or so (7 for 92), as it may be something that the brain trust would want tried ..... if it’s needed later on in the season (or playoffs).

What’s the harm? Unless they are like 1-6 or something, which is obviously something that could happen.

 

[Raikkonen]

there’s nothing I’ve seen so far that indicates Orlov-Jensen will be ineffective.

Lets see if they can do their thing in playoffs first.

 

[Portable Mink]

Bad start but good after that. Vranas vision has improved. Less reliant on quick strike plays which gives him another string to his bow. A dash of Kuzy in him now.

Fevs was solid. Carlson a rock. Backstrom was a bit off imo but game 1 who cares.

Love the W. Expected a L.

 

[Langway]

Jensen looked bad on the first goal. He look good on the Orlov goal. Jensen is the guy. If Gudas ends up at 2RD, the Caps are in trouble. The Caps long term plan is in trouble.

Way over-dramatic as usual. If Gudas can simplify his game further, play physical and handle the pace he could get the job done. It's not how I'd draw it up but Flyers fans did say he was their best defenseman last season.

Jensen was also a bit suspect positionally on the breakaway attempt where he and Orlov were split. It's weird. How does what's typically a good PKer not be all that strong defensively at even-strength? I think he still has a lot to learn about how different it is playing for a highly competitive team from an intensity standpoint. Mostly I don't find him to be all that hard to play against physically and it's why I continue to have my doubts as to his fitness for that spot.

 

[txpd]

Way over-dramatic as usual. If Gudas can simplify his game further, play physical and handle the pace he could get the job done. It's not how I'd draw it up but Flyers fans did say he was their best defenseman last season.

As I mentioned, its the long term plan that is in trouble. After this season when very likely there were not planning on reupping Gudas