Confirmed Trade: [NJD/TOR] Andreas Johnsson for Joey Anderson

Discussion in 'Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk' started by MMC, Oct 10, 2020.

  1. A1LeafNation Our time! Our time!

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    Hyman was the same and look how that turned out.

    Anderson is trying to mirror Humans game from what he has said about himself.
     
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  2. nbwingsfan Registered User

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    Just because one player did it doesn't mean everyone will. Dominic Turgeon said he was trying to play like a Bergeron but can't get out of the AHL because he sucks

    Nothing about Anderson screams more than a 4th line/13th forward
     
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  3. BoredBrandonPridham Registered User

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    His production rates are already at ~30pts, projecting to that kind of usage, with worse teammates than Johnsson had, 3yrs younger :thumbu:
     
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  4. BoredBrandonPridham Registered User

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    Hey, you sound like most Leafs fans after Hyman's rookie season.
     
  5. nbwingsfan Registered User

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    Or Dom Turgeons rookie season. Or Freddy Gauthiers, or Moore, or Nordstrom, or Timashov, or Erne, or Ehn, or Dupuis, or Bourque, etc etc

    For every Hyman there are 100 more 4th line forwards who stay 4th line forwards
     
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  6. nbwingsfan Registered User

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    Ah yes, the classic 27pt pace over an EIGHTEEN game sample size :laugh: clearly a future top 6 forward in the making
     
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  7. BoredBrandonPridham Registered User

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    All you're saying is that younger players who aren't as good yet have risk associated to them. This is not an insightful or interesting argument to make.

    Someone said "as long as Johnsson can produce 40pts, we're good!" My argument is that the player you just traded away has only shown that he is actually close to that, if given the same usage Johnsson is getting when he hit 40pts. And that player is 3yrs younger.

    Johnsson is good for about 25pts 5v5, and that's at 60% OZS%. He'll like put up less if you give him the defensive 5v5 usage Anderson had.

    Good luck.
     
  8. BoredBrandonPridham Registered User

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    Btw, his production rate was the same as Johnsson's last season, except Anderson had bottom-6 defensive usage (60% DZS%) and Johnsson had top-6 offensive usage (60% OZS%). Yea, smaller sample, less opportunity, etc... But for whatever time they have spent on the ice, Johnsson and Anderson have only shown to be comparable players now, except Anderson is 3yrs younger.
     
  9. Luffy King of the Pirates - GO DEVILS! Sponsor

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    That isnt remotely true and you are cherry-picking stats

    Johnsson is multiple steps above Joey Anderson and its not up for debate. Why the heck would Jersey have traded him if he was equivalent, three years younger, and on an ELC?...
     
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  10. Luffy King of the Pirates - GO DEVILS! Sponsor

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    You may not have

    Was that reported? Because picks are more valuable to NJ, even mid rounds, than Anderson because of his age

    Anderson is young but NJ would rather have the picks because of future ELCs for cap structure - plus we have 3-4 other prospects similar to Anderson who produce more offensively
     
  11. Jersey Fresh Video Et Taceo

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    On the percentage tree of Anderson reaching what Johnsson is right now, that likelihood is pretty small (let's say <20%). Point to projected point totals over laughably small sample sizes all you want, that's not what I'd be betting on.

    So like I said, good luck. To you and Joey. He does a lot of good things, I don't think middle-six scoring will be one of them.
     
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  12. BoredBrandonPridham Registered User

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    Looking at production rates and isolating 5v5 from PP production is not cherry-picking, it's the only way to assess how a player produced while normalizing for coaches choice. Using total points in a season, points-per-game, etc... is cherry picking because it ignores 5v5 v.s. PP and ice time, especially in situations where you have players like Anderson who were not given a lot of ice time, and no PP time. When people say "production isn't everything, you have to consider context", isolating 5v5 production from PP production is the most impactful and obvious context to needs to be taken into consideration first.

    Why would NJ trade him? Probably because they want more PPers, and Leafs want more PKers.
     
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  13. BoredBrandonPridham Registered User

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    Why are you saying Leafs fans? As far as I can tell I'm the only one in here saying that they aren't as different calibre players as people seem to think.
     
  14. Luffy King of the Pirates - GO DEVILS! Sponsor

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    Thats a lot to type to explain that you have a whole two advanced stats that Joey excelled in!

    Just accept him as a cheap fourth line option and leave it at that - expecting much more will only leave you disappointed
     
  15. BoredBrandonPridham Registered User

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    What is "Johnsson right now" then? What's your assessment of how good he is, v.s. Anderson? Are you just looking at points? Because if so, I have sufficiently debunked the points argument for Johnsson >>> Anderson, as in similar contexts they are actually have produced pretty similar the main difference being is that Johnsson has been given PP time.

    I mean, at Anderson's age, Johnsson hadn't even played an NHL game yet, let alone putting up similar 5v5 production, with Anderson getting tougher minutes.
     
  16. BoredBrandonPridham Registered User

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    What stats did you find that Johnsson excels in that aren't "cherry-picked"?
     
  17. Sidney the Kidney Missing Link

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    It's an incredibly flawed way. Unless you think the only difference between Auston Matthews and Zach Sanford this past season is Matthews got used on the PP and got more ice time than Sanford got, and if Sanford got that much time he'd be equal with Matthews in production. I mean, their production rate at 5on5 was exactly the same this past season (2.34 points/60).
     
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  18. 4thline Registered User

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    That what most see him as today. But his age and track record suggest more upside. Instead of a cat, he's in that grey zone as schrodinger's asset, existing as both a depth role player and a decent prospect.
     
  19. Cotton Registered User

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    Unless you’re new to hockey, which you may be - I don’t know, you should never cap a young players potential where there is room to grow.

    Likewise, if you think Johnsson breaks 20 goals and 40pts without having 50% of his even strength usage paying with Matthews, and around 29% with Nylander, you’re sadly mistaken. In fact, he cracked 20 only because he scored a hat trick on an AHL level goaltender.
     
  20. Luffy King of the Pirates - GO DEVILS! Sponsor

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    New to hockey? Joey Anderson has been a prospect I have followed since he was 18 when we took him

    I dont need Leafs fans, who didnt know his name before last week, telling us Devils fans what he may or may not become!

    Once you followed him for the last four years, then you can comment on people downplaying his potential
     
  21. BoredBrandonPridham Registered User

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    Absolutely, players now and then have outlier seasons. For example, Johnsson had a season where he put up 40pts -- lots of NJ fans here seem to be happy about that. But you have to feed him really good minutes with really good players to get a measly 40pts out of him. In that context, Johnsson is sub-replacement level.

    The problem with Johnsson is if he's not taking a high-value spot in your top-6 where lots of mediocre players can put up 40pts+, he's not doing much. He's nothing to write home about defensively, and he doesn't play on the PK.

    So if you have a weak top-6, I can see why you want him over someone like Anderson. But it's not like you've stolen an offensive gem from us. NJ will get tired of him pretty quickly, and you'll just move on to shitting all over the next player that has to eat up 60% DZS% because your 2nd line is sheltered due to players of the ilk of Johnsson on it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
  22. beauchamp Registered User

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    Potential ?

    2% ? 10% ? 50% ?

    A bird in hand is better than two in the bush (except in Australia).
     
  23. Cotton Registered User

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    Try not to get emotional, I said I didn’t know if you were, but if you do than like I said, the last thing you should do is cap a kids potential - because you have no idea what could happen.

    And let’s not pretend you’re versed in all that is Johnsson. You watched a highlight reel and now think you can dunk in our faces without having any context as to why he produced like he did.
     
  24. beauchamp Registered User

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    Brilliant. :badidea:
     
  25. beauchamp Registered User

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    You remind me of some fans' predictions after Frattin's first few games...
     
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