New team in Trois-Rivières, Qc in 2020

[Adam Michaels]

Another Story here "Cohabitation at the Colosseum: "I don't believe in it," says Daniel Lamarre"

Cohabitation au Colisée : « Je n’y crois pas », dit Daniel Lamarre

Yea, I mentioned this a few posts up where I talk about the university team making their presentation.

Lamarre, who is CEO of Cirque du Soleil said that he doesn't think the way the facility is made that it supports sharing the arena. He said that renovations will need to be made in order to accomodate both teams and said that it would cost up to 2-million $.

He also stated that he has worked with the Groupe CH as the Cirque du Soleil run many shows at the Bell Center. So he thinks highly of the organization. He said that if the city voted for it, he wouldn't stand in the way if the Canadiens are involved.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

The Growlers were announced way later than January. So not sure why there is no chance for them to play next season.

There is a big difference between being approved and being announced. The Growlers were conditionally granted an ECHL franchise in late January, but the team was announced in March. League approval of a team is not the last step.

 

[Centrum Hockey]

There is a big difference between being approved and being announced. The Growlers were conditionally granted an ECHL franchise in late January, but the team was announced in March. League approval of a team is not the last step.

In theory could a local ownership group buy a team like Brampton and suspended operations with a plan to resume in 2021-2022 in Trois-Rivières

 

[210]

In theory could a local ownership group buy a team like Brampton and suspended operations with a plan to resume in 2021-2022 in Trois-Rivières

Absolutely.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

In theory could a local ownership group buy a team like Brampton and suspended operations with a plan to resume in 2021-2022 in Trois-Rivières

In theory, yes.

But there probably isn't much point doing that. They'd start at the same time either way, so it's not like they'd be able to relocate and start play for next year.

Buying and relocating a team in trouble like Brampton is a more complex matter than acquiring an expansion franchise. Even if the total costs are less expensive than an expansion franchise, it's likely more trouble than it's worth.

 

[210]

In theory, yes.

But there probably isn't much point doing that. They'd start at the same time either way, so it's not like they'd be able to relocate and start play for next year.

Buying and relocating a team in trouble like Brampton is a more complex matter than acquiring an expansion franchise. Even if the total costs are less expensive than an expansion franchise, it's likely more trouble than it's worth.

They could if the new owners have already been through the league's vetting process.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

They could if the new owners have already been through the league's vetting process.

And have they? Would the league even grant them the ability to buy the franchise to relocate to T-R the mayor and the arena don't even want them there?

 

[210]

And have they? Would the league even grant them the ability to buy the franchise to relocate to T-R the mayor and the arena don't even want them there?

You said "so it's not like they'd be able to relocate and start play for next year.", which is untrue had a buyer already been through the ECHL's vetting process.

The two issues you bring up now have nothing to do with your previous statement.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

In theory could a local ownership group buy a team like Brampton and suspended operations with a plan to resume in 2021-2022 in Trois-Rivières

You said "so it's not like they'd be able to relocate and start play for next year.", which is untrue had a buyer already been through the ECHL's vetting process.

The two issues you bring up now have nothing to do with your previous statement.

That was referencing Centrum asking if it’s possible for them to relocate and suspend operations for next season before starting play again. I included it above. It’s one you even responded to.

So in fact it’s two issues that are extremely relevant.

 

[210]

I realize you're grasping at anything you can to be right but follow along here...

It is possible under Centrum's scenario that Brampton could be moved for 2021, and I in fact agreed with him before you posted.

Your assertion of "it's not like they'd be able to relocate and start play for next year" is incorrect. Anyone approved by the ECHL to purchase a team could, in theory, move them to Trois-Rivières and have them play in 20-21. Now obviously there would be a ton of hoops for an ownership group to do that, but the fact remains it is still possible for it to happen.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

I realize you're grasping at anything you can to be right but follow along here...

It is possible under Centrum's scenario that Brampton could be moved for 2021, and I in fact agreed with him before you posted.

Your assertion of "it's not like they'd be able to relocate and start play for next year" is incorrect. Anyone approved by the ECHL to purchase a team could, in theory, move them to Trois-Rivières and have them play in 20-21. Now obviously there would be a ton of hoops for an ownership group to do that, but the fact remains it is still possible for it to happen.

I'll take this through you step by step [MOD]

Centrum stated a scenario where a team like Brampton was bought, took a year off, and then resumed play after relocating to Trois-Rivières.

In theory could a local ownership group buy a team like Brampton and suspended operations with a plan to resume in 2021-2022 in Trois-Rivières

I then said that it is a possible scenario, but it is unlikely given that McDonald wanted to start for this upcoming season. In Centrum's scenario, it's a 2021-22 start date. In real life, it's likely a 2021-22 start. I then said that there are troubles with relocating a team as opposed to buying one fresh, and that it's unlikely that Centrum's hypothetical happens because the start dates would be the same anyways. The situation would be different if in Centrum's scenario there was no year taken off, and that those costs might actually be worth it.

In theory, yes.

But there probably isn't much point doing that. They'd start at the same time either way, so it's not like they'd be able to relocate and start play for next year.

Buying and relocating a team in trouble like Brampton is a more complex matter than acquiring an expansion franchise. Even if the total costs are less expensive than an expansion franchise, it's likely more trouble than it's worth.

In theory, yes.

But there probably isn't much point doing that. They'd start at the same time either way, so it's not like they'd be able to relocate and start play for next year.

Buying and relocating a team in trouble like Brampton is a more complex matter than acquiring an expansion franchise. Even if the total costs are less expensive than an expansion franchise, it's likely more trouble than it's worth.

In theory, yes.

But there probably isn't much point doing that. They'd start at the same time either way, so it's not like they'd be able to relocate and start play for next year.

Buying and relocating a team in trouble like Brampton is a more complex matter than acquiring an expansion franchise. Even if the total costs are less expensive than an expansion franchise, it's likely more trouble than it's worth.

[MOD]

 

[210]

You keep ignoring the fact you posted "it's not like they'd be able to relocate and start play for next year".

That's incorrect. There is nothing you can say that will make that statement correct.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

You keep ignoring the fact you posted "it's not like they'd be able to relocate and start play for next year".

That's incorrect. There is nothing you can say that will make that statement correct.

Well, I'm not surprised in the slightest that you still haven't read anything that anyone has said. For the final time, if you even read a small part of anything that's been going on, it could not have been more clearly about that hypothetical buying of Brampton and relocating them rather than any real life restriction of a relocation. You clearly enjoy being the type of person that isolates statements and completely ignores what they're a part of and what they're referencing. I wish you well on that.

 

[210]

This is essentially a recap of the last few posts...
You: 1+1=5
Me: That's not correct
You: But I posted all this other stuff that has nothing to do with 1+1=5.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

This is essentially a recap of the last few posts...
You: 1+1=5
Me: That's not correct
You: But I posted all this other stuff that has nothing to do with 1+1=5.

It is now hilarious that you still think that I was talking about the real life situation and not Centrum's hypothetical situation. Especially when it was taken through step by step, showing exactly how I was talking about Centrum's hypothetical situation and not at all the real life situation, and you couldn't be bothered to read it all the way through. That's dedication on your part.

What's even more hilarious that even if you were right and I was talking about the real life situation and not Centrum's hypothetical situation, then I would still be right. "We lost the ability to ice a team next year": The status of the bid for an ECHL team in Trois-Rivières

 

[210]

Even in a hypothetical situation, you'd still be wrong. And they missed the deadline for an expansion team, not for one relocating.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

Even in a hypothetical situation, you'd still be wrong. And they missed the deadline for an expansion team, not for one relocating.

And that it wouldn't matter because, as I will say for the final time, that the hypothetical situation that Centrum brought forward had them take a year off and miss this upcoming season, and the expansion scenario in real life won't be for this upcoming season either.

And if you read the article, you would have clearly seen Dean McDonald say "To me there is some comfort in actually not being on that ice next year. Because it gives us more time to prepare, and gives the city a chance to look at what they’ve got on their hands. It could change the tone and tenor of the discussion because they’ll start realizing that this wasn’t quite what they were expecting with a $16-million facility. We’ve already invested a lot of time and resources into the project and if at the end of the day, the city doesn’t want us, well, we respect that decision. It’s not the end of the world, that’s for sure. We just can’t be pushing it uphill. It doesn’t feel right.”

Dean McDonald is not putting a team on that ice in 2020-2021. But then again, after this whole thing I really shouldn't have expected you to read through anything.

 

[Royalsflagrunner77]

Do the fact the Expansion deadline is passed . This could benefit them by being able to build a solid marketing foot hold over the next year build a season ticket holder base maybe even host a preseason game between Brampton and Newfounland . To show case the league and peak interest for fans in the area .

 

[Growlers]

Newfoundland business executive Dean MacDonald was gracious enough with his time when interviewed by Eyes On The Prize that the amount of content was sufficient to be split over a series of articles. In Part I, he discussed the relationship with the city of Trois-Rivières as he prepares his proposal for a bid to own a second ECHL franchise.
“I think that the health of the [ECHL] is strong,” said MacDonald. “The quality of hockey is exceptional. The league has certainly gone through a metamorphosis over the last few years, where most teams have an affiliation with an NHL club now. We’ve really become a development league. And so we’re seeing a lot of prospects, which obviously makes for better hockey. It’s a very fast game. It’s a great product.”

ECHL brand identity and lessons learned with St. John’s
As talks continue for an expansion team in Trois-Rivières, we asked if he was concerned at all about the area’s lack of familiarity with the ECHL brand, and if there were any lessons learned from the Newfoudland Growlers expansion team in St. John’s that could be ported over to Trois-Rivières.
“In St. John’s no one knew what to expect. I think there was a little ‘show me’ required. Certainly things started to change significantly when Toronto brass began visiting and assessing players on a regular basis. Kyle Dubas came over a number of times. We worked closely with Laurence Gilman and Mike Dixon from the development team. So, you know, when they were in town and doing interviews and they were talking about all of the prospects there, suddenly everyone started to realize that, ‘wow, the Leafs are investing in this, it must be good hockey.’

“Then things really kicked off around the playoffs and then suddenly pandemonium ensued. So it took a little bit of time. Then we continued to build brand when the Leafs had their training camp in St. John’s.

“So look, it’s just like with anything: it takes time. People were worried that this was just another team that would raise anchors and move, but the model in the ECHL is different because we actually own the team so the team’s not going anywhere unless we so choose. So now we have signed a 10-year lease with the municipal arena and people know we’re here to stay.”

On whether they would use existing IP, or try to develop a new identity
“Will we wear the blue, blanc, rouge? Absolutely. You also want to create some uniqueness in the community. Trois-Rivières has a rich hockey history. It is the birthplace of Jean Béliveau, and had many citizens go through to the NHL. We’ve been working closely with Marc-André Bergeron on the ground, and it will it have its challenges, like any startup, but one of the things that were essential from our perspective was the relationship with the Canadiens.”

Source: "We wouldn’t go into that market without the Canadiens": Dean MacDonald on the plans for an ECHL team in Trois-Rivières

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

Gilles Courteau suggère la ECHL pour le nouveau Colisée de Trois-Rivières
As with most of the articles about Trois-Rivières so far, it is only available in French. I've posted some English translations.

Even the commissioner of the QMJHL thinks Trois-Rivières should go with the ECHL. When asked about whether there was space for both the (mayor-)preferred UQTR Patriotes and an ECHL team: There is space for the two. University hockey is also a great option for our graduates. I am hearing that there are steps being taken to give Québec its own proper university circuit. It would be very interesting. He also said: It has been some years, there was an opportunity at St. John's to relocate a QMJHL franchise and no one showed in interest. I did a tour of the teams one by one and the longest meeting on the subject was seven minutes. For Trois-Rivières, in this moment, the best option, it's the ECHL.

 

[Drake88]

I think TR would be a tremendous way to expand the ECHL brand. Between possibly having another enthusiastic NHL partner and the leagues first French city, I think it would would be very beneficial for the league.

However, with all the controversy over TR and talk of Growlers ownership wanting another team it got me thinking. If TR falls through, could you see Newfoundland ownership purchasing Brampton?

As Brampton reaches the end of their agreement with the city, there has been a lot of speculation (rightfully so), that this is their last year. I believe I read that owning another team, specifically one in Canada, would be very advantageous for the Growlers as they would not have to pay the travel costs when they visit Newfoundland. Instead of focusing on building an expansion team, maybe they pick a reclamation process and set up another NHL/AHL/ECHL Canadian partnership.

Both Montreal and Ottawa have either had/have relationships with Brampton already. If a committed group that has proven they can build a great NHL/ECHL model takes over, I could see Brampton becoming attractive. Just a thought.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

I think TR would be a tremendous way to expand the ECHL brand. Between possibly having another enthusiastic NHL partner and the leagues first French city, I think it would would be very beneficial for the league.

However, with all the controversy over TR and talk of Growlers ownership wanting another team it got me thinking. If TR falls through, could you see Newfoundland ownership purchasing Brampton?

As Brampton reaches the end of their agreement with the city, there has been a lot of speculation (rightfully so), that this is their last year. I believe I read that owning another team, specifically one in Canada, would be very advantageous for the Growlers as they would not have to pay the travel costs when they visit Newfoundland. Instead of focusing on building an expansion team, maybe they pick a reclamation process and set up another NHL/AHL/ECHL Canadian partnership.

Both Montreal and Ottawa have either had/have relationships with Brampton already. If a committed group that has proven they can build a great NHL/ECHL model takes over, I could see Brampton becoming attractive. Just a thought.

I cannot see the league allowing or approving an existing owner to own or operate more than one franchise, without endangering the existing franchise, knowing how hard it was for Deacon and MacDonald to establish the Growlers....

We've seen that scenario before, where the operator of one franchise then starts working for another franchise in the same league, notably Bridgeport and Worcester, that's why the Blues ended up defaulting to being an owner operator, instead of private ownership.

the other caveat would be is Toronto or Montreal willing to own an ECHL franchise if it comes to that crossroad where the ECHL says not allowed to own/operate franchises as we've seen in higher leagues, knowing the costs of establishing a franchise in a given league.

 

[210]

We've seen that scenario before, where the operator of one franchise then starts working for another franchise in the same league, notably Bridgeport and Worcester, that's why the Blues ended up defaulting to being an owner operator, instead of private ownership.

Hey, look, Hutch getting another thing about Worcester hockey wrong!!!!

The Blues decided to buy the IceCats because they wanted to make sure the team stayed here. This was the place they wanted their affiliation, actually turning down a +$1M a year offer to affiliate with the Kansas City Blades just prior to buying the franchise, and not liking the other potential ownership groups decided to exercise their option to buy the IceCats.

And before you say that's not what happened, many of these facts were reported by Bill Ballou in several stories that appeared in the Worcester Telegram during September 2001.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Hey, look, Hutch getting another thing about Worcester hockey wrong!!!!

The Blues decided to buy the IceCats because they wanted to make sure the team stayed here. This was the place they wanted their affiliation, actually turning down a +$1M a year offer to affiliate with the Kansas City Blades just prior to buying the franchise, and not liking the other potential ownership groups decided to exercise their option to buy the IceCats.

And before you say that's not what happened, many of these facts were reported by Bill Ballou in several stories that appeared in the Worcester Telegram during September 2001.

YEAH, RIGHT, AND YOU CLAIM that the Railers won't be relocated in the same manner that the previous franchises were, where's the hockey team in Kansas City, 210, not KC, but Independence, so how are we supposed to believe a columnist who's no longer active to gain clickbait, much like your blog is the same thing

 

[Growlers]

I think the next meeting with Dean and the city is tomorrow night where he can present his proposal. I would not be surprised if Brampton moves there. That would be better than folding all together.