Non-Sharks Bay Area Sports Thread XXVII

[StreetHawk]

The Rams really don’t like 1st round picks.

You have to look at their current roster. Donald completed 7 seasons already. He came out of Pitt as a true Senior, so he turns 30 later this year. How many all pro seasons does he have left in him? Say around 3 give or take. Ramsey just played his 5th season in the NFL, he is around 26 now. Kupp and Woods are on second contracts. Maybe Whitworth comes back for a final season? They managed to get some safeties and corners outside of round 1 in Johnson, Rapp, etc. Basically, now or never for the Rams in these next 3 seasons.

SF now has Wilson, Stafford and Murray in their division. Seattle and LA in win now mode. Arizona turning the corner. What does SF do to compete?

2 firsts and a third, plus Goff for Stafford. Did SF put in their first at #12 this season plus a future 2nd round pick? That would have been my best offer for Stafford. Absorb the $3 mill in dead cap from Jimmy and take on $21 mill for Stafford, which comes to less than the $27 mill SF takes by going with Jimmy next season. Indy should have offered a one and a two easily. So, unless Stafford really preferred going to LA, I would have considered taking a first this draft versus in future years.

 

[sjsharks92]

You have to look at their current roster. Donald completed 7 seasons already. He came out of Pitt as a true Senior, so he turns 30 later this year. How many all pro seasons does he have left in him? Say around 3 give or take. Ramsey just played his 5th season in the NFL, he is around 26 now. Kupp and Woods are on second contracts. Maybe Whitworth comes back for a final season? They managed to get some safeties and corners outside of round 1 in Johnson, Rapp, etc. Basically, now or never for the Rams in these next 3 seasons.

SF now has Wilson, Stafford and Murray in their division. Seattle and LA in win now mode. Arizona turning the corner. What does SF do to compete?

2 firsts and a third, plus Goff for Stafford. Did SF put in their first at #12 this season plus a future 2nd round pick? That would have been my best offer for Stafford. Absorb the $3 mill in dead cap from Jimmy and take on $21 mill for Stafford, which comes to less than the $27 mill SF takes by going with Jimmy next season. Indy should have offered a one and a two easily. So, unless Stafford really preferred going to LA, I would have considered taking a first this draft versus in future years.

If the Niners have any intention of competing in this division now, Deshaun Watson is a must. Jimmy is by far the least talented of the 3 QBs in this division, and even with Shanahan calling plays I don't think the team could overcome the deficit at QB.

I'd be offer to willing just about anything for Watson. 3 1sts? Sure, why not. This team has a super bowl caliber core but needs a QB. We just went 7-9 with CJ Beathard and Nick Mullens taking most of the snaps. With Deshaun Watson, this is easily the NFC favorite in 2021 in my opinion.

 

[DG93]

If the Niners have any intention of competing in this division now, Deshaun Watson is a must. Jimmy is by far the least talented of the 3 QBs in this division, and even with Shanahan calling plays I don't think the team could overcome the deficit at QB.

I'd be offer to willing just about anything for Watson. 3 1sts? Sure, why not. This team has a super bowl caliber core but needs a QB. We just went 7-9 with CJ Beathard and Nick Mullens taking most of the snaps. With Deshaun Watson, this is easily the NFC favorite in 2021 in my opinion.

One well-connected Houston reporter said the ask would be two 1st round picks, two 2nd round picks, and two young defensive starters. I'm assuming the ask from the Niners would be something along the lines of 2021 1st, 2022 1st, 2022 2nd, 2023 2nd, Bosa, and Greenlaw/Kinlaw (if we're lucky, or it could be Warner, oof). Watson throwing to Kittle, Deebo, and Aiyuk and being coached by Shanahan is fun, but is it worth that package? Tough price to pay...

 

[sjsharks92]

One well-connected Houston reporter said the ask would be two 1st round picks, two 2nd round picks, and two young defensive starters. I'm assuming the ask from the Niners would be something along the lines of 2021 1st, 2022 1st, 2022 2nd, 2023 2nd, Bosa, and Greenlaw/Kinlaw (if we're lucky, or it could be Warner, oof). Watson throwing to Kittle, Deebo, and Aiyuk and being coached by Shanahan is fun, but is it worth that package? Tough price to pay...

I could be wrong, but I suspect Warner or Bosa alone would be more than enough along with those picks. Those guys aren't just "young defensive starters", they're All-Pros.

 

[ChompChomp]

Maybe I'm crazy, but Bosa is so good that I think if he has to be in a deal for Watson, it should be Bosa for Watson, with maybe a 2nd or 3rd round pick thrown in. No first round picks. Bosa is that good. Nobody else in the league is (or can) offer up someone as good as Nick Bosa in a Watson deal. The Niners can play that to their advantage.

But if the Texans won't deal Watson to us without Bosa, I'd rather get a QB in the draft. I don't want to deal Bosa. I'm very high on Trey Lance and would love to see him in Red and Gold.

 

[DG93]

I could be wrong, but I suspect Warner or Bosa alone would be more than enough along with those picks. Those guys aren't just "young defensive starters", they're All-Pros.

If Bosa alone was enough, I'd do it. Watson is also due only 10M this year, so you save almost 15M after releasing Jimmy G. That in addition to the 30M or so they have already should be enough to re-sign Trent Williams, extend Warner, and bring back a few other free agents on defense like Verrett, Hyder, and K'waun Williams. Then you can use the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round picks on a center/guard, DB, and a DE to start opposite Hyder. That's a legit contender imo with Shanahan as the play-caller and Watson throwing to Kittle, Deebo, Aiyuk + a Mostert/Wilson run game.

Maybe I'm crazy, but Bosa is so good that I think if he has to be in a deal for Watson, it should be Bosa for Watson, with maybe a 2nd or 3rd round pick thrown in. No first round picks. Bosa is that good. Nobody else in the league is (or can) offer up someone as good as Nick Bosa in a Watson deal. The Niners can play that to their advantage.

But if the Texans won't deal Watson to us without Bosa, I'd rather get a QB in the draft. I don't want to deal Bosa. I'm very high on Trey Lance and would love to see him in Red and Gold.

I mean if you can get away with Bosa + 2022 1st + 2021 2nd, that's an amazing deal for Deshaun Watson I think...

 

[StreetHawk]

I could be wrong, but I suspect Warner or Bosa alone would be more than enough along with those picks. Those guys aren't just "young defensive starters", they're All-Pros.

If you obtain Watson, you are going to have to make some tough decisions on the rest of the roster. So, if that means giving up someone like Warner, whom you have to pay in a year and given what Bobby Wagner, on contract 3 got, which averages to $18 million per year, you may need to give him up.

Warner, 2021 1st, 2022 1st, 2023 2nd, and maybe an offensive player like Deebo or Aiyuk if that is needed would be my best offer. Feeling is that going forward that WR is going to be a position that is deep in drafts in this pass happy league, so that's something that you can replace. And SF got 2 extra compensatory 3rd round picks from the NFL when Saleh was hired by the NYJ.

People also have to remember that around 1/3 of all first round picks either get cut or the team lets them walk in free agency. So, no guarantee that these guys sign a second contract with the team that holds their rights (so not including traded guys like Tunsil/Ramsey for example as part of this 1/3 who don't get signed.)

And you see plenty of non first round picks have great careers. Football more than any other sport is about fit, scheme, coaching, etc.

 

[ChompChomp]

I mean if you can get away with Bosa + 2022 1st + 2021 2nd, that's an amazing deal for Deshaun Watson I think...

I was saying no firsts, but honestly, a big trade package for Watson would/should eat at Niners mgmt, considering they should have drafted Watson or Mahomes in 2017. Even as a fan it would eat at me on how much they'd have to give up when I (we?) were screaming for the Niners to draft a QB in that draft (they traded for Jimmy G later than Fall, so he wasn't in the cards at that point) and traded down and avoided Mitchell Trubinsky.

I'd rather trade up into a top 5 slot and ensure the Niners get Trey Lance so they don't have to make those tough cap decisions with other players now.

 

[StreetHawk]

I was saying no firsts, but honestly, a big trade package for Watson would/should eat at Niners mgmt, considering they should have drafted Watson or Mahomes in 2017. Even as a fan it would eat at me on how much they'd have to give up when I (we?) were screaming for the Niners to draft a QB in that draft (they traded for Jimmy G later than Fall, so he wasn't in the cards at that point) and traded down and avoided Mitchell Trubinsky.

I'd rather trade up into a top 5 slot and ensure the Niners get Trey Lance so they don't have to make those tough cap decisions with other players now.

Taking Lance likely ensures that Bosa is on his 5th year option by the time Lance is able to keep up with Wilson/Stafford/Murray in that division.

That's why it was surprising that they didn't push in harder to get Stafford. I say the same for Indy. Colts have no shot at Watson as Houston won't trade within division. Only divisional deal that could make sense is if Jax offered #1 pick, basically Lawrence for Watson, which could actually salvage something for Houston.

Still amazes me today that people give SF and other teams such a pass for not taking Watson/Mahomes, when they had QB needs in 2017. Cause Shanahan was thinking he could sign Cousins in 2018 after his second franchise tag from WFT.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

I think Lynch’s reluctantly to deal 1st rounders and go all in will bite them in the butt this offseason.

 

[Lebanezer]

I think Lynch’s reluctantly to deal 1st rounders and go all in will bite them in the butt this offseason.

I'm hoping he's aiming high, and that's Watson only. I wouldn't deal any roster players for him though. Multiple 1sts and other picks only. Watson has a much brighter future than all the other available QBs.

 

[sjsharks92]

I have to agree. As I said earlier, to compete in this division now we need an upgrade at QB. Kirk Cousins isnt the answer and I don't think Lance, Wilson or Fields are either. Watson is the only way this team is truly a SB contender again.

 

[LadyStanley]

Awesome

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

A’s really added a lot of depth for cheap in the past week. Barring injuries they should be the favorite in the West again.

 

[John Price]

 

[John Price]

 

[Lebanezer]

Wow

 

[SJSharksfan39]

This is probably the most exciting offseason as a 49ers fan I've seen since the year Shanahan was hired. It's nice when your team is in the news and getting pretty good national coverage almost every day.

 

[Sandisfan]

Wow

This is probably the most exciting offseason as a 49ers fan I've seen since the year Shanahan was hired. It's nice when your team is in the news and getting pretty good national coverage almost every day.

Trading multiple 1st rounders usually backfires for moving up for QBs early in the draft. The Niners HAVE to hit on the QB, I expect they moved up for, or it could be a bad deal. On another Message board (OK I have cheated on this board at another site but it's good because it's not a Hockey Discussion board well it's a general one with a barely used Hockey section ) I read that Lynch has been quoted since this deal that Garoppolo is still the QB for 2021 which would mean that a drafted QB will sit his first season. That's a bit head scratching if true. Seems to me that it's possible that he might be driving up any bids for Garrop. But they should try to recoup picks from a Garrop trade. I am generally against these types of deals as most blockbuster trade ups for QBs end in disaster. It could work out if they get a great QB but what are the odds their trade up will be the one that pays off.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Trading multiple 1st rounders usually backfires for moving up for QBs early in the draft. The Niners HAVE to hit on the QB, I expect they moved up for, or it could be a bad deal. On another Message board (OK I have cheated on this board at another site but it's good because it's not a Hockey Discussion board well it's a general one with a barely used Hockey section ) I read that Lynch has been quoted since this deal that Garoppolo is still the QB for 2021 which would mean that a drafted QB will sit his first season. That's a bit head scratching if true. Seems to me that it's possible that he might be driving up any bids for Garrop. But they should try to recoup picks from a Garrop trade. I am generally against these types of deals as most blockbuster trade ups for QBs end in disaster. It could work out if they get a great QB but what are the odds their trade up will be the one that pays off.

I would think it's ideal for a top pick QB to sit a year to learn before taking the reins but it's certainly plausible that it's just GM speak to raise his value. I think one of the biggest mistakes this franchise made was not making Smith sit the first year especially when that team sucked and the QB was taking punishment no matter who it was.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Trey Lance is gonna look good in red.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

I would think it's ideal for a top pick QB to sit a year to learn before taking the reins but it's certainly plausible that it's just GM speak to raise his value. I think one of the biggest mistakes this franchise made was not making Smith sit the first year especially when that team sucked and the QB was taking punishment no matter who it was.

Smith was screwed either way. Benching him a season wouldn’t have done much good with how the York’s ran it at the time.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Smith was screwed either way. Benching him a season wouldn’t have done much good with how the York’s ran it at the time.

True but that first year with the linemen they had was going to be painful for whoever was QB.

 

[StreetHawk]

Trading multiple 1st rounders usually backfires for moving up for QBs early in the draft. The Niners HAVE to hit on the QB, I expect they moved up for, or it could be a bad deal. On another Message board (OK I have cheated on this board at another site but it's good because it's not a Hockey Discussion board well it's a general one with a barely used Hockey section ) I read that Lynch has been quoted since this deal that Garoppolo is still the QB for 2021 which would mean that a drafted QB will sit his first season. That's a bit head scratching if true. Seems to me that it's possible that he might be driving up any bids for Garrop. But they should try to recoup picks from a Garrop trade. I am generally against these types of deals as most blockbuster trade ups for QBs end in disaster. It could work out if they get a great QB but what are the odds their trade up will be the one that pays off.

The main issue to a trade is Jimmy’s contract. He would be asked to restructure his contract for any trade to be facilitated. If he doesn’t like the destination then he simply tells SF that he won’t redo the contract. Basically he forces SF to pay him the $25 odd mill to be their starter or he gets cut and picks his landing spot.

that is what makes a Jimmy trade hard for SF to get a return unless it’s a team that Jimmy wants to join. At best I think NE would move a third for him as they have 2 compensatory picks this seasons.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

True but that first year with the linemen they had was going to be painful for whoever was QB.

I thought Rattay had earned the right to take those beatings, myself.