One fans perspective

[Game suspension]

I completely agree on the bolded parts. Obviously, those are the hardest pieces to get and you'll be lucky to get more than one of those type of players unless you bottom out and are in the lottery for a couple years and even then, there are no guarantees. Soft rebuilds get you players like Schmaltz when you need players like a prime Toews to contend for a Cup.

Pretty much. What realistically do you think is the timeframe for the hawks to become contenders again?

Die hards like BK may stick around for the 5 plus years of a rebuild but I really don't think the rest of the fanbase is that loyal. When you are pinning your cup contending hopes on players who have never played in the NHL you know it is a stretch. Expect disappointment.

On the brighter side exhibition game tickets are now on sale !! Who doesn't want those?

 

[BK]

Pretty much. What realistically do you think is the timeframe for the hawks to become contenders again?

Die hards like BK may stick around for the 5 plus years of a rebuild but I really don't think the rest of the fanbase is that loyal. When you are pinning your cup contending hopes on players who have never played in the NHL you know it is a stretch. Expect disappointment.

On the brighter side exhibition game tickets are now on sale !! Who doesn't want those?

I mean if I have been a fan for all of my 34 years then why would I change now. Professional sports a cyclical and that is just how it is. We had a decade run of excellence and now there is could be another run in 2-3 years if the Hawks do this right and Toews can fix his issues.

 

[ClydeLee]

Over-valuing them in the context that I discussed a couple posts up.

Trading Schmaltz + #8 for those guys would have been a terrible move. There were discussions about trading the #8 for established top line dmen. I suggested adding to the 8th for someone such as Trouba, Hamilton, or Hanifin. Not pure rentals but enough term to give this core another shot. Several people were emphatic about keeping the pick and rebuilding with the young players. I would not have traded the #8 for Faulk.

I completely agree on the bolded parts. Obviously, those are the hardest pieces to get and you'll be lucky to get more than one of those type of players unless you bottom out and are in the lottery for a couple years and even then, there are no guarantees. Soft rebuilds get you players like Schmaltz when you need players like a prime Toews to contend for a Cup.

Am I getting this that you are claiming other people overvalue Schmatlz... yet you think schmaltz is the type of player a soft retool gets? Those dont seem to align. Schmaltz seems like a perfect fit type where he was drafted in the mid 15-25 1st round range. Thats not a limit by far from a retool talent get. Hes what a playoff team hitting on their first gets. A soft retool is what gets you into the 10 as the hawks were.

 

[x Tame Impala]

If this team is going to win another Cup then one of two things need to happen...

1) Toews and Kieth start performing at elite 1C/1D levels again

Or

2) Their replacements are drafted

The Hawks have a lot of good talent on the roster (despite last season's record). Toews, Saad, Anisimov, DBC, Hayden, Schmaltz, Kieth, Murphy, Rutta. I don't put a lot of weight into prospects but the Hawks seemingly have a lot of good talent in the pipeline as well.

But having good pieces isn't enough. Throughout our Cup years the difference between the Hawks and most other teams has always been the dynamic/game-changing players on our roster. Without that level of talent then we'll just be the Blues, Wild, Ducks, Sharks, etc...good but never good enough. No thanks to that. I want Cups, not playoff appearances.

 

[Kaners PPGs]

Am I getting this that you are claiming other people overvalue Schmatlz... yet you think schmaltz is the type of player a soft retool gets? Those dont seem to align. Schmaltz seems like a perfect fit type where he was drafted in the mid 15-25 1st round range. Thats not a limit by far from a retool talent get. Hes what a playoff team hitting on their first gets. A soft retool is what gets you into the 10 as the hawks were.

When I say a soft rebuild I just mean not a complete bottoming-out and getting top 5 picks. A soft rebuild or retool or whatever you want to call it will not give you as good of a chance of getting an elite star. Schmaltz is turning out to be an excellent pick for Bowman at 20 but he is not going to be an elite star.

 

[Kaners PPGs]

Pretty much. What realistically do you think is the timeframe for the hawks to become contenders again?

Die hards like BK may stick around for the 5 plus years of a rebuild but I really don't think the rest of the fanbase is that loyal. When you are pinning your cup contending hopes on players who have never played in the NHL you know it is a stretch. Expect disappointment.

On the brighter side exhibition game tickets are now on sale !! Who doesn't want those?

LOL There's going to be some empty seats this year.

I have no idea about the timeframe it is going to take for the Hawks to become legitimate contenders again. I have confidence in the Hawks' ability to find talent and they very nice job drafting. Even if they can amnesty Seabrook in a couple seasons they still would have 4 more season of Toews and Kane.

 

[Game suspension]

I have confidence in the Hawks' ability to find talent and they very nice job drafting. Even if they can amnesty Seabrook in a couple seasons they still would have 4 more season of Toews and Kane.

You don't want four more years of Kane? You must be in the blow it up crowd.

Personally I think the guy is the greatest clutch player to ever wear the Indian. After this year I think he is going to want out at all costs.

 

[BobbyJet]

I see Toews is currently rated outside the top 20 centers in the NHL, and falling it seems. Looking at the names ahead of him, they are hard to argue.

 

[clydesdale line]

Main board going crazy over Matthews at #4. Welcome to our world Leafs fans.

 

[ndgt10]

I see Toews is currently rated outside the top 20 centers in the NHL, and falling it seems. Looking at the names ahead of him, they are hard to argue.

Remarkable if you think about it. From elite to mediocre in a matter of a few years.

 

[featherhawk]

I see Toews is currently rated outside the top 20 centers in the NHL, and falling it seems. Looking at the names ahead of him, they are hard to argue.

if they continued the list I don't think we would see Toews name anytime soon after 20 either.

sad really, the guy went from elite/dominant to likely the most overpaid player in the league who is dangerously flirting with being average.

 

[crazyhawk]

I see Toews is currently rated outside the top 20 centers in the NHL, and falling it seems. Looking at the names ahead of him, they are hard to argue.

I don't see Toews too far behind the likes of Getzlaf who has also shown the effects of wear and tear. Karlsson and Barzal have had one good year as did Kopitar ( after some mediocrity ). Bergeron & Malkin will also be sliding soon enough.
I also see Draisatle above the #20 spot. Long story short ... these lists are very, very fluid.

 

[LordKOTL]

I don't see Toews too far behind the likes of Getzlaf who has also shown the effects of wear and tear. Karlsson and Barzal have had one good year as did Kopitar ( after some mediocrity ). Bergeron & Malkin will also be sliding soon enough.
I also see Draisatle above the #20 spot. Long story short ... these lists are very, very fluid.

Agreed. I can't argue that list and Toews not included...he's been milquetoast the past 3 seasons. That being said it if he does put 2 and 2 together and comes up with a number less than 23 it wouldn't be hard for him to climb back onto the list.

 

[Kaners PPGs]

You don't want four more years of Kane? You must be in the blow it up crowd.

Personally I think the guy is the greatest clutch player to ever wear the Indian. After this year I think he is going to want out at all costs.

I was in the "go-for-it" crowd because of the aging core. Besides, the only player that has real value is Kane so there is not much to blow up and trade for assets. It's just when you ask when will the Hawks realistically contend again I think it will be when this entire core is gone especially when we see that they didn't make moves to go for it this year. Sure, a 34 or 35-year old Kane at 10.5 M is not a detriment but I doubt he'd be a major reason why a team is winning a Cup.

 

[ColdSteel2]

I was in the "go-for-it" crowd because of the aging core. Besides, the only player that has real value is Kane so there is not much to blow up and trade for assets. It's just when you ask when will the Hawks realistically contend again I think it will be when this entire core is gone especially when we see that they didn't make moves to go for it this year. Sure, a 34 or 35-year old Kane at 10.5 M is not a detriment but I doubt he'd be a major reason why a team is winning a Cup.

I’d hope that he would. For me, I look at Kane as a better Martin St. Louis and expect a similar career arc. He scored 94 points in his 34/35 season. Kane is at the top of the new core for the next 7 years IMO.

 

[Kaners PPGs]

I’d hope that he would. For me, I look at Kane as a better Martin St. Louis and expect a similar career arc. He scored 94 points in his 34/35 season. Kane is at the top of the new core for the next 7 years IMO.

I hope you’re right. I’d definitely like to see that.

 

[BobbyJet]

I hope you’re right. I’d definitely like to see that.

I think Kaner has made a conscious effort to be the best he can. His salary signing did not make him complacent. In fact the opposite. Sure, he has his disinterested games in the RS but no player can play 100 percent every minute of a 82-game schedule.

 

[BK]

I think Kaner has made a conscious effort to be the best he can. His salary signing did not make him complacent. In fact the opposite. Sure, he has his disinterested games in the RS but no player can play 100 percent every minute of a 82-game schedule.

Kane in general seems to just love the game and playing.

 

[BobbyJet]

I hope you’re right. I’d definitely like to see that.

If anyone can play at a high level into his mid-thirties it's Kane.

 

[jaysoneil]

The only thing that would send Kane into decline in the next 5 years is illness/injury.

Point totals aside, he's gotten better each and every year in the league. Dude is in complete competition with himself.

 

[Pez68]

I’d hope that he would. For me, I look at Kane as a better Martin St. Louis and expect a similar career arc. He scored 94 points in his 34/35 season. Kane is at the top of the new core for the next 7 years IMO.

Yes.

Love of the game cannot be replaced by anything. Kane truly loves to play hockey, and is never satisfied with where he's at.

It's funny that early in their careers, people wanted Kane to be more like Toews. Now, all I can think is, I wish Toews was more like Kane. Funny how that works.

 

[Blue Liner]

Yes.

Love of the game cannot be replaced by anything. Kane truly loves to play hockey, and is never satisfied with where he's at.

It's funny that early in their careers, people wanted Kane to be more like Toews. Now, all I can think is, I wish Toews was more like Kane. Funny how that works.

Important distinction. For a superstar player who's accomplished as much as he has and could very easily just keep with the norm and still get by fine, he puts in a TON of work in the off-season. He is one of the best players in the world and he's still working countless hours every summer on the ice fine-tuning his game, working on new things, has outside people study his game film and work with him on improving things. His drive never ends, and it speaks a lot to his attitude that at this point in his career he still seeks and respects feedback from others on how he can improve himself.

 

[AmericanDream]

not to get too off-topic here, but if Kane stays a Hawk for the remainder of his contract, which all of us hope and believe he will, does anyone think he passes Bobby Hull for 2nd most points in the Indian Head?? I don't think he can pass Mikita unless he plays 8-9 more years averaging 70-85 points per season...that seems extremely unlikely in todays game.

 

[Robsker]

I see Toews is currently rated outside the top 20 centers in the NHL, and falling it seems. Looking at the names ahead of him, they are hard to argue.

Some of us see Toews now as just inside or perhaps just outside the top 100 players in the league. That is about right. Toews is performing along the lines of the #3 to #4 overall best player on a team (31 teams X 3.5 = a smidge above 100). Now, there are ca. 600 players in the league and so Toews is in the top 1/6 of the league and therefore is still a very good player. He is what he is. It is unlikely he makes a comeback and improves over his performance these past 3 seasons --- but it is possible. So... we have a solid guy in Toews --- but that is all. he is no longer a guy a team rallies around around. he is more now a good support piece. unfortunately the Hawks have only one real legit top-50 level guy in Kane (if Crow comes back and he plays like hos old self, we have 2). So... the Hawks no longer have top-tier talent --- and many holes to fill --- so, again, the Hawks are a bottom 6-8 team in the league on paper. We will see if they can arise above that. A returning Crow would help immensely (without him, the Hawks really cannot be expected to do much of anything beyond that 6-8 from the bottom level). And yes, there will be empty seats.

 

[Hawkaholic]

I'd have a really tough time naming 100 players I would rather have over Toews. I'd probably have a tough time naming 75.