NHL vs MLS

Paxton Fettel

Registered User
Mar 3, 2006
7,238
309
to be honest I thought MLS was lower than 72nd in the world.

I mean it's played only by Americans and some Latin American rejects.

I don't see what's the point of comparing the NHL with MLS. MLS will never come close to European leagues. It is a nothing.
 

undraftedstlouis

Registered User
Sep 11, 2004
668
0
hard to followup such an educated post ..., but i'll try

MLS can't compare with total NHL attendance, mostly due to # of games played (NHL with about 3x the games). MLS has cheaper tickets, so gameday revenue is far off.

The best comparison is probably franchise value. 3 MLS teams were sold in the last couple years, none with their own stadiums yet. DC sold for $33 million recently. New York Red Bulls (former Metrostars is northern New Jersey) sold for $25 million in a comlicated deal that involved Red Bull buying into half the stadium costs ($45 million) and pledging $25 million for naming rights for the stadium now under construction. Kansas City sold for something above $15 million (the price Toronto paid for their new expansion team opening this year). A couple years ago 2 teams entered for a reported $10 million. In MLS teams share losses, so right now it's assumed there will be a few more years of large losses to share (probably decreasing yearly and will be much reduced once the Red Bull stadium opens).

So MLS teams are a good ways off from NHL franchises. MLS went from 3 main operators of teams a few years ago to 10 for the 13 teams this season. Many own both MLS and NHL (Kings, Avalanche, Maple Leafs, Blues).

Top teams in Europe sell for up to a billion dollars, so MLS is a good ways off.

Then 72nd ranking is total BS. MLS doesn't get meaningful games against European and South American teams. MLS has extreme parity. Most leagues are 2-3 teams top-heavy making comparison difficult. MLS is improving and gaining respect worldwide. It's not yet close to rivaling top leagues.

Outside of 5 or so players, the rest of MLS players make less than your average to minimum NHL player.

TV ratings are pretty low for both leagues from what I can tell. Neither is part of the mainstream sports discussion anymore (i.e. national tv discussion), both have some decent local coverage, MLS in about half its markets.

MLS is making a good impression in new markets - Salt Lake, Houston, Toronto. MLS has burned bridges with soccer fans in established markets outside of DC, LA, and maybe Chicago. MLS does ok in Dallas and Columbus (the latter faltering some with a bad run). MLS has done little advertising lately in Denver, Kansas City, New England and New York (NJ). Your low-profile average starters in MLS today are in a different league than those 10 years ago. The younger players coming up are showing noticeably better skill. MLS didn't work initially and new model towards profitability of building stadiums is slowly working. Not that the profits are expected to be much for a while.

MLS has Hispanic fans (those from "soccer" countries) as a crucial part of the fanbase. MLS hasn't convinced the bulk of that demo, who still follow foreign leagues.

Bottom line is that NHL/MLS is a difficult comparison. I think MLS is narrowing the gap, but the gap remains quite large and will remain large as long as the NHL remains stable. Your average person on the street can probably name roughly the same # of MLS and NHL players - next to none. MLS may close the gap in non-gameday revenue over time, but the NHL will probably have 2-3x the # of games with 2x the ticket costs for some time. MLS relies on concerts, etc to make the stadiums profitable.
 

GarretJoseph*

Guest
T.V. ratings for MLS coverage is not good. ESPN, ESPN2 and ABC broadcast these games on Saturday afternoons, during baseball season. Ratings are extremely comperable to NHL viewership.

The average salary in MLS is 36,000 per year. Each team has one player that can earn the maximum, which is $286,000.

Things about MLS:
-51% of each team is owned by MLS
-from 1996 to present, Columbus, LA, Dallas, Chicago and Colorado have built soccer specific stadiums (25,000)

The MLS is the 72nd best league in the world...horrible!

But, they are not bankrupt. Stadiums have been built and now is their time to take a risk (Beckham) to get their attendance numbers up. Average attendance is 12,000 per game across the league. Problem is, is that 12,000 looks like 1,200 in Giants Stadium, Invesco Field (up to this year), RFK, Arrowhead, etc.

The game will never attract TV viewership in America. The only hope for it to survive is through ticket sales. Once the entire league is playing in soccer specific stadiums, I think it will stick...but NOT because of T.V.!


90% of what you just wrote is BS & False.
 

GarretJoseph*

Guest
Average attendance numbers do NOT equate to actual ticket sales revenue.

NO WAY...NO WAY are they averaging above 15,000 per game.

72nd...
Currently, according to IFFHS, MLS is ranked only 72 in the top world leagues:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_League_Soccer

Salaries:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/sports/mls/longterm/2006/mls.salaries.html

51% ownership
http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache...f+mls,+51%+ownership&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1

Bottom line...do NOT question my intelligence re: the MLS!

IFFHS ? LMAO!!!! Wow, do you actually know anything about soccer or are you just diggin up crap on the net?
 

GarretJoseph*

Guest
This portland dude needs to talk a walk and leave this forum. He's a parasite planted here by a MLS forum...or wait those probably don't excist. I'll let facts speak for themselfs. Hockey is no.4 in the USA..300 million it's still going to have a solid fan base. Rangers sell out every game there mr.nyr display pic. Don't be so negative, your disowning facts based on ignorance.

I enjoy Portlands posts. Can't say the same for you though.
 

GarretJoseph*

Guest
I'm a fan of European club soccer, I love watching the Champions League every year and the FA Cup, etc. But I just don't get excited about MLS. Everything about MLS just feels manufactured. It has a good group of businessmen behind it and it's amazing what they've done thus far. But to me it's like really getting into the ECHL, it's fine on the regional level but I doubt it will ever get national attention.

No kid grows up playing soccer dreaming of playing in the MLS. I saw the MLS Draft televised and I couldn't tell you how sad it looked. Does the international soccer community give it much respect? Adding Beckham may be good for ratings for the first couple months, but it's a gimmick. He's past his prime and his prime wasn't even that amazing, I'd compare it to Joe Nieuwendyk going to play in the SEL five years ago (if Joe was hyped beyond all hype). It didn't work the first time around when the Cosmos brought in Pele.

MLS brings in 15K fans a game for 32 games per team a year for about 2.9M tickets sold each season. The NHL on the other hand sells approximately 21M tickets at higher prices. I really don't understand the comparison.

I guess you missed Real Madrid's last game where Beckham scored a sweet sweet goal & led Madrid to a victory.

Stop talking nonsense & watch the games. Beckham is no where near Joe's age.
 

GarretJoseph*

Guest
I would also like to point out that nobody here is saying MLS is a better league than NHL or that Soccer/Football is better than Hockey.

I know quite a lot about Soccer & Hockey & while I see a lot of truth when you guys post about Hockey, I see pure BS when your posting about MLS in THIS thread.

Some of the biggest clubs in soccer are becoming partners with MLS clubs such as Arsenal FC (Colorado) & Real Madrid (Salt Lake City)
 

AVSfan2daMAX

Registered User
Nov 24, 2006
4,742
5,312
Since some of you guys show lots of knowledge about MLS can someone help me out with the single intetity (or whatever it is), I'm sorta confused about it. Like do teams negociate contracts with the players or is it the league (since players are employed by the league)
 

undraftedstlouis

Registered User
Sep 11, 2004
668
0
What MLS does with contracts is officially usually secretive. But over the last few years it's pretty well known that the teams themselves do almost all the negotiation. There are various salary budget and roster rules that have to be obeyed. The league has final say-so over the contracts and all contracts are officially between the player and the league. But you won't find the league doing much without team approval and if the teams stay within reason you won't see much objection from the league over proposed deals.

When the league first started it may have at times signed players and basically said "someone's taking this guy" or disapproved raises for some players (I think Tony Sanneh was the prominent case). There are still a few odd rules around but the power is mostly in the teams hands now.
 

Rocket

Registered User
Feb 3, 2007
297
0
New York, USA
Incidentally, are you the same Rocket from Bigsoccer?

No. I hope he didn't copyright the username. Seriously, he's one my favorite Bigsoccer posters who I've learned a lot from. Unfortunately, for some reason he doesn't post nearly as much as he used to. :(
 
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