Prospect Info: Nils Lundkvist: Part III

[chosen]

Don’t think he will ever get the chance to unseat fox on PP1. As crazy as it sounds fox could have 10-15 more points if some guys finished better. I’m sure lundkvist has a better shot then fox right now, but the PP is set up for fox to dish to Zibby or panarin mainly. Fox taking the shot from the point is the last option.
I think Lundkvist is trade bait mainly for 3 reasons. It sucks because he can max out as a top pair D but he’ll never get the minutes to with Fox in the fold. The rangers have 4 smaller D in Fox, Lindgren, lundkvist and Jones. All guys are 5”10 and under. All of the can move the puck, some better then others. Of those 4 lindgren plays the biggest game and uses his body the most. Plus his chemistry with Fox, he’s going no where. And he has room to improve.
I am 99% certain the rangers want big mobile guys who can defend and skate.. they have Fox that’s mr. Everything he s going no where. Neither is lindgren for at least 2-3 years, same with a trouba. That leaves miller, Nils, Schneider, Jones, and Robertson for 3 spots.
Robertson and Schneider are both huge and proved they are both above average when moving the puck. The fact that they can do that plus their size, reach, and ability to play a real physical game makes me think they are both a sure thing for 4-6 D while they are young and learning. They fit the in house mandate.
Miller who finished the year a little rocky Still overall had an excellent rookie season. He also has the size, reach and wheels that the rangers want on the backend.
That leaves Lindkvist and Jones. Both smaller players who have the puck on their stick a lot. lundkvist is the far more polished players, he’s a more complete D currently and his value is sky high after setting record in the SHL. He is also older then jones. If Jones hits his ceiling he can become they better of the 2 but their are no guarantees.
Right now I doubt highly we will see a top 6 that features Lundkvist, Jones, and Fox in it.
I think Lundkvist is the piece currently that could be available that would bring back the most in trade,

I know I'm pretty much on an island with this, but I'd deal Miller for the right personnel coming back. Being big matters if you're physical. Otherwise, it just means you're big.

Miller is not physical. Might change. Might not. Almost never does, though.

He also didn't bring nearly the offense as advertised. That could change.

He was a pretty consistent horror show in defensive mistakes, who sometimes was saved by his reach. At other times, not. That could change.

I would trade anyone if I thought it would help. No one is ever untouchable. Granted I can't come up with a deal for Fox that would be worth trading him.

 

[jay from jersey]

I know I'm pretty much on an island with this, but I'd deal Miller for the right personnel coming back. Being big matters if you're physical. Otherwise, it just means you're big.

Miller is not physical. Might change. Might not. Almost never does, though.

He also didn't bring nearly the offense as advertised. That could change.

He was a pretty consistent horror show in defensive mistakes, who sometimes was saved by his reach. At other times, not. That could change.

I would trade anyone if I thought it would help. No one is ever untouchable. Granted I can't come up with a deal for Fox that would be worth trading him.

I can see it. I may be in the minority as well but many people are severely underrating Robertson and what he brings to the table. He’s not a lesser prospect then Schneider by any means he just doesn’t have the same draft pedigree and spotlight. Once he hits the ice I give it a year before he passes miller on the depth chart. He’s just as big, more physical and I believe he thinks the game better then miller does right at this moment.
We really do have an embarrassment of riches at the back end right now. They just have to be smart and keep stocking the cupboard. I don’t think in their wildest dreams the rangers thought half these guys would turn into the prospects they have become, it just so happened that they will all be arriving around the same timeline and that’s where things get difficult. But one thing is for certain, barring any unforeseen season ending injuries we are going to see one or 2 of these guys moved. There just isn’t enough spots for all to play and sticking them in Hartford just cause isn’t really good for their development or trade value if they are NHL ready.
They need to address a position of weakness by trading from a position of strength on D. Everyone talks about how we have fantastic wing depth, which we do. But the heart of our prospect power is on the blue line. Each and every one of these guys is going to be a quality top 4 D man in the league for a long time, and if some fulfill their full potential there will be 4-5 first pairing D but that still remains to be seen

 

[Kaapo Hollweg]

I would trade anyone if I thought it would help. No one is ever untouchable. Granted I can't come up with a deal for Fox that would be worth trading him.

Fox for McDavid with 50% retained...

 

[ThirdEye]

I can see it. I may be in the minority as well but many people are severely underrating Robertson and what he brings to the table. He’s not a lesser prospect then Schneider by any means he just doesn’t have the same draft pedigree and spotlight. Once he hits the ice I give it a year before he passes miller on the depth chart. He’s just as big, more physical and I believe he thinks the game better then miller does right at this moment.
We really do have an embarrassment of riches at the back end right now. They just have to be smart and keep stocking the cupboard. I don’t think in their wildest dreams the rangers thought half these guys would turn into the prospects they have become, it just so happened that they will all be arriving around the same timeline and that’s where things get difficult. But one thing is for certain, barring any unforeseen season ending injuries we are going to see one or 2 of these guys moved. There just isn’t enough spots for all to play and sticking them in Hartford just cause isn’t really good for their development or trade value if they are NHL ready.
They need to address a position of weakness by trading from a position of strength on D. Everyone talks about how we have fantastic wing depth, which we do. But the heart of our prospect power is on the blue line. Each and every one of these guys is going to be a quality top 4 D man in the league for a long time, and if some fulfill their full potential there will be 4-5 first pairing D but that still remains to be seen

Still wondering how he made it all the way to the 49th pick. No place had him ranked below 30 and many in the mid-20s.

People will probably jump on me, but I could see Miller being the one let go since he's already played in the NHL and has trade value. I like Miller but his decision making is suspect and that's not really something you can teach all too well since majority of that comes from natural instincts. It's risky but it's also a risk we can take given our depth if it means bringing back a young center or adding toughness

 

[alkurtz]

Wow, it amazes me how quickly some posters are willing to write off Miller.

Step back a minute and consider what he accomplished this year. He was a regular top-4 D at only 21 years old, logging just over 21 minutes of ice team nightly.

Yes, he played somewhat protected minutes and Trouba covered up many of his mistakes. Yes, he was less physical then we had hoped and thought he would be, Yes, as the season went along he did not improve and actually seemed to retrogress a bit.

But, come on. It was like putting a gifted middle schooler into an AP high school calculus class.

What the future brings is uncertain. He may never grow into much more than he is now. Or, he may grow into his body, gain confidence in his physical skills, and become a legit top pair D.

But, just step back and enjoy the success he had and the possibilities for the future. I am certainly excited over the future potential of both Schneider and Robertson. But Miller has accomplished something that neither has done yet: he played an entire season as a regular NHL D, logging big minutes, proving to himself that he can play in the NHL, and giving hope for a better future.

Shiny new toy syndrome is now impacted a rookie D who, all things considered, had a fine season.

 

[ThirdEye]

Wow, it amazes me how quickly some posters are willing to write off Miller.

Step back a minute and consider what he accomplished this year. He was a regular top-4 D at only 21 years old, logging just over 21 minutes of ice team nightly.

Yes, he played somewhat protected minutes and Trouba covered up many of his mistakes. Yes, he was less physical then we had hoped and thought he would be, Yes, as the season went along he did not improve and actually seemed to retrogress a bit.

But, come on. It was like putting a gifted middle schooler into an AP high school calculus class.

What the future brings is uncertain. He may never grow into much more than he is now. Or, he may grow into his body, gain confidence in his physical skills, and become a legit top pair D.

But, just step back and enjoy the success he had and the possibilities for the future. I am certainly excited over the future potential of both Schneider and Robertson. But Miller has accomplished something that neither has done yet: he played an entire season as a regular NHL D, logging big minutes, proving to himself that he can play in the NHL, and giving hope for a better future.

Shiny new toy syndrome is now impacted a rookie D who, all things considered, had a fine season.

I get what you're saying, but you yourself just pointed out my concerns with him. His puckhandling isn't very good, he's not overly physical and makes Skjei-level gaffes out there. While he can improve in all facets, these are generally things you either have or you don't.

Of all of our young D he has the most trade value right and you have to give to get. I don't see the Rangers trading him, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if they do.

 

[chosen]

Fox for McDavid with 50% retained...

Would either team make that deal? Rangers, probably. Edmonton, no.

Would the Rangers be better?

Oddly, I'm not positive.

 

[UnSandvich]

I get what you're saying, but you yourself just pointed out my concerns with him. His puckhandling isn't very good, he's not overly physical and makes Skjei-level gaffes out there. While he can improve in all facets, these are generally things you either have or you don't.

Of all of our young D he has the most trade value right and you have to give to get. I don't see the Rangers trading him, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if they do.

Miller was also expected to need a full year in the AHL maybe more, before becoming a regular in the NHL. After the first month or two, people's expectations got too high

 

[Kaapo Hollweg]

Would either team make that deal? Rangers, probably. Edmonton, no.

Would the Rangers be better?

Oddly, I'm not positive.

Eh, I was joking. I thought the 50 % retained made it quite obvious

Of course Edmonton doesn't do that deal.

You doubt Rangers would be better? I mean, Fox is an absolute stud, but c'mon, that is a little bit ridiculous.

 

[Leetch3]

Nils made team sweden

 

[chosen]

Eh, I was joking. I thought the 50 % retained made it quite obvious

Of course Edmonton doesn't do that deal.

You doubt Rangers would be better? I mean, Fox is an absolute stud, but c'mon, that is a little bit ridiculous.

Being honest.

There is no dman I would trade even-up for Fox. Let's start there.

McDavid has been playing with arguably the 2nd best forward in the NHL and they haven't come close to winning a thing.

The Rangers might be a little better with the deal, but their top 6 D would be a disaster unless a couple of the kids become top pair dmen, which is no certain thing. It's actually unlikely.

 

[GAGLine]

I know I'm pretty much on an island with this, but I'd deal Miller for the right personnel coming back. Being big matters if you're physical. Otherwise, it just means you're big.

Miller is not physical. Might change. Might not. Almost never does, though.

He also didn't bring nearly the offense as advertised. That could change.

He was a pretty consistent horror show in defensive mistakes, who sometimes was saved by his reach. At other times, not. That could change.

I would trade anyone if I thought it would help. No one is ever untouchable. Granted I can't come up with a deal for Fox that would be worth trading him.

Completely disagree. Being big means he has a larger wing-span/reach and can cover more area with his stick. Being big means more strength for board and net-front battles. Combined with Miller's skating, his size helps to make him effective. You say that mistakes were saved by his reach. A smaller player can't do that. He's a rookie playing 21+ minutes a night in the best league in the world. Mistakes are going to happen. He will learn from them.

And regarding physical play, there were times where he used his strength to just knock players off the puck. It's something he needs to do more consistently, yes, but expecting a 21 year old kid with 53 career games to be consistent at anything isn't very fair.

 

[3rd Guy High]

The Miller discussion in this thread really shows how spoiled we are as rangers fans with Adam Fox and Ryan Lindgren.

Most D men don’t make it full time until 23 24 and when they do they are still figuring out the game.

Miller can’t even legally drink a beer yet and he’s been playing Defense for what - 4 years? Hell be a stud.

 

[Leetch3]

The Miller discussion in this thread really shows how spoiled we are as rangers fans with Adam Fox and Ryan Lindgren.

Most D men don’t make it full time until 23 24 and when they do they are still figuring out the game.

Miller can’t even legally drink a beer yet and he’s been playing Defense for what - 4 years? Hell be a stud.

not to mention that most thought he would need time in the AHL this year and then ended up playing almost every game in the top 4, 20+ minutes a night. yes he has growing to do and areas to improve, but we shouldn't lose sight of the fact that he is way ahead of where we thought he would be going into the year...and also that his biggest struggles came when trouba was out.

 

[JohnC]

Where is this idea that Robertson is a physical player coming from? By all accounts, he sounds like an extremely similar player to K’Andre Miller.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Yeah. This isn’t basketball Height is great of course but not necessarily an end in itself. Lindgren is tough as nails. I certainly wouldn’t put him in the small defenseman basket. Actually a guy like Miller kind of plays smaller than Lindgren even though he’s much bigger.

DING DING DING DING DING

Not every player over 6' is automatically playing a more physical game and not every player under 6' is "soft". These stereotypes unfortunately won't disappear any time soon.

 

[ColonialsHockey10]

What K’Andre did this year was really impressive. Despite his struggles I would say he blew every single person’s expectations out of the water.

I hope he doesn’t get complacent though, because his job on this team is hardly locked up. Just too much competition.

 

[Harbour Dog]

Where is this idea that Robertson is a physical player coming from? By all accounts, he sounds like an extremely similar player to K’Andre Miller.

Because he hasn't played in the NHL yet, so we can pretend he is and then be upset when he overachieves as a 21-year old, but doesn't meet our fabricated degree of physicality.

He is more of a stay at home guy than K'Andre, but until these last few pages, I don't remember ever hearing about him being a physical force.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

I also believe that Miller is the most likely to be dealt for a return that addresses needs. Maybe even Lundkvist at some point. I really don't want to see either traded but you have to give to get. I think the Rangers eventually envision a back line of: Lindgren-Fox, Jones-Trouba, Robertson-Schneider.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Nils is going to be moved this summer IMO.

 

[Rangeri]

I wouldn't worry about Miller yet. If i remember correctly Hedman said something like "it took me about 200 games to feel comfortable in the NHL"

Maybe it was in 31 thoughts after they won the cup ? Or some article with real quote. Can't find it now.

 

[RGY]

not to mention that most thought he would need time in the AHL this year and then ended up playing almost every game in the top 4, 20+ minutes a night. yes he has growing to do and areas to improve, but we shouldn't lose sight of the fact that he is way ahead of where we thought he would be going into the year...and also that his biggest struggles came when trouba was out.

He did need time in the AHL...

 

[charliemurphy]

Hot damn this thread, lol. Curious how some would feel if Lindgren gets moved.

 

[Ola]

Where is this idea that Robertson is a physical player coming from? By all accounts, he sounds like an extremely similar player to K’Andre Miller.

Hm, not sure about that. I think Robertson at least ranks somewhere in between like KAM and Ryan Graves.

As to KAM, I -- really -- think it is important that we do not rush to conclusions regarding him. Or any of the kids. First of all, I think that we need to come to a collective decision on the blueline that we simply must be much firmer at clearing the crease, even if it cost us a handful of penalties over a season. It must be a no-go to just be able to park in front of our goalie and stand there and gloat after every whistle. To a large extent we have developed this because if push comes to shove, we had no fall back option but to run and hide on the bench, which the teams around us in the division had plenty of.

I for example don't for a second think KAM would be soft in those situations if those were his instructions, nor is he soft once engaged in physical battles. But we must get more of it.

 

[charliemurphy]

I also believe that Miller is the most likely to be dealt for a return that addresses needs. Maybe even Lundkvist at some point. I really don't want to see either traded but you have to give to get. I think the Rangers eventually envision a back line of: Lindgren-Fox, Jones-Trouba, Robertson-Schneider.

Can I play? Circa 23, lol

Robertson-Fox
Miller-Lundkvist
Jones-Schneider
Lindgren