FisherKing
Registered User
Only for the mockery.
True. Not a lot of innate wisdom there.
Only for the mockery.
If Carbonneau once said "I have no idea what to do anymore...." Can't believe what he'd be saying now...
That's fine. But don't tell me that Therrien was the best we could do last time around. That's what I took issue with.I'll make it clear, I'm not on the pro-French bandwagon. I wasn't happy when we hired MT and I hated it for a long time. I just think given who is available it's going to be a French coach regardless so I'll save my breath this time.
You said he was the best coach availble. And to that I say... no way. He wasn't in demand for a reason. He sucks.When did I say he was a hot property? All I said is he didn't go work in Switzerland or the AHL or whatever because he didn't think he needed to.
Over Therrien? I'll take Demers every day and twice on Sunday. He's a million times better. I'll take half the posters on this board over Therrien.No to Jacques Demers, please.
I'm neutral towards Boucher. I don't know enough about him.As for Boucher, he's already been in organization so he has an inside track IMO. I'm just wondering who you'd like...that isn't already hired obviously. I didn't know that people ripped on Boucher actually, I thought he was generally liked or didn't have enough time to be disliked.
That's fine. But don't tell me that Therrien was the best we could do last time around. That's what I took issue with.
- 5 point negative difference in possession numbers everywhere he's gone.
- Has eventual cup winning Pens out of playoff and bottom third everywhere including 30th in shots when he's fired. That team wins cup without him and goes top ten everywhere after he leaves.
- Is unable to get his teams to the playoffs without stellar goaltending
- Bottom third across the board with chip and chase nonsense over the past few years
- Consistent usage of inferior players over better ones. Yes, this happens with other coaches but not to this degree and not on the first line.
- Poor developer of talent
You said he was the best coach availble. And to that I say... no way. He wasn't in demand for a reason. He sucks.
That doesn't mean that any coach who leaves and comes back sucks but it does in his case. It's incredible how some of the most incompetent people in the world manage to fail upwards and MT is a classic example of this. I have no idea how he has any kind of career related to hockey that doesn't involve being some kind of angry mascot.
Over Therrien? I'll take Demers every day and twice on Sunday. He's a million times better. I'll take half the posters on this board over Therrien.
I'm neutral towards Boucher. I don't know enough about him.
The "trapping" style that he employed concerns me but many here said he had no choice with that lineup. I just would prefer a 'players' coach right now because after four years of MT the guys could use a break, not another hardass. And based on what little I know of Boucher he's more of a hardass so that gives me some concern. I'm sure he'd be a million times better than Therrien and I don't want anything to do with Roy so... if we have to select from this tiny pool then I guess he's the best of a horrible lot.
Hitchcock would be far more interesting in my opinion. He might be too cerebral though. Apparently the Blues players aren't big fans of his. He seems to be a very good systems guy though so who knows? I've always liked his results.
Didnt he have Vinny, st louis and Stamkos ?? He would really have to trap with the habs lineup.
People need to stop worrying about the French coach issue right now.
At the time, MT was best coach available. No...they weren't going to fire him for Babcock...no one does that.
Now...it's probably Boucher.
Coincidence? Absolutely but I really don't think this is the argument we should be having now because it would yield Boucher in the end anyway.
Regardless of what you feel about MT the next best coach now is Boucher right? So having the French debate now is extremely pointless.
Not to mention being out of the game when you're a vet coach is very common. When MT lost his first job he went back to the AHL. When Boucher lost his first job he went to Switzerland. Trust me, when Boucher gets another NHL gig and eventually gets fired(they all do, nothing against Guy) he won't go back to the AHL or Switzerland. He'll just sit back and wait for an offer like MT did. Same applies to any young coach.
I would fully support it. I'm telling put Carbo in for the remaining of the season. At least it would be new ideas. At least we wouldn't have DD on the first line.
What if the players respond well to him and we potentially lose the ability to draft in the top 5? That would be a complete disaster. I say keep Therrien behind that bench and lets go 2-28 to end the year, rispek da plan!!!!
That's fine. But don't tell me that Therrien was the best we could do last time around. That's what I took issue with.
- 5 point negative difference in possession numbers everywhere he's gone.
- Has eventual cup winning Pens out of playoff and bottom third everywhere including 30th in shots when he's fired. That team wins cup without him and goes top ten everywhere after he leaves.
- Is unable to get his teams to the playoffs without stellar goaltending
- Bottom third across the board with chip and chase nonsense over the past few years
- Consistent usage of inferior players over better ones. Yes, this happens with other coaches but not to this degree and not on the first line.
- Poor developer of talent
You said he was the best coach availble. And to that I say... no way. He wasn't in demand for a reason. He sucks.
That doesn't mean that any coach who leaves and comes back sucks but it does in his case. It's incredible how some of the most incompetent people in the world manage to fail upwards and MT is a classic example of this. I have no idea how he has any kind of career related to hockey that doesn't involve being some kind of angry mascot.
Over Therrien? I'll take Demers every day and twice on Sunday. He's a million times better. I'll take half the posters on this board over Therrien.
I'm neutral towards Boucher. I don't know enough about him.
The "trapping" style that he employed concerns me but many here said he had no choice with that lineup. I just would prefer a 'players' coach right now because after four years of MT the guys could use a break, not another hardass. And based on what little I know of Boucher he's more of a hardass so that gives me some concern. I'm sure he'd be a million times better than Therrien and I don't want anything to do with Roy so... if we have to select from this tiny pool then I guess he's the best of a horrible lot.
Hitchcock would be far more interesting in my opinion. He might be too cerebral though. Apparently the Blues players aren't big fans of his. He seems to be a very good systems guy though so who knows? I've always liked his results.
Didnt he have Vinny, st louis and Stamkos ?? He would really have to trap with the habs lineup.
Boucher would be interesting, I would not mind them taking a peak at Benoit Groulx, he is imo the best French speaking coach not currently hired in the NHL (along with Boucher). I mean if they want to really get the first pick we could change Therrien for Lefebvre... for the rest of the season.
As mentioned, not entirely sure Boucher is the best french coach available. I is probably on top of the list. IMO I would like to see Carbo come back as an assistant.
My choice would be Benoit Groulx with Carbo and Daighault as assistant.
I would fully support it. I'm telling put Carbo in for the remaining of the season. At least it would be new ideas. At least we wouldn't have DD on the first line.
As others have said keep Michel for the rest of the season as he is working wonders when it comes to tanking. If we win the lottery he should put it on his resumé when he is on the unemployment line.
If management is insistent on a French coach Boucher is the only good choice.
Serious question, if not a French coach, who is a good choice?
Again, I'm not pro French coach but I can't even think of a good English coach who is available right now.
What if the players respond well to him and we potentially lose the ability to draft in the top 5? That would be a complete disaster. I say keep Therrien behind that bench and lets go 2-28 to end the year, rispek da plan!!!!
As others have said keep Michel for the rest of the season as he is working wonders when it comes to tanking. If we win the lottery he should put it on his resumé when he is on the unemployment line.
If management is insistent on a French coach Boucher is the only good choice.
Heard an interview with Pascal Vincent this week. He's been assistant coach with the Jets since 2011. Sounds like a smart, level-headed guy. Apparently well appreciated by the players. Of course, when you're assistant coach, you're more of a confidant for players, you don't have decision-making ability about critical player issues, like playing time. Vincent, now 44, mentioned that he feels he is ready for a coaching position, whether with the Jets or elsewhere.
Heard an interview with Pascal Vincent this week. He's been assistant coach with the Jets since 2011. Sounds like a smart, level-headed guy. Apparently well appreciated by the players. Of course, when you're assistant coach, you're more of a confidant for players, you don't have decision-making ability about critical player issues, like playing time. Vincent, now 44, mentioned that he feels he is ready for a coaching position, whether with the Jets or elsewhere.
Heard an interview with Pascal Vincent this week. He's been assistant coach with the Jets since 2011. Sounds like a smart, level-headed guy. Apparently well appreciated by the players. Of course, when you're assistant coach, you're more of a confidant for players, you don't have decision-making ability about critical player issues, like playing time. Vincent, now 44, mentioned that he feels he is ready for a coaching position, whether with the Jets or elsewhere.
Can't comment on his performance in that league. Terry Ryan can though. Not sure if you've heard his opinion but it carries some weight for me. Maybe it's bias confirmation but Therrien sounds like an absolute clown from his AHL days, never mind the recent toenail and farting stories that have come out.I don't think MT is as bad as you say. I really don't. Look at his numbers when he was promoted from the AHL for example. 3 straight QMJHL finals(1 championship), always made playoffs in AHL, made finals in NHL, etc... So yah, I don't think 'a janitor could do better' as you put it yesterday.
Whether possession metrics are underrated or not we've looked terrible the past two years. And he did in fact have the Pens dead last in shots for and bottom third in shots against and out of the playoffs. He also has never managed to get his team in the playoffs without stellar netminding. The only season that's an exception was 2013 and even then Price was amazing for 4/5ths of the season.I really don't think he's that bad. I also think possession metrics based on shots are overrated, I always have and I still do. We now have a much better shot metric but are worse, so what?
I'm not sure about Hitch. He seems to have change tactics a little bit and isn't as much of a trapper. Definitely gets results wherever he goes. He'd be a massive improvement for sure.As for Hitchcock, he's like Martin for me. Boucher didn't trap all the time and one thing he's good at is PP which can be the difference between winning and losing for us.
No rookie coaches. Next year has to be our year to go for a cup. We can't waste it training somebody on the job.Heard an interview with Pascal Vincent this week. He's been assistant coach with the Jets since 2011. Sounds like a smart, level-headed guy. Apparently well appreciated by the players. Of course, when you're assistant coach, you're more of a confidant for players, you don't have decision-making ability about critical player issues, like playing time. Vincent, now 44, mentioned that he feels he is ready for a coaching position, whether with the Jets or elsewhere.
Can't comment on his performance in that league. Terry Ryan can though. Not sure if you've heard his opinion but it carries some weight for me. Maybe it's bias confirmation but Therrien sounds like an absolute clown from his AHL days, never mind the recent toenail and farting stories that have come out.
I'll take the janitor.
Whether possession metrics are underrated or not we've looked terrible the past two years. And he did in fact have the Pens dead last in shots for and bottom third in shots against and out of the playoffs. He also has never managed to get his team in the playoffs without stellar netminding. The only season that's an exception was 2013 and even then Price was amazing for 4/5ths of the season.
I'm not sure about Hitch. He seems to have change tactics a little bit and isn't as much of a trapper. Definitely gets results wherever he goes. He'd be a massive improvement for sure.
Maybe Boucher's the right guy... I would not oppose his hiring.
Coaches like Therrien don't have a long shelf life. They go into teams, create structure and discipline and once the young players buy in and mature...he becomes average.
That's when better coaches come in.
At this point, he's still working on phase 1 so he's got some time.