Pre-Game Talk: nyrcar

WreckingCrew

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I still think you keep Pesce shelved unless Sami or TVR blows it.
Agreed, maybe if he's verging on ready and we're in a pivotal game (like game 7 of the finals), then there may be a push to get him in...but you have TVR/Edm/Fleury/Gardiner to fill in #5-6 slots (+ McKeown/Kaski/Bean potentially) which SHOULDN'T be a disaster bad enough to risk Pesce's well-being long term. If he is absolutely 100% no risk, bring him back when he's ready, if he's even 98%, just stick with the guys you've got unless it's dire. Or if you're up 3-0 in the finals and want to get him a Stanley Cup game dress 7 d-men just in case he's not feeling it partway in
 

TheReelChuckFletcher

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Agreed, maybe if he's verging on ready and we're in a pivotal game (like game 7 of the finals), then there may be a push to get him in...but you have TVR/Edm/Fleury/Gardiner to fill in #5-6 slots (+ McKeown/Kaski/Bean potentially) which SHOULDN'T be a disaster bad enough to risk Pesce's well-being long term. If he is absolutely 100% no risk, bring him back when he's ready, if he's even 98%, just stick with the guys you've got unless it's dire. Or if you're up 3-0 in the finals and want to get him a Stanley Cup game dress 7 d-men just in case he's not feeling it partway in

I'm simply worried about the Rangers. I'm not saying that TVR/Eddy/Fleury are scrubs, it's just that when Breadman and Zibanejad are roaming around the left and right circles, you need your best soldiers to beat that curse.
 

Blueline Bomber

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My interpretation is that no, we have not made it. If we don't win our play-in vs. the Rangers, we are eligible to win the draft lottery. That doesn't say "in the playoffs" to me.

That's what I was thinking as well, but the NHL Twitter keeps mentioning "postseason play", so I think we're technically in.
 
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MinJaBen

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He'd have to be ready ready and not about ready for me to feel comfortable with his return in such a short series. One game with 5 defenders because he has a setback in the 1st period is not something I'd like to see against the Rangers top six forwards.
 

TheReelChuckFletcher

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This is the defensive lineup that I hope is iced if Pesce is actually ready:

Skjei-Hamilton
Gardiner-Pesce
Slavin-Vatanen

Three solid first-pairings of three elite guys (Hamilton, Pesce, Slavin) paired with solid support-cast guys (Skjei, Gardiner, Vatanen) on each respective pair. Beyond scary.
 

Big Daddy Cane

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We shouldn’t let anyone counted on for offense to be with Staal, who’s much more effective as a number 3. Even if Trocheck hasn’t found his way he plays a more offensive game. Seeing Staal with two offensive players in your lineup gave me a sad.

Brind'Amour doesn't have to count on offense from the 3rd wheel on that line. Staal would be there to do the dirty work that supports the skill players (backcheck, be heavy on the cycle, win faceoffs, etc.) A worker bee type is part of a traditional line structure. While Staal's overall stat line is a bit weak, he did get back to where you expect his mean to be with 20 points in the 41 games from December onwards (Link).
 

Nikishin Go Boom

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This is the defensive lineup that I hope is iced if Pesce is actually ready:

Skjei-Hamilton
Gardiner-Pesce
Slavin-Vatanen

Three solid first-pairings of three elite guys (Hamilton, Pesce, Slavin) paired with solid support-cast guys (Skjei, Gardiner, Vatanen) on each respective pair. Beyond scary.
Good lord, Skjei over Slavin?!?! Please stop
 

TheReelChuckFletcher

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Good lord, Skjei over Slavin?!?! Please stop

Each pairing should get 20 minutes of ice-time on average, and I think Skjei would be a great fit with Hamilton against NY, especially if the goal is to drive more even-strength and PP offense against the Rangers' elite goaltending. To me, if you can't beat them in terms of SH%, beat them in terms of shot volume. After the series, then go back to the traditional Slavin-Hamilton pair against a team that is better at puck possession than the Rangers are (whom rank among the league's worst possession teams).
 

Nikishin Go Boom

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Each pairing should get 20 minutes of ice-time on average, and I think Skjei would be a great fit with Hamilton, especially if the goal is to drive more even-strength and PP offense against the Rangers' elite goaltending.
Skjei isn’t even close of a fit for Hamilton. The guy cant even clear a puck in his own zone. How is Hamilton going to transition to offense with Skjei?

Skjei is the non scoring lefty version of Faulk. Lets not shoot ourselves in the foot by putting him on the top pairing.
 

TheReelChuckFletcher

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Skjei isn’t even close of a fit for Hamilton. The guy cant even clear a puck in his own zone. How is Hamilton going to transition to offense with Skjei?

Skjei is the non scoring lefty version of Faulk. Lets not shoot ourselves in the foot by putting him on the top pairing.

That was his first shift here LMAO! I didn't see this issue as much in the other games that I saw him, albeit a small sample size. He's certainly got the great skating chops to keep up with the play, though. I will say that a full training camp will get the pairings sorted out before the playoffs, so I'm not too concerned about whom will play and in what pairing.
 

Big Daddy Cane

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This is the defensive lineup that I hope is iced if Pesce is actually ready:

Skjei-Hamilton
Gardiner-Pesce
Slavin-Vatanen

Three solid first-pairings of three elite guys (Hamilton, Pesce, Slavin) paired with solid support-cast guys (Skjei, Gardiner, Vatanen) on each respective pair. Beyond scary.

Say what you want about whether Gardiner is in a healthy lineup, but if he is, I feel pretty confident in saying he's not going to be on that 2nd pairing. The whole point of being in the market for a LHD, even predating Hamilton's injury, was dissatisfaction with Gardiner in that exact spot.
 

TheReelChuckFletcher

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Say what you want about whether Gardiner is in a healthy lineup, but if he is, I feel pretty confident in saying he's not going to be on that 2nd pairing. The whole point of being in the market for a LHD, even predating Hamilton's injury, was dissatisfaction with Gardiner in that exact spot.

They slowly moved away from trying to acquire an LHD by the time that Gardiner's numbers started to improve by January (the original target being Brodin), which is why the trade rumors quieted down around early February and you started hearing more about Edmundson potentially being a trade chip. They pulled the trigger on Skjei and Vatanen when both Dougie AND Pesce were deemed out long-term. Two completely different circumstances.
 
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Canes

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This is the defensive lineup that I hope is iced if Pesce is actually ready:

Skjei-Hamilton
Gardiner-Pesce
Slavin-Vatanen

Three solid first-pairings of three elite guys (Hamilton, Pesce, Slavin) paired with solid support-cast guys (Skjei, Gardiner, Vatanen) on each respective pair. Beyond scary.
Beyond scary because that top 4 would give up 5 goals a game.
 

TheReelChuckFletcher

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Beyond scary because that top 4 would give up 5 goals a game.

Not against the Rangers. This is not a club that is well-known for being great at puck possession. Their bottom 6 is, analytically-speaking, one of the worst in hockey. My thinking process is to go back to a more traditional pairing setup against a more Corsi-oriented club.
 

Canes

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Not against the Rangers. This is not a club that is well-known for being great at puck possession.
Have you watched our games with them? The game is not played on a spreadsheet. Do you really think we would play Slavin on the 3rd pairing over guys like Skjei and Gardiner? Are you trolling us or do you actually believe some of the shit you write?
 

TheReelChuckFletcher

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Have you watched our games with them? The game is not played on a spreadsheet. Do you really think we would play Slavin on the 3rd pairing over guys like Skjei and Gardiner? Are you trolling us or do you actually believe some of the shit you write?

Hockey is played on the ice and read on a spreadsheet. Spreadsheets are not un-important pieces of data, and you can't simply ignore it in favor of the eye test. Yes, I have watched our games against them and I have read the stat sheet. We took an obscene amount of shots on their goaltending nearly every single game. We need more of that because against that trio of doom, you need to produce even greater shot volume to outbeat their insane SV% vs. our club. I'm not trolling one single iota; I generally believe the majority of things that I write. My view is that you need to set the pairings for maximum puck control on every single line against a bad possession club like the Rangers are. The elite-to-very good possession players (Hamilton, Slavin, Gardiner) should each be paired with a partner that isn't as good in that particular department (Pesce, Skjei, Vatanen), as both a shelter and as a stabilizing force. Now's not the time to play it safe, in my opinion. Also, Slavin-Vatanen is not a 3rd pairing and are not going to play 3rd pairing minutes. I had it specifically set up as a 1A/1B/1C type of lineup, where each got nearly equal 5-on-5 minutes. The elite guys differentiate their minutes via special teams.
 
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emptyNedder

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Niederreiter - Aho - Williams
Svechnikov - Staal - Teravainen
Foegele - Trocheck - Necas
McGinn - Geekie/Martinook - Martinook/Dzingel

Geekie was in the process of saving the season—if the Canes lose the last two games before the pause things look entirely different. Trocheck on the other hand scored 1g/1a in 7 games. Since this whole play-in/playoff is an experiment, no better time to try:

Svech/Aho/Teravainen
Niederreiter/Geekie/Necas
Dzingel/Trocheck/Williams
Foegele or McGinn/Staal/Martinook

The fourth line can be the top defensive line. Lines 2 and 3 can be used to cause matchup problems.

As for the D: for sh** sake keep Slavin/Hamilton, and don't risk Pesce's future.
 

Big Daddy Cane

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They slowly moved away from trying to acquire an LHD by the time that Gardiner's numbers started to improve by January (the original target being Brodin), which is why the trade rumors quieted down around early February and you started hearing more about Edmundson potentially being a trade chip. They pulled the trigger on Skjei and Vatanen when both Dougie AND Pesce were deemed out long-term. Two completely different circumstances.

Yet, McKenzie reported that they were interested in Martinez, a LHD with an extra year of term, in the middle of February (Link). Dillon was also linked to the Canes earlier that month (Link). Dumba was targeted as well, which probably would have resulted in Pesce moving back to the left when Hamilton got healthy this season or next (Link). Eventually, they traded for a LHD with several years of term left outside of a buy-low. While the injuries assuredly played a role, I see a pattern there.
 

spockBokk

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Had this crazy thought for the D:

Slavin-Vatanen
Fleury-Hamilton
Skjei-TVR

I think “right before the pause” Fleury would be a good fit with Hamilton, and if you get “playoff” TVR, he and Skjei should work well together. Slavin could be a safety net for Vatanen, assuming they’re going to play Vatanen 20mins a night.

But of course, Hamilton will end up with Slavin and Edmunson will most certainly play over Fleury. I don’t think Pesce playing in the playoffs this year is realistic, unless the Canes go on another run. I really think the wildcard is Vatanen. Having another heathy, puck-moving RD along with Hamilton should really solve some of the issues they had when both Hamilton and Pesce were out.

And I totally left out Gardiner...
 

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