Player Discussion Nikolay Goldobin Pt. II

[kanucks25]

To me it makes absolutely no sense to trade a 23 year-old that is on pace to put up 45 points in his first full NHL season, especially when he's arguably the best play-making winger in your entire organization.

Defense and grit isn't obviously a part of his game, but that doesn't mean he isn't a useful player. Not every player on your roster needs to be a grinder, and he can still work on the details of his game overtime.

Unless we're getting a player with similar potential in return (or he's a part of a package for a more significant player) I don't really see the point here.

 

[tantalum]

To me it makes absolutely no sense to trade a 23 year-old that is on pace to put up 45 points in his first full NHL season, especially when he's arguably the best play-making winger in your entire organization.

Defense and grit isn't obviously a part of his game, but that doesn't mean he isn't a useful player. Not every player on your roster needs to be a grinder, and he can still work on the details of his game overtime.

Unless we're getting a player with similar potential in return (or he's a part of a package for a more significant player) I don't really see the point here.

The problem is he isn't really producing outside of his hot streak for a couple of weeks. I'm not looking at possession numbers but he doesn't seem to be pushing the the play forward anymore and is often the reason plays are dying or the puck is going back the other way. The special teams have been working pretty decently and with very good goaltending from Markstrom the team has managed to get leads. What hasn't really been working is the 5-on-5 play and the play of guys like Goldobin is a big reason for that.


Not every player needs to be a grinder. But every player DOES need to play passable defense. Even high scoring superstars don't get a pass on defensive play...a 40 point guy definitely won't. The stars may get some extra leeway but ultimately they will need to contribute at both ends of the ice.

But then i don't really see the "potential". I see a guy who has offensive talent but is unlikely to reach a significant level of play because he won't stay in the lineup as he lacks the drive/desire/ability to clean up the defensive and puck possession sides of his game. If I had to guess this is also exactly why the Sharks were willing to move him despite good AHL numbers.

edit: I'll add that you also have a team that from ownership down will be pressing to make the playoffs whether you or I think that's the smart move. As such, if the coach feels he can not win games with Goldobin in the lineup or that he feels that someone else will help him more than he won't be used. More to the point if he gets moved to another team, at 24 years of age at the beginning of next season he will be highly susceptible to losing his spot to the 19/20 year prospect who does things nearly as well as him.

 

[ziploc]

I don't really want him moved. But if you are loading up on this draft year and can pull a second rounder for him (which I think unlikely) I guess you do it? I dunno, he still seems serviceable, but I get his serious defensive deficiencies.

 

[CherryToke]

It's sad how physically weak and lazy he is for a 23 year old. He acts more like an 18 year old rookie. The skill is there but no maturity or desire to get better.

 

[whoshouse]

Good move to try to trade him while his value is as high as it'll be. IMO, he just doesn't mesh well with EP and Boeser. They need a forechecker on that line. Surprised he hasn't gotten more time with Horvat. I think I remember Baertschi, Horvat and Goldobin making a solid run last year.

The downside.. trading Goldobin may make it less likely Tryamkin will want to come over. Goldobins basically his only friend left on the team, and if I remember correctly Goldobin and him still chat. May be a moot point though, if Tryamkin is actually interested in being in the NHL then there may not be a better core to join than this one.

 

[Peter Griffin]

If they can get a 2nd round pick or defensive prospect for him I'll be happy.

 

[timw33]

Get Baertschi the hell out of here over goldobin.
He'll be injured again before you know it.

Hot take: get rid of both

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

Hot take: get rid of both

Who plays LW going forward? Our prospect pool isn't particularly great when it comes to wingers.

 

[Intangibos]

He's 23 and he's shown continued improvement for the last few seasons.

Who plays LW going forward? Our prospect pool isn't particularly great when it comes to wingers.

Isn't he a RW anyway? I always thought he was filling in on LW because we have literally no depth on LW.

 

[F A N]

Who plays LW going forward? Our prospect pool isn't particularly great when it comes to wingers.

Jack Hughes.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Proposal: Sell him to Chiarellie, he will overpaid for a skilled winger, and then he will overpaid him when resigning

 

[Bertuzzzi44]

Trading Goldobin would be a mistake, he has tremendous skill, is very agile and a great stick handler. Goldobin has a tendency to hustle if playing in a top 6 offensive role but looks uninterested in a bottom 6 role. Goldobin starting on the 4th line was ridiculous, Green needs to put his players in the best possible position to succeed. The same things were said about Kuznetsov being a lazy player a few years ago and Burakovsky was touted as the better player, look how that turned out.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

Jack Hughes.

You mean the guy that we currently have a 3% chance of drafting?

 

[F A N]

You mean the guy that we currently have a 3% chance of drafting?

Quinn Hughes' brother Jack Hughes yes.

 

[timw33]

Who plays LW going forward? Our prospect pool isn't particularly great when it comes to wingers.

I'm not sure, but that doesn't mean that either of Goldobin or Baertschi should have a long term future on this team. They are both small soft streaky wingers that aren't the kind of pieces we'll be contenders with IMO. One is likely a concussion away from having his life ruined permanently, the other has shown great skill but is completely infuriating when it comes to two-way play, effort, and consistency.

 

[thekernel]

Honestly, after listening to the HNIC podcast with Friedman, I'm convinced he put that Goldobin line in his 31 thoughts because Benning wanted to see what the reaction would be lol

I don't see us giving up on Goldobin so soon. He's got a lot more to give for us.

 

[MS]

Did you know that Goldobin has three (3) primary assists at 5v5 this year?

Production wise, the guy is coasting on leeching secondary assists off Pettersson which we know is more noise than signal. Even at that, his production is abysmal.

8 primary points in 41 games. Mostly with pettersson. Like, Antoine Roussel has 12. Loui Eriksson has nine. Tim Schaller has 4 primary assists. Sam Gagner has two.

At some point, you have to produce.

On one hand, agreed.

But on the other hand, he’s been skilled enough to not drag down Pettersson or that line ... and we don’t really have many guys you can say that about. Look at what Horvat is playing with.

What we should be doing is continuing to try developing this player for the rest of the season.

But we’ve decided we’re in a playoff hunt!

So we’re gonna dump a guy who can actually produce a bit and then slot some no-talent grinder into his spot or promote Granlund ... and what exactly is the point of that?

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

I dont think he's on the block at all...Looks to me like another member of the Travis Green school of hard knocks...Green has said repeatedly that this season is not all about results, but player development as well...Goldy is obviously going to watch from the press box just like the others before him ..Virtanen,Baertschi.

 

[MS]

I dont think he's on the block at all...Looks to me like another member of the Travis Green school of hard knocks...Green has said repeatedly that this season is not all about results, but player development as well...Goldy is obviously going to watch from the press box just like the others before him ..Virtanen,Baertschi.

Multiple connected media members basically came out and said we’re done with him on the same day. That’s the kiss of death from this administration.

 

[VanJack]

If the Canucks didn't think Goldy could take the next step and become a legitimate top-six forward, I seriously doubt Travis Green would be devoting so much energy and time on him. As far as trade value, unless the Canucks could find a trading partner who'd provide them with a legitimate prospect d-man with the same upside, I just can't see a deal happening.

Sounds like background noise from Freidman to me. Wasn't he the guy who claimed the Canucks were interested in Burakovsky of the Caps? Except that apparently the Canucks and Caps never talked about anybody. Fake news?

 

[member 290103]

Could he get a second round pick?

 

[tantalum]

On one hand, agreed.

But on the other hand, he’s been skilled enough to not drag down Pettersson or that line ... and we don’t really have many guys you can say that about. Look at what Horvat is playing with.

What we should be doing is continuing to try developing this player for the rest of the season.

But we’ve decided we’re in a playoff hunt!

So we’re gonna dump a guy who can actually produce a bit and then slot some no-talent grinder into his spot or promote Granlund ... and what exactly is the point of that?

Yep pointed out the playoff thing. I don't disagree with what should be done. Let him play out the next 40 games and if he still doesn't get it (likely) you move him out. Maybe by not bad mouthing him and decent production you even manage to get a decent pick back at years end.

Multiple connected media members basically came out and said we’re done with him on the same day. That’s the kiss of death from this administration.

Yep. And the management still hasn't figured out that you don't do yourself any favours when you run a guy down in the press. And while there are no official quotes it seems clear they are done with him.

 

[iceburg]

The current young core is exciting to watch and reasonably competitive (though not a playoff team yet)
+the draft is in Vancouver
+there are a number of players in the organization that are expendable (not really helping a rebuild or maybe even hindering it - Nilsson would fit in this category since he was blocking a spot for Demko) but could help other teams.

= trade as many of the expendables for picks as possible while keeping a sufficient cast to support the core. Expendables include Goldobin, Tryamkin, Pouliot at least.

 

[Melvin]

Quinn Hughes' brother Jack Hughes yes.

Do you think this fraternal fact improves our odds in any meaningful way?

 

[vanarchy]

The current young core is exciting to watch and reasonably competitive (though not a playoff team yet)
+the draft is in Vancouver
+there are a number of players in the organization that are expendable (not really helping a rebuild or maybe even hindering it - Nilsson would fit in this category since he was blocking a spot for Demko) but could help other teams.

= trade as many of the expendables for picks as possible while keeping a sufficient cast to support the core. Expendables include Goldobin, Tryamkin, Pouliot at least.

I agree.

Pouliot has no value though and I think the chance that Tryamkin may come back one day is worth more than whatever we sell his rights for. If and when we are close to contending for a playoff spot, I believe that will be attractive to him.