Proposal: NYR / Tor

[DoobieDubas]

Leafs wouldn't trade for DeAngelo if it would cure cancer.

I'm not overly familiar with Pionk but I do know a lot of people I listen to/read like him.
I would hate to give up Kapanen though.

Agreed.

 

[NYR713]

I’d do Deangelo but not Pionk

Agreed. I'm in for TDA for Kap. Call it in.

 

[HawkeyTalkMan]

Kapanen >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Deangelo

How is that even close to even swap?

give kapanen more than a cup of coffee at the NHL level before you start downgrading him to swaps with Deangelo

Deangelo seems to progressively slip more into "meh" status since Tampa traded him

Kapanen has essentially been a PPG player in the AHL the last two years

 

[Albus Dumbledore]

man are people misinformed about kappy, its like they have no idea what they are talking about...
id pass as a leafs fan for either of these dmen, not saying either are bad just rather keep our guy.

 

[One Winged Angel]

I don't think either side does this. Pionk is too important to the Rangers right now and has shown a lot of promise in a really bad situation and Kapanen I think will be needed in Toronto with the potential cap dangers they'll face, they'll need young talent on ELC's.

Value wise, I don't see the value being too far off, I actually think it's pretty fair, the fits just aren't right for either team.

 

[Cotton]

No thanks, would rather keep Kapanen.

 

[Cotton]

Do people outside of leaf fans not realize how valuable a player like kapanen is, with his 19 points a season pace. Anyone who gets sent to the minors in place of 21st oa drafted Freddy gauthier...has to be a gem.

Hmm, I don't think you got that one right, see Gauthier is a C and Kapanen is a RW. Gauthier wouldn't be taking Kapanen's spot.

 

[DoobieDubas]

Leaf fans dont sleep on Pionk.


With that said...

Definitely dont sleep on our boy happykappy. Just a friggen speed demon and boy does speed kill.

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

Stionk*

 

[HawkeyTalkMan]

Stionk*

Absolutely ethered the rangers fans there

 

[tradenashnow]

Wake me when Toronto actually has a defenseman core that can stop other teams. Not sure what Pionk will become. However, I do know that I don't want to trade him for a Kapanen type. Not worth it.

 

[Voodoo Child]

DeAngelo? DeAbsolutelynot.

Pionk intrigues me, but not at the expense of Kapanen.

 

[Nizdizzle]

Wake me when Toronto actually has a defenseman core that can stop other teams. Not sure what Pionk will become. However, I do know that I don't want to trade him for a Kapanen type. Not worth it.

As opposed to the Rangers who gave up the 4th most goals in the league last year (Leafs gave up 11th fewest btw) with a supposed elite goaltender... Pionk would at best be a 3rd pairing guy for us.

Tossing stones in glass houses, yada, yada...

 

[Gary Nylund]

As opposed to the Rangers who gave up the 4th most goals in the league last year (Leafs gave up 11th fewest btw) with a supposed elite goaltender... Pionk would at best be a 3rd pairing guy for us.

Tossing stones in glass houses, yada, yada...

I love how people love to talk about how dumb Toronto fans are while talking as if our D was AHL level. It's almost as if the only hockey knowledge these people have comes from reading this board.

 

[Drytoast]

DeAngelo or Pionk for Kapanen . Leafs looking for RD and rangers seeking RH forward , win /win

No

 

[lifelonghockeyfan]

Yea, the Leafs would like to improve their RHD. But actually it's solid with Zaitsev (he better return to his first year form with that contract) and Hainsey. It's the other spot....with Carrick, Holl and Ozhignokov that is the question mark. Leafs are crossing their figures one these guys can do the job. Or the option is having Dermot moving to the right side and Borgman/Rosen plays the left side.
But I am amazed at so many of these trades where the Leafs HAVE to take another teams 6th/7th/8th Dman and folks think it's an improvement on what the Leafs already have.
Leafs might be interested in trading for a guaranteed competent RHD but not trading for other teams questionable NHL competent Dmen.

 

[The S5]

As opposed to the Rangers who gave up the 4th most goals in the league last year (Leafs gave up 11th fewest btw) with a supposed elite goaltender... Pionk would at best be a 3rd pairing guy for us.

Tossing stones in glass houses, yada, yada...

There aren't too many Ranger fans left who think Hank is "elite".
Do Leafs fans even think before they post? The Rangers tore it down last season. It was clear that the roster they had wasn't going to get it done going forward, so they decided to rebuild, something Leaf fans should be intimately familiar with.
FWIW, Pionk is a very promising young D, but unproven. It wouldn't be fair, at this stage, to state where he would fit in on the Leafs, but one thing is certain, there may be one Leafs D man who Pionk doesn't have a chance to surpass.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Yea, the Leafs would like to improve their RHD. But actually it's solid with Zaitsev (he better return to his first year form with that contract) and Hainsey. It's the other spot....with Carrick, Holl and Ozhignokov that is the question mark. Leafs are crossing their figures one these guys can do the job. Or the option is having Dermot moving to the right side and Borgman/Rosen plays the left side.
But I am amazed at so many of these trades where the Leafs HAVE to take another teams 6th/7th/8th Dman and folks think it's an improvement on what the Leafs already have.
Leafs might be interested in trading for a guaranteed competent RHD but not trading for other teams questionable NHL competent Dmen.

This.

There aren't too many Ranger fans left who think Hank is "elite".
Do Leafs fans even think before they post? The Rangers tore it down last season. It was clear that the roster they had wasn't going to get it done going forward, so they decided to rebuild, something Leaf fans should be intimately familiar with.
FWIW, Pionk is a very promising young D, but unproven. It wouldn't be fair, at this stage, to state where he would fit in on the Leafs, but one thing is certain, there may be one Leafs D man who Pionk doesn't have a chance to surpass.

Finally, you got something right. Though considering the kid has played less than 30 games in the NHL, this is so obvious that it would be almost impossible to get it wrong.

[mod]

 

[bernmeister]

No.

Rangers thin at RD, but mo importantly, better served by keeping Pionk/DeAngelo and allowing their (production) value to increase as they continue to improve, which = improving their slotting as second pair guys, which = if you trade them down the road because other opportunities present themselves... UNLESS they are strategic adds in a bigger deal, and you get adequately good or better value at min now for either.

Kap is not that.

 

[TGWL]

honest question, what do Rangers fans think Pionk is going to be and what is his upside?

It was a small sample size. Before the season started I would have said my hope is he becomes a solid #5 Defensemen, but he looked impressive during his late season call up. Pionk showed that he could be a lot more than a bottom pairing guy. He's got good vision and will give 100% every shift. The problem came with his positioning, but maybe he just had a lot more faith in Marc Staal than everybody else. He will battle all the time, unfortunately he's not the strongest guy to win most of those battles on the boards.

 

[bernmeister]

It was a small sample size. Before the season started I would have said my hope is he becomes a solid #5 Defensemen, but he looked impressive during his late season call up. Pionk showed that he could be a lot more than a bottom pairing guy. He's got good vision and will give 100% every shift. The problem came with his positioning, but maybe he just had a lot more faith in Marc Staal than everybody else. He will battle all the time, unfortunately he's not the strongest guy to win most of those battles on the boards.

Concur.
He's not soft, just not a made of iron type, but that can be improved with targeted conditioning, me thinks. Tough enough, but not built to dominate.

Kind of guy who does everything acceptably well at minimum, but not great. That is my current impression. Does have smarts, further but not extended upside.

 

[Byron Bitz]

Id rather hang onto Kapanen, I think hel have a great year on Kadri’s wing.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

But actually it's solid with Zaitsev (he better return to his first year form with that contract) and Hainsey.

I wonder why we post so many trade proposals for RHD then? I wish our solid RHD were actually a little more solid.

 

[slg1963]

Yea, the Leafs would like to improve their RHD. But actually it's solid with Zaitsev (he better return to his first year form with that contract) and Hainsey. It's the other spot....with Carrick, Holl and Ozhignokov that is the question mark. Leafs are crossing their figures one these guys can do the job. Or the option is having Dermot moving to the right side and Borgman/Rosen plays the left side.
But I am amazed at so many of these trades where the Leafs HAVE to take another teams 6th/7th/8th Dman and folks think it's an improvement on what the Leafs already have.
Leafs might be interested in trading for a guaranteed competent RHD but not trading for other teams questionable NHL competent Dmen.

But yet we see so many Leaf proposals eg. Parayko, Trouba, Ekman Larsson,Karlsson, Carlo ,Nurse the list goes on . Leafs fans want the stars but are unwilling to give up anything but your scraps. I believed this to be a fair trade and not a one sided trade senario from some Leaf fans .

 

[Randy Randerson]

It was a small sample size. Before the season started I would have said my hope is he becomes a solid #5 Defensemen, but he looked impressive during his late season call up. Pionk showed that he could be a lot more than a bottom pairing guy. He's got good vision and will give 100% every shift. The problem came with his positioning, but maybe he just had a lot more faith in Marc Staal than everybody else. He will battle all the time, unfortunately he's not the strongest guy to win most of those battles on the boards.

the underlying stats at the NHL level are really concerning, but that could be a result of sample size and the Rangers mailing it in when he was playing could skew some things

but stylistically it doesn't sound like the right fit for the Leafs even if he turns out, we have lots of offense from the back end and need more of a prime Marc Staal type. I don't think Pionk has the upside to be the guy that "fixes" the Leafs back end, we really need a top pairing RHD to take our defense from bottom half to solid, so if we're looking at bandaid type players I'd rather go for someone who is a good shot suppressor and can play against good competition - Tanev, Petry etc

But yet we see so many Leaf proposals eg. Parayko, Trouba, Ekman Larsson,Karlsson, Carlo ,Nurse the list goes on . Leafs fans want the stars but are unwilling to give up anything but your scraps. I believed this to be a fair trade and not a one sided trade senario from some Leaf fans .

value in this one seems slanted to the Rangers imo. Everyone wants to judge Kapanen on his small NHL body of work and only want to look at box scores without context (less than 12 mins a night, very defensive usage with primarily 4th line linemates) but are turning a blind eye to all of the other value indicators on him: draft pedigree, hugely positive indicators for offense when given scoring line time in the AHL, extremely high floor because of elite wheels and willingness to play defense. His brain may never keep up to his legs and hands, but even if that happens he's probably Grabner with Hagelin type defense - he can create odd man rushes and breakaways at anomalous rates with his legs, and he's got the shot and hands to finish those at a reasonable clip, Grabner's made a good career on that

Pionk has a high chance of not being an NHL'er at all, DeAngelo is a decent player but his off ice/attitude stuff makes him less desirable to acquire