OT: What other Canadian cities could support NBA teams?

[MMC]

Which Canadian cities (other than Toronto obviously) could support an NBA team? Montreal? Vancouver? Calgary?

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[aqib]

Which Canadian cities (other than Toronto obviously) could support an NBA team? Montreal? Vancouver? Calgary?

Vancouver and Montreal. I think Calgary maybe too small.

 

[Mightygoose]

In the short term, I don't think there are any possibilites.

Montreal may be big enough though I believe MLB will eventually return. Not enough corporate dollars to add both so soon. Plus the Molson family has no interest and they own the only suitable be venue

Vancouver, I think it's a tad on the small side to handle both NHL and NBA. If metro hits around the 3 million mark then the conversation starts. From there, I think Seattle is a higher in the pecking order plus the Aquilinni family has stated they will need investors to buy an NBA team today.

For now, We The North is just Toronto.

 

[tony d]

Montreal seems like it would make some sense for basketball. Not sure basketball would work in Vancouver again.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

In the short term, I don't think there are any possibilites.

Montreal may be big enough though I believe MLB will eventually return. Not enough corporate dollars to add both so soon. Plus the Molson family has no interest and they own the only suitable be venue

Vancouver, I think it's a tad on the small side to handle both NHL and NBA. If metro hits around the 3 million mark then the conversation starts. From there, I think Seattle is a higher in the pecking order plus the Aquilinni family has stated they will need investors to buy an NBA team today.

For now, We The North is just Toronto.

I dont think 2.5M metro population is too small for NBA.NHL and MLS team.

 

[Acesolid]

Montréal and Vancouver.

Vancouver would still have a team had the greedy NBA hadn't imposed on them (and the Raptors) the most insanely unfair, evil, self serving, and arbitrary expansion rules ever in the history of pro sports.

Let me remind you what they were:

For the expansion draft: "Each of the twenty-seven other NBA teams had protected eight players from their roster, and the Raptors and the Grizzlies selected fourteen and thirteen unprotected players respectively, one from each team."

In NBA terms it means they got incredibly terrible players. But, you'll say they'll get good draft picks then if they are so terrible? Right? WRONG!

"Both the Canadian teams were hampered by the NBA's decision to deny them one of the top five picks in the draft. The teams would not be allowed a top draft pick in the following three seasons, even if they should win the lottery. The teams were also hindered from using their full salary cap the first two seasons."

Do you know what that means? It means instead of taking about 5 or so years to build a remotely competitive team after expansion, Toronto and Vancouver would take a decade.

In a small marker like Vancouver that was a death sentence.

It was an insane thing to do. And by doing so the NBA pretty much destroyed Vancouver as an NBA market.

 

[CHIP72]

I think Vancouver actually makes a bit more sense than Montreal despite the Quebec city's size advantage due to (what I perceive to be, correctly or incorrectly) greater cultural interest in basketball. Both could work, though neither could potentially become a large market NBA team like Toronto periodically could become. (By contrast, I think Montreal is the BEST market for a MLB team among markets that currently don't have a team, edging out Portland.)

I should note that I think Vancouver got a raw deal with the Grizzlies. They were absolutely terrible all six years they played in British Columbia, never even winning at least 30% of their games in ANY season. It's hard to get fan support when you're always terrible.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

Considering how much bigger deal NBA is now than when they first expanded to a Vancouver, I have no doubt they will be more successful.

 

[the4thlinegrinder]

The Grizzlies were ahead of their time IMO. The demographics of the Lower Mainland have changed significantly in the last 2+ decades. Many new immigrants to the region are from places where basketball is very popular (namely China). There is also a significant amount of new money in the area. The Lower Mainland will continue to grow, with population estimates of 3.5-4 million in the next couple decades. I believe an NBA team in Vancouver would do well now, assuming of course the expansion rules were not outrageous like last time.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Canada has what is the NBL, mainly from in and around Atlantic Canada, notably Saint John, and St. John's, which some fans became aware of that during Newfoundland's discussions and eventual launch of the ECHL Growlers

 

[patnyrnyg]

Montréal and Vancouver.

Vancouver would still have a team had the greedy NBA hadn't imposed on them (and the Raptors) the most insanely unfair, evil, self serving, and arbitrary expansion rules ever in the history of pro sports.

Let me remind you what they were:

For the expansion draft: "Each of the twenty-seven other NBA teams had protected eight players from their roster, and the Raptors and the Grizzlies selected fourteen and thirteen unprotected players respectively, one from each team."

In NBA terms it means they got incredibly terrible players. But, you'll say they'll get good draft picks then if they are so terrible? Right? WRONG!

"Both the Canadian teams were hampered by the NBA's decision to deny them one of the top five picks in the draft.

The 8 players were the same rules for Miami, Orlando, Charlotte, and Minnesota when they entered the league.

The teams would not be allowed a top draft pick in the following three seasons, even if they should win the lottery. The teams were also hindered from using their full salary cap the first two seasons."

Do you know what that means? It means instead of taking about 5 or so years to build a remotely competitive team after expansion, Toronto and Vancouver would take a decade.

In a small marker like Vancouver that was a death sentence.

It was an insane thing to do. And by doing so the NBA pretty much destroyed Vancouver as an NBA market.

In 88, Charlotte and Miami selected 8th and 9th. In 89, Minnesota and Orlando drafted 10th and 11th. In 88-89, the Hornents and Heat had the 2 worst records in the league, but drafted 4th and 5th. In 89-90, the Nets had the worst record in the league. The Heat, Magic, Hornets, and Timberwolves had the 2nd-5th worst, but drafted 4, 5, 6, and 9.

No idea on the salary cap, but the expansion rules were the same. While there may not have been a rule preventing them from getting the 1st overall pick, the Grizzlies had a better pick for their first draft than any of those 4 franchises. Charlotte didnt get a first overall pick until 91 and Orlando in 92.

 

[Ernie]

Vancouver is a much more international city than it was 20 years ago and would seem like a good fit for an NBA team. But I don't see the numbers working.

I expect that an expansion fee would be in the realm of $1.5bn USD, the median value of an NBA franchise. That's currently double the Forbes valuation of the Canucks. Meanwhile, all local revenues would be in Canadian dollars but most of the costs would be in USD.

Much like NHL expansion to Quebec City, there's just not a business case right for further professional sports expansion into Canada. Maybe this can be revisited if the Canadian dollar improves.

 

[garbageteam]

On the contrary, I think Vancouver could work again with the vastly changing demographics (primarily from NBA obsessed Chinese), but perhaps not today. Something needs to happen with both the local economy and the stabilization of housing pricing in the region, along with the forecasted 1+million people moving into the GVRD over the next 15 years or so, but I think Vancouver is more on the NBA's radar than Montreal. The Canucks do not have a chokehold on the sports consumption market in Vancouver; there are many Asian immigrants that don't really follow it and prefer to watch the NBA or European soccer leagues.

There are worse markets that currently support an NBA team than Vancouver.

 

[Ernie]

Well, I'd argue that when taking the Canadian dollar into account, Vancouver would be one of the weakest markets for the NBA. And the NBA has no interest in expanding to a weak market - what they would like it to move to a market that would increase league revenues.

Going back to Seattle is a no-brainer. Vancouver - not so much.

 

[End on a Hinote]

Vancouver never should have left in the first place, has a population of around 1 million more than when they had a team, and have one of the largest Chinese communities outside of China (a market the NBA is wanting to profit from).

Vancouver hands down.

I dont think 2.5M metro population is too small for NBA.NHL and MLS team.

It's not. Milwaukee has a population of only 1.5 million and can support the NBA, MLB, and NFL (GB relies strongly on the Milwaukee market). I don't understand why so many people think Vancouver is too small for 2 Big 4 teams. It's actually the perfect size for it.

 

[singlesliceofcheese]

With the prospects of Seattle (and even they are uncertain) and Mexico City looming in the west, I can't see the NBA going to Vancouver any time soon, especially with their previous tenure. Montreal would also be a tough sell with the MLB being more likely.

 

[Bixby Snyder]

Vancouver
Edmonton
Calgary
Saskatoon
Winnipeg
Toronto 2
Hamilton
Waterloo
Ottawa
Kitchener
Montreal
Quebec
Halifax

 

[Wolf357]

Some Tongue and Cheek here...Winnipeg. The old Winnipeg Thunder of The World Basketball League was getting 15000+ for games in the early 90’s...For a brief period of time A professional Basketball Team in Winnipeg Manitoba was out drawing many NBA teams...it’s true
The Thunder played before the internet was a thing so there isn’t much to back up my claim with a link but the closest I can get is a Wipikedia page
Winnipeg Thunder - Wikipedia
To answer The OP: Montreal no other major league team in a massive metro

 

[StreetHawk]

Any other Canadian team would not be any better off than teams like Indiana, Milwaukee, Utah, etc. You have a few year if you draft a great player to build a team around him. Have to nail 3 straight drafts to have the talent needed to make a run.

AD wants out of NO. How many years left before the Greek Freak wants out of Milwaukee?

 

[MMC]

Any other Canadian team would not be any better off than teams like Indiana, Milwaukee, Utah, etc. You have a few year if you draft a great player to build a team around him. Have to nail 3 straight drafts to have the talent needed to make a run.

AD wants out of NO. How many years left before the Greek Freak wants out of Milwaukee?

AD wants out of New Orleans because they are a bad basketball team. Not because they play in New Orleans.

 

[StreetHawk]

AD wants out of New Orleans because they are a bad basketball team. Not because they play in New Orleans.

These small to mid market teams can draft 1 top level player, but they generally lack the ability to add to it via free agency.

 

[End on a Hinote]

These small to mid market teams can draft 1 top level player, but they generally lack the ability to add to it via free agency.

Vancouver is much larger than New Orleans. 2.5 million vs. 1.3 million.

Vancouver's population is around that of Cleveland, Charlotte and Indy.

Some people here are really undermining Vancity as an NBA market. Yes it's not Chicago or Miami and I'm not saying it doesn't have it's flaws, but it's far from being how bad some make it out to be. Especially nowadays where more players are open to playing in Canada (Toronto).

 

[BKIslandersFan]

These small to mid market teams can draft 1 top level player, but they generally lack the ability to add to it via free agency.

See if New Orleans was competently ran I don't think FA would be an issue for them, its an amazing city.

 

[Fenway]

There is a significant allophone population in Montreal that has little interest in hockey but possibly basketball.

If the Habs were directly involved it could work but Centre Bell is doing quite well.

 

[Centrum Hockey]

The NBA would be better with a 20-15 team league there are far to many markets to support a winning culture when the players only want to play in big city's