OT: Canadian Pro Soccer League

[Burke the Legend]

How is Montreal possible. They already have MLS?

Since the Impact plays in the south east part of town, if this other team was located on the west side (Concordia University's field), downtown (Molson stadium) or Laval they could cultivate a local following especially if they are competitive on tickets and food/beverage prices.

 

[Major4Boarding]

Redirected from the Business of Hockey Forum. This discussion point is much more warranted here than the BoH Forum, as there's no real substantial tie in to the NHL Markets mentioned

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[hoglund]

Sounds like the minor leagues. Good for locals as it something to do.

Will they play in the fall-spring or spring-fall like the mls?

The season is supposed to start in late summer of 2018, so probably September to March.

 

[Diamondillium]

The season is supposed to start in late summer of 2018, so probably September to March.

The late 2018 start is a one-time short season that ends in fall.

It will be a summer league like MLS guaranteed. It would be completely proposterous to do fall-spring in Canada where you would be playing games in -30 temperature. Even with a winter break, our winter is simply too long and harsh to make that plausible.

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

Man the negativity of Canadians around their sports leagues confuses me.

Do people in Denmark cry about how their league is so much worse than the German one?

 

[GindyDraws]

I don't know people are hard on this. Do they not want Canada to look competent in international play?

 

[blueandgoldguy]

Not just the top 3 but Ottawa and Edmonton likely would not be part of it as well.

I bet both Ottawa and Edmonton will have teams in the CSL by 2019. Edmonton was apparently losing money in the NASL while Ottawa was reported to have lost $2 million last season despite drawing over 5000 per game.

 

[jason2020]

I bet both Ottawa and Edmonton will have teams in the CSL by 2019. Edmonton was apparently losing money in the NASL while Ottawa was reported to have lost $2 million last season despite drawing over 5000 per game.

Ottawa lost around $2 million due to mostly travel in the Nasl and they were not alone many teams lost huge amounts as well for 2017 Ottawa has moved to the Usl and if you look at comments both Ottawa and Edmonton made about the proposed Canadian league many said they can't see either team in the new league anytime soon.

 

[Mightygoose]

Ottawa lost around $2 million due to mostly travel in the Nasl and they were not alone many teams lost huge amounts as well for 2017 Ottawa has moved to the Usl and if you look at comments both Ottawa and Edmonton made about the proposed Canadian league many said they can't see either team in the new league anytime soon.

Ottawa ane Edmonton both had to be non-comittal. Can't talk about joining a league that doesn't exist. No one has commented on anything since it's been ratified.

I believe Ottawa has a 3 year commitment to the USL. Could be wrong on that otherwise they can't join until 2020.

The NASL may not last much longer so Edmonton won't have much of a choice to join. Or fold and have another new franchise start up.

 

[jason2020]

Ottawa ane Edmonton both had to be non-comittal. Can't talk about joining a league that doesn't exist. No one has commented on anything since it's been ratified.

I believe Ottawa has a 3 year commitment to the USL. Could be wrong on that otherwise they can't join until 2020.

The NASL may not last much longer so Edmonton won't have much of a choice to join. Or fold and have another new franchise start up.

I think for Ottawa there are a few issues

Growth of the league

Will the league be stuck at 6-8 teams long term

Schedule

Some think the league might want to go with a 24 game schedule while Ottawa and others would likely want a 30-40 game schedule

 

[hoglund]

I think for Ottawa there are a few issues

Growth of the league

Will the league be stuck at 6-8 teams long term

Schedule

Some think the league might want to go with a 24 game schedule while Ottawa and others would likely want a 30-40 game schedule

I don't see anything wrong with an 8 team schedule, too many teams makes for an unbalanced schedule and the best team doesn't always win. Look at the NFL many teams go years without playing each other, that's just wrong.

 

[Diamondillium]

I think for Ottawa there are a few issues

Growth of the league

Will the league be stuck at 6-8 teams long term

Schedule

Some think the league might want to go with a 24 game schedule while Ottawa and others would likely want a 30-40 game schedule

Depends, you could get upwards of 10 long-term teams realistically.

My guesses for launch teams

1. Hamilton
2. Winnipeg
3. Halifax (Stadium looks likely)
4. Kitchener-Waterloo (Apparently has a bid)
5. Calgary
6. Victoria
-----------
Unlikely at launch, possible within a year or two

7. Edmonton
8. Ottawa
9. Quebec City
10. Regina
-----------
Potential if it really takes off or they are bold, either through competing teams or unlikely team hop

11. Toronto
12. Montreal
13. Vancouver

Plus a couple wildcard smaller markets like London, Windsor, Saskatoon, St. Johns, Moncton, etc. would be theoretically possible if things go right and teams can indeed survive on ~5000 attendance.

This league could go lots of different directions actually, but in a best-case scenario, you could have upwards of 10-15 teams.

 

[KingLB]

Because in a league that has both Canadian and American teams, Canadian players take up international spots on American teams.

Which only tends to show the pettiness of MLS Execs. USL and NASL have adopted Canadians and Americans as domestics, so it actually comes down to how good a player is rather than focusing on nationality.

There are sooooo many international slots available in MLS that it basically means nothing. Hell, once you get a green card you don't even need an international slot. Some MLS teams have 9-10 players starting that are international. The Canadian's that aren't in MLS aren't there because they aren't good enough. I mean name a lower league Canadian that could start in MLS?

Based on what, exactly? Why would Bob Young -- owner of the Hamilton Tiger-Cats and founding partner of this new league -- want to put his money into a soccer team destined to fold in a decade because it is merely a front to meet a FIFA checklist? Your argument makes no sense.

I, for one, am taking the optimistic view. You don't need 30,000+ people in a stadium to make a professional sports league work. Look no further than junior hockey, the ECHL, or even the AHL. Only 1/3 of AHL teams average more than 7,000 fans per game and no team averages more than 10,000. In the ECHL, no team averages more than 7,500 and most teams are in the ~4,000 range. Both leagues are fully professional, face similar geographical/travel challenges, and yet manage to stick around. Is it really far fetched for a soccer team in Hamilton or Winnipeg to draw 5,000 fans a game in cities of 800,000? It might be a tough sell to capture the interest of the casual fan but that's not what they need. They just need a small, dedicated fan base and fortunately for them, the culture of soccer may provide just that. Many people who follow the game don't care about the level, they'll support their local club. That's how it works in Europe and with promotion/relegation, the idea of a 'minor league' does not carry the same stigma. Especially when it potentially means facing off against MLS teams in the Canadian Championship.

Key to success will be owners like Bob Young, passionate individuals willing to take a small annual loss or are able to subsidize it via their other holdings (in Young's case, the Tiger-Cats) until such time as it is sustainable. That is in part why Toronto FC was such a success, after all. MLSE was able to throw their financial weight behind the team in a way other owners would not be able to. Again, I'm optimistic about this. If done right, I think it could work. If done right. It would be huge for Canadian soccer. We have always had no shortage of recreational soccer players especially at the youth level. Our problem has always been developing players to that next level and this league can hopefully help do that.

Poor analogies, junior players aren't paid and AHL is paid by a parent club. Not to mention all 3 leagues are much more geographically favorable to this doomed to fail Canadian league.

You are coming in with none of the major markets and way to spread out. Best case for Canada would have been trying to add a few more teams to USL, then as you slowly build, either break off on your own. Or have a Canadian division. It would be so much cheaper for a Quebec team to travel to the many NE USL teams than to the West Coast of Canada 4 times a year.

 

[thecoffeecake]

Montreal needed to give tickets away to get anybody to attend their academy team's games before they abandoned ship and linked up with Ottawa, and this 'top-tier' league is going to operate on a similar level of talent. They already aren't big enough to draw people to 2 teams and now they're potentially adding a third.

This has always been my big issue with this whole project, they want to establish a national league when half the country's urban population already has access to a far higher quality of product. Either they skip out on all of those already-existing markets which defeats the point of calling it 'national', or they try and directly compete in those markets and try to sell a league that'll likely be playing at a PDL level against MLS, NASL, and USL. As soon as TFC entered MLS it was too late for this project to make any sense.

Impact B and a CPL Montreal team are two different things, and trying to equate them shows you know nothing about soccer or hOw it's fan bases work. Impact B was a reserve team. It dOesn't matter what level a reserve team plays at, the interest isn't there. It's a feeder team with nothing to play for, no atmospheres to play in front of, no championshIps relevant to the fan base of the team to play for, no rivals, nothing. There's no reason for anyone but die hards of yhe parent club to go.

I'm going to say one thing loud and clear. Soccer support has NOTHING to do with the quality of the teams. Ask fans in Belgrade. Ask fans in Detroit. Ask fans of Leyton Orient. It's about fan experience and club culture. A CPL Montreal team would play in the top flight of a league, play in front of loud crowds, compete for CCL and Voyageurs Cup. Would they attract as many fans as the Impact? That's very unlikely, but to say Impact B is any indication of how they'd do is flat wrong.

If I'm the CPL, I'm dropping teams in downtown Toronto, Vancouver, and Montreal. Let them compete with the MLS clubs, carve away 20% of their fan bases, and attract plenty of new fans interested in seeing the game grow in Canada, and in seeing Canadian opponents every week. The cities are big enough for two clubs. And I don't think I need to remind Canadians how much your country's nationalist sentiment plays such a factor in so many things. The highest attended games in Canadian MLS are the games they play each other.

 

[Arizonan God]

Great. You need a domestic top flight league to do anything on the international stage.