Proposal: Nylander+gardiner for Pesce and faulk?.

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sparxx87

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Jan 5, 2010
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Faulk is significantly better defensively and manages to be a strong rel possession player despite playing on an elite possession team. Meanwhile the Gardiner-Zaitsev pair has been a nightmare on ice this season. Some of that has to be attributed to Zaitsev not looking NHL level, but Faulk is much better at carrying a pair than Gardiner is. To me Faulk is a solid #2 and Gardiner is a pretty good #3.
Zaitsev not looking NHL level? That’s terribly untrue. From a good few games to close out the Bruins series and a healthy summer, Nikita Zaitsev is back playing how he did in his first year and probably even better. He’s a legitimate top 4 d man... your opinion of him is inaccurate.

Always a place for guys with a good pulse on the game that do all the little things to have positive effect on the play... things that’ll get missed by the casual fan who evaluates with charts and graphs.
 
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VoluntaryDom

Formerly DominicBoltsFan / Ⓐ / ✞
Oct 31, 2016
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Zaitsev not looking NHL level? That’s terribly untrue. From a good few games to close out the Bruins series and a healthy summer, Nikita Zaitsev is back playing how he did in his first year and probably even better. He’s a legitimate top 4 d man... your opinion of him is inaccurate.

Always a place for guys with a good pulse on the game that do all the little things to have positive effect on the play... things that’ll get missed by the casual fan who evaluates with charts and graphs.
No, zaitsev still looks as slow and useless as last year
 

Baksfamous112

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Jul 21, 2016
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Zaitsev not looking NHL level? That’s terribly untrue. From a good few games to close out the Bruins series and a healthy summer, Nikita Zaitsev is back playing how he did in his first year and probably even better. He’s a legitimate top 4 d man... your opinion of him is inaccurate.

Always a place for guys with a good pulse on the game that do all the little things to have positive effect on the play... things that’ll get missed by the casual fan who evaluates with charts and graphs.

Zaitsev is barely NHL level even this season. Leafs gambled on him and it backfired. They need a creative way to move this contract otherwise that contract will kill their D salary structure for years to come
 

Patagonia

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Jan 6, 2017
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Take out Gardiner and you might have a deal.

Nylander does not have that much value being a Winger and Contract demands of $8M+ per year.

There is no chance you combine both Nylander + Gardiner to get either CAR player individually, both is a joke.
 
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Brobust

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Sep 29, 2017
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If I'm offering Nylander + Gardiner, especially if Gardiner is willing to extend, I'd be asking for Necas + Pesce.
 

sparxx87

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Jan 5, 2010
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No, zaitsev still looks as slow and useless as last year
You don’t know what you’re looking at.
Zaitsev is barely NHL level even this season. Leafs gambled on him and it backfired. They need a creative way to move this contract otherwise that contract will kill their D salary structure for years to come
4.5m on a cap that will continue to inflate is a pretty reasonable number for what he brings, and I’m confident Mike Babcock would agree.

Subtle little plays that often go unnoticed by many are what’s really endeared him to Babcock. I’m seeing these things again, much like his rookie year... Problem last year was injury. He never found his rhythm and was playing catch up all year, a half second slow in reaction and decision making.

That hasn’t been the case this year. Just watch.
 

Baksfamous112

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Jul 21, 2016
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You don’t know what you’re looking at.

4.5m on a cap that will continue to inflate is a pretty reasonable number for what he brings, and I’m confident Mike Babcock would agree.

Subtle little plays that often go unnoticed by many are what’s really endeared him to Babcock. I’m seeing these things again, much like his rookie year... Problem last year was injury. He never found his rhythm and was playing catch up all year, a half second slow in reaction and decision making.

That hasn’t been the case this year. Just watch.

That’s a biased opinion. His decision making with the puck are horrendous. His stick work is meh and his positioning is off most of the time. If he wasn’t riding a 4.5M contract over the next 6 years he would have been waived by now.
 

slimbob8

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Aug 11, 2016
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Zaitsev is barely NHL level even this season. Leafs gambled on him and it backfired. They need a creative way to move this contract otherwise that contract will kill their D salary structure for years to come

So that's why Babcock has been trusting Zaitsev enough this season to lead the entire team in ice time? He'd really do that for a guy that is barely NHL level? It's ok to hate the Leafs which is very apparent you do judging by most of your posts, but at least try to be a little objective about it if you're gonna write nonsense like this.
 
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Baksfamous112

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Jul 21, 2016
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So that's why Babcock has been trusting Zaitsev enough this season to lead the entire team in ice time? He'd really do that for a guy that is barely NHL level? It's ok to hate the Leafs which is very apparent you do judging by most of your posts, but at least try to be a little objective about it if you're gonna write nonsense like this.

Because he’s got no one else to rely on on the right side.
 

Ziggdiezan

Registered User
Apr 10, 2015
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Faulk is significantly better defensively and manages to be a strong rel possession player despite playing on an elite possession team. Meanwhile the Gardiner-Zaitsev pair has been a nightmare on ice this season. Some of that has to be attributed to Zaitsev not looking NHL level, but Faulk is much better at carrying a pair than Gardiner is. To me Faulk is a solid #2 and Gardiner is a pretty good #3.
Have you looked and seen how Gardiner+Zaitsev are leading the league in TOI at ES while playing around 60% of their starts in the defensive zone. All the other defenders are around 40% defensive starts on the leafs.

That may contribute to their relative Corsi stats just a little bit lol.

Faulk is playing around 40% defensive zone starts as well with teammates like Hamilton and Slavin playing around 50%.

Gardiner has carried a pairing his entire NHL career and just put up 50+ and 40+ points.. he is certainly a better player than Faulk the past 2 years.
 

sparxx87

Don Quixote
Jan 5, 2010
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That’s a biased opinion. His decision making with the puck are horrendous. His stick work is meh and his positioning is off most of the time. If he wasn’t riding a 4.5M contract over the next 6 years he would have been waived by now.
Not really. I’m pretty impartial to Zaitsev.. I like him when he plays well, but if he isn’t/wasn’t, I wouldn’t be torn up to see him go.

Again, put down the graphs and colourful charts. Zaitsev is a solid top 4 defenseman that can do a little bit of everything.
 

GoldiFox

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Apr 21, 2014
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Well. then this goes no where. Toronto's asking price from the rumors Iv seen would more than likely be Pesce.
and didnt the Canes just trade Skinner for a mid tier prospect? Cliff Pu...... so how is Nylander for Pesce unreasonable.

Skinner has a full NMC and would only accept a trade to Buffalo or Toronto. He had 1 year left on his deal and his coach considered his subtraction an addition.

Pesce has no NTC/NMC and is signed for 6 years on a steal of a deal.
 
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Arthur Morgan

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I would do Nylander for Pesce. I think he would look great in the blue and white. I believe it would be a fair trade. maybe Toronto would have to add something small. pretty close in value already.

I like how the leafs have been Defensively over the past few games. can still use improvement. if we can get Nylander signed to a fair deal and stay true to not trading him. I'm sure we can find a lesser big name RHD player at a cheaper cost.

Leafs looks good enough to make playoffs already. just stay patient and wait for the right deal. hopefully we improve by trade deadline
 

Arthur Morgan

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Skinner has a full NMC and would only accept a trade to Buffalo or Toronto. He had 1 year left on his deal and his coach considered his subtraction an addition.

Pesce has no NTC/NMC and is signed for 6 years on a steal of a deal.
Yes I am aware. they still got fleeced for Skinner..... Dont sit there and think it was best for the team. Skinner is a great player and is worth more than Cliff Pu....

Pesce is on a great contract but if u want a player like Nylander its going to cost you and Fault isn't going to cut it.
 

CheMxDawG

Registered User
Jan 26, 2017
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Well. then this goes no where. Toronto's asking price from the rumors Iv seen would more than likely be Pesce.
and didnt the Canes just trade Skinner for a mid tier prospect? Cliff Pu...... so how is Nylander for Pesce unreasonable.

It's not unreasonable, there's just no need to move Pesce with definite value for Nylander with indefinite value at the moment.
 

WreckingCrew

Registered User
Feb 4, 2015
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Well. then this goes no where. Toronto's asking price from the rumors Iv seen would more than likely be Pesce.
and didnt the Canes just trade Skinner for a mid tier prospect? Cliff Pu...... so how is Nylander for Pesce unreasonable.
Wait...what? What does the Skinner trade have to do with Nylander's (or Pesce's) value? If anything using that as a comparison lowers Nylanders value. And, as Canes fans have been trying to say, Pesce <> Nylander is probably a pretty even hockey trade swap...BUT Pesce's locked up on a great contract and Nylander isn't, so from our perspective it makes little sense.
 
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Martin Skoula

Registered User
Oct 18, 2017
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Faulk is significantly better defensively and manages to be a strong rel possession player despite playing on an elite possession team. Meanwhile the Gardiner-Zaitsev pair has been a nightmare on ice this season. Some of that has to be attributed to Zaitsev not looking NHL level, but Faulk is much better at carrying a pair than Gardiner is. To me Faulk is a solid #2 and Gardiner is a pretty good #3.

Faulk is not a solid #2, Faulk is liquid #2. Might be the only defenseman in the league that plays serious minutes who I'd trust less than Gardiner defensively. If he didn't have a big slap shot he'd be a bottom pairing tweener.
 
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