Next perennial bottom feeder

[SheldonJPlankton]

Or do you just want it to look bleak?
Whether you do or do not like them, you can’t deny they have a boat load of talent.
They’re also one of the youngest teams in the league. But hey, if you want them to be bad / judge teams off 6 games...

6 games? Try closer to 70 games.

The Leaf success last season came in the first third of the season with a 20-8 run. Since then, they were 26-20-8 to finish the last 2/3 of last season, 3-4 in the playoffs and 3-2-1 so far this season. That all adds up to 67 games with a 32-26-9 record...the equivalent to 90 points over 82 games.

 

[zharkenby]

New Jersey...

 

[Hockey4Lyfe]

The answer is not the Sharks and thats for sure. In order to be a bottom feeder, you need to have two distinct characteristics

1) Terrible management/ownership
2) team plays in an undesirable city. Either due to the location, or the media circus

Edmonton/NYI/Toronto/Buffalo etc all had both factors. Some had more of 1 than the other, but both were present

San Jose- Good management (borderline great) and a desirable city. No to bot
Minny- Very much yes to 1, but a desirable city. Borderline
Columbus- Ok management, not a desirable city
Winnipeg-alright management, not a desirable city. Drafting might keep them afloat

To be honest, I think it might be Pittsburgh. Management/ownership had made some very bonehead moves the past 5-7 years. Crosby/Malkin/Letang and MAF just keep them great for that long. They have had some good drafting/college ufa pick ups. But once Crosby and Malkin decline, they dont have the good management right now, and Pittsburg is a less than desirable city

Penguins have bad management and ownership but have won 2 of the last 4 Stanley Cups......

You can sit there and harp on the Jack Johnson shit all you want. Trust me that it has been said by every Penguins fan. But 1-2 bad moves doesn’t take away from all the good that they have done. You tell teams that they have to pay Jack Johnson $10 million a year until he’s 60 but you get all the success that the Penguins have had and 31 out of 31 GM’s pay his ass today.

And what in the hell does an undesirable city have to do with anything? More importantly location? Are you trying to say that FA don’t go to the Penguins? Or that the weather forecast plays into them losing and winning?

Yeah Pittsburgh won’t compete when it comes to New York/LA and probably Tampa Bay, but it’s a nice city and shouldn’t be lower than any of the other cities besides those few.

But with all that said, I will agree that the Penguins are def a candidate to be bottom of the barrel for awhile after all of their main pieces leave. But there are a host of teams that can fall into that category.

 

[DarkHorse2]

I think it's either Minnesota, San Jose or Pittsburgh. Minnesota and San Jose are both stacked with older players that they are unlikely to trade to replenish the inventory, which will hurt when they are gone. And people forget just how bad the Penguins were before they lucked into Crosby and piled on high picks after him.

That last year, Crosby had 102 points and they still missed the playoffs.

Once Crosby and Malkin set sail, unless they are traded for windfalls, it's going to be tough sledding, and the change to draft rules won't help them.

 

[Hockey4Lyfe]

Here is the only question that matters though...

Is it worth it to suck for 5 years to be be competitive for the next 20?

I’d much rather go thru that than being middle of the road and never winning a damn thing.

A majority of these teams could learn something from the teams that do it and do it well.

 

[rt]

Zero votes for the Coyotes. I have to assume people just forgot about them. As a fan, I’m hopeful but also very worried. Chayka has signed a bunch of unproven guys to long contracts and we don’t know if it will pay off yet. Kessel is a star but he’s getting older. OEL is the next closest thing. Hayton and Soderberg looked really solid in camp and are trending to be pretty good picks. But I can’t see either being a star player.

That’s my worry with Arizona. In a couple of years when Kessel is old, will the Coyotes have even a single legit star player? Anyone who’s arguably elite? I don’t see one on the roster or in the system. I see some good players. But nothing great.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

LA Kings

 

[BMOK33]

Minnesota Columbus Chicago are all good candidates at the moment

 

[Magic Mittens]

Hold my beer says Dallas

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I mean, at some point Pittsburgh's probably going to be bad. Once Sid and Geno are gone, that's likely when. It just seems weird they'd even be mentioned in a thread asking who the next perennial bottom feeder is going to be considering that time for the Pens likely won't occur for another 5 seasons or so.

 

[Aceboogie]

Penguins have bad management and ownership but have won 2 of the last 4 Stanley Cups......

You can sit there and harp on the Jack Johnson **** all you want. Trust me that it has been said by every Penguins fan. But 1-2 bad moves doesn’t take away from all the good that they have done. You tell teams that they have to pay Jack Johnson $10 million a year until he’s 60 but you get all the success that the Penguins have had and 31 out of 31 GM’s pay his ass today.

And what in the hell does an undesirable city have to do with anything? More importantly location? Are you trying to say that FA don’t go to the Penguins? Or that the weather forecast plays into them losing and winning?

Yeah Pittsburgh won’t compete when it comes to New York/LA and probably Tampa Bay, but it’s a nice city and shouldn’t be lower than any of the other cities besides those few.

But with all that said, I will agree that the Penguins are def a candidate to be bottom of the barrel for awhile after all of their main pieces leave. But there are a host of teams that can fall into that category.

Bad management wins some cups from time to time. Its easy to do when you have the 2 best players in the league. The Pens management isnt terrible, but that look below average based on past moves. Moving for Johnson AND Gudbranson screams lack of direction. Or at very minimum that their priorities are super out of whack

Undesirable cities play massive roles lol In both acquiring UFAS and not overpaying to resign your own players. If you pair up below average management and undesirable city, you have a receipt for a bottom feeder. Currently Crosby and Malkin are still giving that team a great chance of winning. But once they go, the team is left with a pretty average roster that will require alot of moves by management. And if that management is going to make JJ/Gudbranson style moves, things dont look too good.

Who knows, maybe they get new management. I can only comment on whos there now.

 

[Hockey4Lyfe]

Bad management wins some cups from time to time. Its easy to do when you have the 2 best players in the league. The Pens management isnt terrible, but that look below average based on past moves. Moving for Johnson AND Gudbranson screams lack of direction. Or at very minimum that their priorities are super out of whack

Undesirable cities play massive roles lol In both acquiring UFAS and not overpaying to resign your own players. If you pair up below average management and undesirable city, you have a receipt for a bottom feeder. Currently Crosby and Malkin are still giving that team a great chance of winning. But once they go, the team is left with a pretty average roster that will require alot of moves by management. And if that management is going to make JJ/Gudbranson style moves, things dont look too good.

Who knows, maybe they get new management. I can only comment on whos there now.

Weird. I didn’t know having 2 great players is the only way to win a cup. Or that those 2 are the only ones playing.

And provide me an example of Pittsburgh ever having to greatly overpay anyone to get them to play for them? Or even overpaying their own to get them to stay?

 

[The90]

6 games? Try closer to 70 games.

The Leaf success last season came in the first third of the season with a 20-8 run. Since then, they were 26-20-8 to finish the last 2/3 of last season, 3-4 in the playoffs and 3-2-1 so far this season. That all adds up to 67 games with a 32-26-9 record...the equivalent to 90 points over 82 games.

Lol. You should put some money on that.

 

[kings11]

LA Kings

I'll raise you a Bluejacket... You guys swung for the fences and ate shit, good luck buddy

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

Ebbs and flows. Central was a monster, it'll need to cycle down soon. Dallas, Minnesota and Winnipeg are at risk of joining Chicago. 'Peg at risk imo because they've kept the same management and coaching for so long without winning, a shakeup could result in a big team shakeup and those are risky. Dallas and Minnesota are just old and not delivering enough, they're due for a rebuild.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

I'll raise you a Bluejacket... You guys swung for the fences and ate ****, good luck buddy

i don’t think upsetting the #1 seed in the NHL in a sweep and losing in 6 games to the EC Champs is “eating shit.”

Nice reply though. Nothing better than a “no u” on HF debates.

 

[Didalee Hed]

Kind of a tough call. It really requires a team with good but not elite talent on the way out due to age starting out by establishing a trend of really poor front office decisions (such as from a GM who's poor but getting lots of slack, or a meddling owner, or whatever). Then one has to couple that with several drafts going really poorly, and a few Inexplicable Trades that go even worse.

The closest we've gotten to seeing that latter show up recently was Minnesota, but they quickly amputated so the patient may have been saved. Montreal might have been a candidate, except the Domi trade actually worked. Pittsburgh under Rutherford have had some dubious-looking moments in the market lately, but they've got too many elite guys for things to go south. Dallas just picked up Heiskanen, so they may still have hope. Half the PHWA have already printed their eulogies for Columbus, but the Jackets are doing too well in the draft and still have too many good young players despite high-profile departures. Similar considerations exist for Winnipeg. And so on.

My best guess, if I had a gun to my head and had to pick one team? Detroit. I just think the rebuild will take a long time, even with Stevie Y present. But I would not be at all shocked if they end up making that pick look dumb in short order. There's just too many variables.

You started in on it with the text I have bolded above...

It takes a strange sort of talented incompetence to be that hopeless.

...and then basically name the culprit outright with this spot on description of Jim Benning.

 

[Nharris31]

I think it's either Minnesota, San Jose or Pittsburgh. Minnesota and San Jose are both stacked with older players that they are unlikely to trade to replenish the inventory, which will hurt when they are gone. And people forget just how bad the Penguins were before they lucked into Crosby and piled on high picks after him.
View attachment 264491
That last year, Crosby had 102 points and they still missed the playoffs.

Once Crosby and Malkin set sail, unless they are traded for windfalls, it's going to be tough sledding, and the change to draft rules won't help them.

I mean it’s not like the Wild are going to sign one of the top players in KHL after his contracts ends or anything

 

[kings11]

i don’t think upsetting the #1 seed in the NHL in a sweep and losing in 6 games to the EC Champs is “eating ****.”

Nice reply though. Nothing better than a “no u” on HF debates.

Giving up as much as you guys did instead of selling set your team back a few years...
But yeah, you go and celebrate your 4th-7th place finish it was so worth it

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I think it's either Minnesota, San Jose or Pittsburgh. Minnesota and San Jose are both stacked with older players that they are unlikely to trade to replenish the inventory, which will hurt when they are gone. And people forget just how bad the Penguins were before they lucked into Crosby and piled on high picks after him.
View attachment 264491
That last year, Crosby had 102 points and they still missed the playoffs.

Once Crosby and Malkin set sail, unless they are traded for windfalls, it's going to be tough sledding, and the change to draft rules won't help them.

Piled on high picks after him? You mean one -- 2nd overall Jordan Staal -- immediately after Crosby was drafted? Doesn't seem to be piling on high picks AFTER Crosby was drafted.

 

[ZeHockeyFan]

Dallas won’t be able to withstand a full-scale, long-term rebuild.

At best, they are the #3 ticket in town moving forward. Likely #4 behind the Rangers as it’s still a non-traditional hockey market compared to baseball.

With the Cowboys being the Cowboys from September to December/January, and the Mavericks being exciting as hell now with Doncic and Porzingis, Stars fandom will slowly dissipate and ratings can tank given the better sports alternatives in town. The Stars bottom line will be hit with the exodus.

Conclusion: no chance in hell ownership gives management the green light for a long rebuild.

Which is why "Perpetual mediocrity" is the more likely outcome.

 

[Gurglesons]

Bad management wins some cups from time to time. Its easy to do when you have the 2 best players in the league. The Pens management isnt terrible, but that look below average based on past moves. Moving for Johnson AND Gudbranson screams lack of direction. Or at very minimum that their priorities are super out of whack

Undesirable cities play massive roles lol In both acquiring UFAS and not overpaying to resign your own players. If you pair up below average management and undesirable city, you have a receipt for a bottom feeder. Currently Crosby and Malkin are still giving that team a great chance of winning. But once they go, the team is left with a pretty average roster that will require alot of moves by management. And if that management is going to make JJ/Gudbranson style moves, things dont look too good.

Who knows, maybe they get new management. I can only comment on whos there now.

Management that signed JJ and traded for Gudbranson will be gone before Malkin, Sid or Letang retires.

What a dumb take.

 

[eviohh26]

California . All of em.

 

[robsenz]

Ottawa will have 5 seasons of unparalleled success being the bottom feeder of the league.

 

[Aceboogie]

Management that signed JJ and traded for Gudbranson will be gone before Malkin, Sid or Letang retires.

What a dumb take.

I clearly said I can only comment on the management they have now. Do they not teach reading comp in the US?