Official Coyotes 2019-2020 Roster Discussion Thread #3

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Foggy1097

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Jan 14, 2014
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Well on the bright side, Brad Richardson might play tomorrow...he said with much sarcasm. That should do the trick. Why in God’s name they even want to play him in the first place is beyond me. It’s addition by subtraction when he’s out of the lineup. When Hayton is ready he needs to take his spot immediately.
 

XX

Waiting for Ishbia
Dec 10, 2002
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The OEL situation is right up there as possibly the most disappointing development thus far this season for me. His seemingly not bouncing back to even begin to approach his previous level has been pretty heartbreaking. A player that appeared a cornerstone building block for the team going forward, who now appears very very average.

Starting to wonder myself if the many nights of being ragdolled awkwardly into the boards only to have no teammates stand up for him has taken its toll in multiple ways.
 

RemoAZ

Let it burn
Mar 30, 2010
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Only trade that would make me happy is one that either sheds a salary like Stepan, OEL, Schmaltz, Goligoski, etc or adds some toughness. I about shit myself when Dvo knocked that guy away from him when he was in front of the net and scored. It shouldn't be shocking to see a Coyote do that.
 
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cobra427

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May 6, 2012
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Nope.

- One timer from the faceoff dot
- Uncovered roof job from nearly the same spot from a cross ice pass
- Quick shot off a cross ice pass

None of these favor the goalie in any way and Kuemper likely would not have fared any better. As long as the Coyotes continue to hand out quality scoring chances like candy, they'll lose.
I agree, team D, and our D men playing poorly is leading to a much higher GAA.
 

cobra427

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May 6, 2012
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Well on the bright side, Brad Richardson might play tomorrow...he said with much sarcasm. That should do the trick. Why in God’s name they even want to play him in the first place is beyond me. It’s addition by subtraction when he’s out of the lineup. When Hayton is ready he needs to take his spot immediately.
Disagree, Richardson will help us because of his D play, we need better team D and coverage.
 
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Jakey53

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Aug 27, 2011
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Starting to wonder myself if the many nights of being ragdolled awkwardly into the boards only to have no teammates stand up for him has taken its toll in multiple ways.
I'm thinking the same. OEL may have to change his game a bit.
 

PainForShane

formerly surfshop
Dec 24, 2019
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Watch the 1st goal, pausing frame by frame. Hill is tracking the puck just fine, but was probably shocked that a nothing special pass went through 3 of his defenders for a quality shot against:


It's worth doing a detailed breakdown of the first goal bc it's so, so strange, agree with Foggy that it's completely Hill's fault (you'll see why below). Agree with everyone that the 2nd and 3rd goals were not Hill's fault at all, and again for the record I do like Hill but once a game he does something like this and I honestly can't understand how or why. The play from Hill's viewpoint starts at 0:36 but the entire thing is less than a minute.

1) A play like this is very common -- pass from the half wall to someone in a better shooting position (in this case from the top of the circle). We all know plays like this happen 10 times per period and have seen 1000s of them
2) Hill is tracking the puck well with his eyes, there's no screen in front. So he sees the entire play develop and any goalie would expect a shot in this situation

3) In goalie school, they tell you to get square to the shooter and ideally be in the butterfly before the shot is taken, that way among other things there's no five hole for the shot to get through. In reality it doesn't work this way for multiple reasons (happy to discuss further) but the idea is that saves are much easier when you're already set (i.e., most vulnerable to goals against when you're moving). If you look starting at 8 seconds or so, you can see Hill going down and getting up while he's reading the play, basically if he thinks a shot will come he wants to already be set for it, but if he sees a pass he need to be on his feet to push of to wherever the shot is coming from and get set there. All goalies do this, now you know why

3b) To follow on from this point, in reality oftentimes the goalie gets in his butterfly as the shot is taken, that's one of the reasons we see so many 5 hole goals. On this goal, starting at ~0:36 you can see Hill's a half second late and still getting into the butterfly while the shot is already on its way toward him, therefore he gives himself no chance to make the save. Not only that, he's too deep in his crease and his angle is off so there's less of a chance the puck randomly hits him (xx pointed out correctly this is how most goalies make most saves, no reason for his angle to be off either because this is a normal play). If you freeze frame it, you can see the shot's not even well placed, if he was on his angle at the top of the crease it would've just hit his chest and been covered up.

So, basically it's a really really bad read and it cost us a goal...
what's weird is that this is the second play I've seen him make like this in only a handful of games. At this level you never see reads this bad -- the only other time I can remember seeing something similar is the VAN / BOS stanley cup final between Luongo and Thomas (the pumping tires one), where Luongo was terrible for entire games at a time.

But yeah -- Hill's a great goalie 95% of the time, but every once in a while he does something totally boneheaded like this, hard to make sense of because a read like this wouldn't be ok in the AHL or even a good college program
 
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Jakey53

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Aug 27, 2011
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Disagree, Richardson will help us because of his D play, we need better team D and coverage.
Richardson was brought back because of the year he had the previous year, our lack of strength at C and his PK. He won't be back next year.
 

hbk

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Capobianco recalled. Have we yet reached the point where if he plays in place of Ekman-Larsson the team has a better chance of winning?
It’s weird. Copiobianco has shown to be a very good D in the A but hasn’t shown much in his limited time in the nhl. I think the potential is there but we haven’t seen it.
 

Fuhrious

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Feb 3, 2004
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It’s weird. Copiobianco has shown to be a very good D in the A but hasn’t shown much in his limited time in the nhl. I think the potential is there but we haven’t seen it.
Was just thinking about that, actually. Wondering where his head was at, what with these bi-weekly callups only to never play. Decided to pull up his stats before commenting, and his 8 appearances this season have been pretty uninspiring...
 

lanky

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Was just thinking about that, actually. Wondering where his head was at, what with these bi-weekly callups only to never play. Decided to pull up his stats before commenting, and his 8 appearances this season have been pretty uninspiring...
He was paired with Bush when Bush was playing like garbage. Also, you're being critical of a rookie defenseman's first 8 (9) games in the NHL, which is just a silly thing to do.
 

Fuhrious

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Feb 3, 2004
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He was paired with Bush when Bush was playing like garbage. Also... 8 is not enough.
You're not wrong, but it's borne out time and time again that if you're a young player and demonstrate any growing pains, RT is going to send you to the press box faster than you can blink...which undoubtedly frustrates prospects (ie. Strome) and stunts their development.
 

TheLegend

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Capo's appearances came early in the season when he was just coming back from that knee injury. Could have influenced his mental play (ie not going 100%). But he ended up making the AHL All Star game and is 5-21-26 in 33 games in Tucson so far this year.
 
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cobra427

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May 6, 2012
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You're not wrong, but it's borne out time and time again that if you're a young player and demonstrate any growing pains, RT is going to send you to the press box faster than you can blink...which undoubtedly frustrates prospects (ie. Strome) and stunts their development.
Every fan base says that about every coach who sits young players in the press box, Tocc/Tip/torts/Q all the same complaints.
 

cobra427

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May 6, 2012
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Capobianco recalled. Have we yet reached the point where if he plays in place of Ekman-Larsson the team has a better chance of winning?
I bet he plays in place of Boosh/Osterle. Coyotes are desperate to be better on D as a team.
 

Fuhrious

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Feb 3, 2004
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Every fan base says that about every coach who sits young players in the press box, Tocc/Tip/torts/Q all the same complaints.
You're not wrong either...but then you have a relatively unheralded coach like Travis Green who seems to be the Prospect Whisperer, not only icing a roster full of impressive young talent but also getting a tune out of a player like Jake Virtanen who looked like a potential bust-in-the-making. I know which HC I'd rather have for the team I support...
 

Coyotedroppings

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Jul 16, 2017
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Nope.

- One timer from the faceoff dot
- Uncovered roof job from nearly the same spot from a cross ice pass
- Quick shot off a cross ice pass

None of these favor the goalie in any way and Kuemper likely would not have fared any better. As long as the Coyotes continue to hand out quality scoring chances like candy, they'll lose.
Agree EXCEPT goal one - Hill did not appear to be in the least bit ready. It was puzzling
 
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