NHL players with the worst English

Plural

Registered User
Mar 10, 2011
33,703
4,853

ICanMotteBelieveIt

Registered User
Jan 11, 2013
8,443
4,978
EF EPI 2018 – Finland

You're right. Currently occupying #8 spot in English proficiency index. Finland only has the highest proficiency ranking and is largely viewed having one of the best education system on the planet. But yeah, they obviously suck.

EF English Proficiency Index - Wikipedia
I live in Sweden and I've been to Finland many times.

A lot of finns speak english, but they're not very good at it. And I'm not just talking about the accents.

Stop bitching, Christ.
 

Plural

Registered User
Mar 10, 2011
33,703
4,853
I live in Sweden and I've been to Finland many times.

A lot of finns speak english, but they're not very good at it. And I'm not just talking about the accents.

Stop *****ing, Christ.

I live in Finland, so. And like I said before, Swedes speak better English but the Finns rank superbly high in english proficiency too. What a weird argument to even have. Compared to pretty much every other country besides Sweden Finns speak excellent English. You're just talking out of your ass.

Edit: And I was specifically talking about young people. Under 25 year old Finns generally speak very good English.
 

Garl

Registered User
Oct 7, 2006
8,019
1,013
Kucherov has been in North America a lot longer.

Doesnt play anymore, but Holmstrom was bad. I know learning another language isn't easy, but Lidstrom sounded north American while you could tell Holmstrom wasn't. Even at the end of his career

Kucherov's mom is an english teacher I believe. He spoke good english before eaving Russia.
 

Atas2000

Registered User
Jan 18, 2011
13,601
3,269
Not only in Germany but in Spain too and in some other continental European countries. As a person from a European country where this practice doesn't occur it justs seems so utterly bizarre. I can't wrap my head around it. It's blatant artistic infringement. You make a movie what it is not. I can understand why you dub My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic for 8 year old kids who can't read properly or fast enough, but for god's flipping sake dubbing movies for adults who can read? What the hell.

I remember when Woody Allen dropped his musical Everyone Says I Love You the distributors in my native country wanted to title it Alla säger jag älskar dig, but Allen refused and made them title it Alla säger I Love You instead. And that's only a title. :laugh: I understand him though, it's his film, he can title it whatever he wants.

Rant over.
Counter rant.

How many languages do you speak? What about movies in languages you don't understand? I bet don't speak russian. Dubbing is perfectly normal. The quality of it is a different question.

Rant over.
 

Atas2000

Registered User
Jan 18, 2011
13,601
3,269
Kucherov's mom is an english teacher I believe. He spoke good english before eaving Russia.
Love those stories. Some people just learn languages easier than others. Period. Kuch seems to be the lucky guy who picks up languages quickly. No matter who your mom is some guys on the other hand can live in a country forever and still have trouble with the language.
 

Atas2000

Registered User
Jan 18, 2011
13,601
3,269
They teach it good.
Not really. It's basically the same level as in Russia and the level of English teaching in Russia leaves a lot to be desired. While Germans should have less trouble with English because of the real close language relationship.
 

Atas2000

Registered User
Jan 18, 2011
13,601
3,269
Swedes definitely have a natural advantage over Finns when it comes to speaking English (as do other Nordics, Norwegians and Danes), but most Finns can understand and write English pretty good. Speaking without an accent or without stumbling over your words is the difficult part because Finnish and English are very different type of languages, English (and Swedish) being a Germanic language, Finnish being a "Finno-Ugric" language. Of course, with experience, the accent and the stumbling usually goes away (as you can see with Finns who have stayed longer in the American continent), and you start thinking about things more in English than by trying to translate Finnish into English, resulting in a more natural flow of speech.

Russians might struggle a bit more than Finns because they not only have an entirely different language, they also have a different alphabet (which is not entirely dissimilar from what is used in the West, but still). Not to mention that Russia is a pretty huge country and you will generally survive in East Europe/Russia as long as you speak Russian, just like an American will survive speaking English as long as he stays in the West. For a Russian to learn English, they have to break out of their comfort zone a little bit.

Finnish and Swedish is only spoken by a small group of people in the world, so it is generally understood that it is best to know other languages as well. If hundreds of millions of people spoke Finnish, I'm not sure if I would feel the need to learn anything more.
I will have to lecture about language families a bit.

Russian belongs to the same language family as English unlike Finnish. So Finnish is in every way but the alphabet way further away from English. And the alphabet is really the smallest hurdle as every Russian knows and can read the latin alphabet.

Your other argument weighs in more. Russian speakers aren't a small community. A lot of people can easily live their lives without having to learn another language but Russian.

On the other hand English is the most taught foreign language in Russia. Still it's not really about teaching. Without practice those bits kids learn at school slip their minds pretty quick.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ivalo

MoeTheHobo

Registered User
Jan 24, 2017
859
1,044
Counter rant.

How many languages do you speak? What about movies in languages you don't understand? I bet don't speak russian. Dubbing is perfectly normal. The quality of it is a different question.

Rant over.
Use subtitles? It's harder to learn a language if you're never exposed to it.
Mini comment over.

Which makes Puljujärvi a curious case, hasn't he watched any movies or played video games growing up? Having a thick accent is one thing, that's just muscle memory after all. My only rational explanation is that he is a bit... thick himself
 

Atas2000

Registered User
Jan 18, 2011
13,601
3,269
Use subtitles? It's harder to learn a language if you're never exposed to it.
Mini comment over.

Which makes Puljujärvi a curious case, hasn't he watched any movies or played video games growing up? Having a thick accent is one thing, that's just muscle memory after all. My only rational explanation is that he is a bit... thick himself
Subtitles can ruin a movie more than bad dubbing IMHO. I on my part always advise to watch the movies you already know in the original language to people who learn languages.

As for how thick Pulju is... a human brain is a complicated machine. Being less qualified in one area doesn't mean a guy is generally thick. Lots of geniouses would come along as Pejorative Slurs way outside their genious area of thought. Very few people are really nearly universally gifted. Most are specialists in some or few areas of intellect.
 

MoeTheHobo

Registered User
Jan 24, 2017
859
1,044
Subtitles can ruin a movie more than bad dubbing IMHO. I on my part always advise to watch the movies you already know in the original language to people who learn languages.

As for how thick Pulju is... a human brain is a complicated machine. Being less qualified in one area doesn't mean a guy is generally thick. Lots of geniouses would come along as ******s way outside their genious area of thought. Very few people are really nearly universally gifted. Most are specialists in some or few areas of intellect.
Well, it's hard comparing, since the difference of quality in subs and dubs may vary quite a lot between countries, not to speak of how cultures differ.

Take my Pulju argument with a grain of salt, I have obviously no proof other than my feeling
 

torniojaws

Registered User
Jan 10, 2017
1,724
1,010
Finland
The culture in Finland tends to direct people with let's say limited interests towards sports. That same group also tends to focus all their efforts into a singular subject at the expense of everything else. Unfortunately professional sports are a very public venue, leading to the impression that Finnish people don't speak English well. The majority of under 40 year olds do speak it well because it is a mandatory subject in the school and especially in the 2nd and 3rd level degree programmes that the majority of Finns take.
 

Edenjung

Registered User
Jun 7, 2018
2,562
2,325
The thing with english in germany is that most kids that learn it (from elementary school onwards) just hesitate to speak it in school, even when the teacher demands it. They don't want to embaress themselves.
I had my prolems with that too in middle school. but then i started watching anime with englisch subtitles (because i did not want to wait for the german subs) and my vocabulary got better. When i left middle school i had a C in englisch. In high school english was boring because it was easy (no grammar anymore :D) and very frustrating to see others struggle to speak in english and always going back to german in class (it was demanded to speak english), they simply lacked the motivation and convidence to speak it and answer questions.
i was fine with talking. My written english is average (a solid b) but my oral skills are superb. i had a oral exam in english for my a-levels (you don't have to if you don't want or if it's not mandatory) and i got an A+ (i just watched a documentation about evangelists in america that a retired english teacher lended me and i talked to her about stuff).
i think it's important to learn the vocabulary (i did that by accident while watching anime subs :D) and then don't hesitate to talk. if you have a presentation don't be embareced if you pronounce something wrong (even if it made me furious at that time) and just talk.

And when you are on vacation just talk to the people. Don't be shy.
I had a wunderfull conversation with an Australian couple on the queen Elizabeth when we where traveling to st. Petersbourg when i was 14, was a cool conversation about what i dislike about apple.

And now i am studying psychology in the netherlands in english :D not bad.
But the dutch, swedih,danish, norwegian and finnish speak realy great english.
In those countries even your bus driver speaks fluent english, where in germany most police men don't speak a great english. And the bavarians not even german ;D
but they are cool when you make mistakes, like everybody else i met in the world, where they speak good english.


But to shorten my stand, we learn english and have a huge empathis on grammar and vocabulary but most people don't use the language in their live and so they don't want to talk and are not that fluent speaking it.

And also kids from the "realschule" and "hauptschule" have not a such high standard of education, so they don't learn that good english.


But back to topic.
I think Pulju's english is bad, but understandable :D
 

555Upstairs

Unregistered User
Aug 13, 2016
123
216
Linz, Austria
Use subtitles? It's harder to learn a language if you're never exposed to it.
Mini comment over.

2+ hours of reading subtitles can be quite challenging for lots of people though, for various reasons.

Also, the vast majority of people watch movies for entertainment, not to learn a new language, and those who do likely won't watch the dubbed version anyway.
 

MoeTheHobo

Registered User
Jan 24, 2017
859
1,044
2+ hours of reading subtitles can be quite challenging for lots of people though, for various reasons.

Also, the vast majority of people watch movies for entertainment, not to learn a new language, and those who do likely won't watch the dubbed version anyway.
You'd be amazed how much you learn without noticing or actively trying to learn.
I don't doubt that it's difficult for Puljujärvi to cipher the symbols on the screen :sarcasm:
 

Make

Registered User
Apr 15, 2004
1,616
158
Finland
Are foreign movies & series usually dubbed in North America?

Growing up in Finland, subtitles seem like a natural thing for me. I guess it's the opposite for people who grow up in "dub societies". Never really thought anyone would find subtitles difficult or challenging. Children's movies are a different matter of course. Then there are borderline shows like The Simpsons. I could see some countries dubbing it but luckily enough Finnish tv used subtitles. On the other hand, Disney animations have always been dubbed in Finland and that has never felt off for me. Later on you realize there are some classic voice actor performances in the original English version that are worth seeing too.

Pulju's case is weird for sure. Difficult to understand how he hasn't managed to pick up at least some basic skills considering English is a compulsory subject in Finnish schools. I mean, how has he managed to pass any tests etc.? Kind of worrying that there are a couple of other Finnish prospects with similar if not quite as bad issues.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ivalo

555Upstairs

Unregistered User
Aug 13, 2016
123
216
Linz, Austria
You'd be amazed how much you learn without noticing or actively trying to learn.
I don't doubt that it's difficult for Puljujärvi to cipher the symbols on the screen :sarcasm:
If you have some basic knowledge of that language, then yeah, no doubt.
If starting from scratch though, I don't know, pretty sure watching an entire movie in Albanian with subtitles would'nt improve my language skills even in the slightest...

As for Puljujärvi, I'm sort of with you on that:laugh:
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->