NCAA derides California bill to allow athletes income for image/name (SB 206)

[BKIslandersFan]

It's still dumb because you have to create rules for a level playing field of 353 Division I schools, covering 88 different sports (while abiding by Title IX).

The idea that USC wouldn't line up boosters who owned businesses to sign EVERY FOOTBALL RECRUIT up to endorsement contracts so USC can basically bribe recruits into picking USC is pure madness. It's going to happen and it can't be policed. And California is saying "That's okay."

Why? There is no such thing as level playing field in NCAA already.

 

[GindyDraws]

why are the players are the only ones that have to follow puritanical amateurism? if you want true amateurism then make coaches volunteer and no sponsorships

Or, have actual physical education teachers or even college professors on campus be the coaches. You know, double duty?

The general problem with colleges and universities is that the larger ones have focused so much on athletics (especially men's basketball and football) that academics have almost become an afterthought in these places. You basically go there, party nonstop, watch sports, then leave. Somehow, the pursuit of higher education and scientific endeavors have been put on the wayside over arbitrary polling placements that determine which teams play in a playoff system at the end of the season, which in reality should be decided by each team picking the toughest competition and proving they're the best by systematically defeating them all.

 

[David Dennison]

California Signs Fair Pay to Play Act Making The State the First Ever to Allow College Athletes to Get Paid | Scriberr News

The NCAA wants to keep the status quo on student-athletes, but with SB 206 signed into law, states could be looking to follow California’s lead on this.

“Florida is next in the list of states following California’s lead, Rep. Chip Lamara is hoping to have a similar proposal drafted this week,” tweeted ESPN staff writer Dan Murphy. “South Carolina and New York have also announced proposals for similar laws since SB206 started getting some publicity.”

Dam could break quickly if enough states pass individual laws. But remember the Cali law has 3 years before it goes into effect, the intent seems to be to get the NCAA to the negotiation table. NCAA doesn't want to go to court because they could lose on a lot of grounds, but they do hold some cards being the regulating entity and representing a lot of public universities. If the NCAA is smart they negotiate some reforms, they lose control of the process if it goes to court.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

All the NCAA has to do is declare any athlete that gets pay ineligible, which is the case already with their existing guidelines.

State law doesn't get broken and NCAA prevents the spread of paying college athletes

 

[gstommylee]

California Signs Fair Pay to Play Act Making The State the First Ever to Allow College Athletes to Get Paid | Scriberr News

Dam could break quickly if enough states pass individual laws. But remember the Cali law has 3 years before it goes into effect, the intent seems to be to get the NCAA to the negotiation table. NCAA doesn't want to go to court because they could lose on a lot of grounds, but they do hold some cards being the regulating entity and representing a lot of public universities. If the NCAA is smart they negotiate some reforms, they lose control of the process if it goes to court.

Not if the state law violates the federal constitution.

 

[LadyStanley]

Hearing that Nevada is possibly considering pursuing similar legislation. (Just as teaser for evening news. Nothing yet in bill form)

 

[KevFu]

why are the players are the only ones that have to follow puritanical amateurism? if you want true amateurism then make coaches volunteer and no sponsorships

It’s called “the veil of ignorance.” John Rawls.

Make a system in which NCAA athletes can legally be paid for endorsements, but can’t be exploited by boosters to lure recruits. You can’t.

SMU is the only major program to get “The Death Penalty.” They are in the news for being ranked in football this week for the first time since it was imposed in 1987. Now, the important thing to note here is that SMU did NOT pay their players. SMU BOOSTERS paid their players.

SMU was terrible for 30 years before they started cheating, but suddenly they landed top recruiting clssses and were a top 5 program. So everyone in college football said “They’re cheating!” The NCAA investigated and they paid recruits, so they got a bowl ban, a TV ban and probation. But they kept winning and the NCAA kept investigating. Turned out, they didn’t bribe recruits, they literally had their roster ON A PAYROLL. So they got busted AGAIN, and got the Death Penalty.


Now, again, SMU Athletics didn’t pay the players. SMU Boosters did. They were Dallas business owners sick of their alma mater being terrible. Everyone viewed SMU as a cheating pariah.

This California law basically says the SMU scandal is okay. Everyone should DO THAT:
“Sign with Cal and you get a $1 million endorsement contract!”

The NHL has a salary cap and revenue sharing and there’s still teams that can never sign a marquee free agent and people complain about THAT. Now imagine the difference between Wofford and Cal when a VP at Google can say “Hey, we’ll sign you to an endorsement deal if you sign with Cal.”

I'm hoping the NCAA finally loses hard on this. Any attempt to punish these schools would be a huge anti-trust violation....

The number of kids who get a $25,000 one-year endorsement check and never make the team/graduate is going to be extremely bad for the athletes and society. This gives control to BOOSTERS, not athletes. And boosters will use kids because they think it will help their alma mater win.

Why? There is no such thing as level playing field in NCAA already.

Just because something isn’t perfectly level doesn’t mean you destroy any chance of it being level. That viewpoint is like saying “people smoke, let’s eliminate the law that says you have to be 18 to buy cigarettes and the law that prevents advertising cigarettes to children.”

The playing field isn’t level because of TV money. But when everyone gets just a scholarship, the inequality is “TV time and how nice your locker room is.” Why add cold hard cash from boosters to the mix.

 

[KevFu]

I'm not saying the NCAA model "Works," I'm simply saying that if you were to start with a blank sheet of paper for an NCAA rule book and think of what would work better, NOTHING works better than the NCAA rule book -- except for "every NCAA athlete gets X percent of the revenue."

People talk about English Soccer lacking competitive balance, and they have 20 teams. Try it with 353.

 

[joelef]

make it entry club sports

 

[sandysan]

Paywall.

Has anyone started that 30 day timer for us? B-)

now what ?

let em sue

Geez who would have ever thought that anything that prevents EVERY SINGLE DIME through the NCAA would be opposed by the NCAA ?

you see those birds up there ? They are coming home to roost. way to go Mr O'Bannon.

 

[David Dennison]

Not if the state law violates the federal constitution.

That's the trick with the law, the NCAA challenging it in court would open up an anti-trust can of worms. Commerce clause isn't ironclad either, especially related to individuals and wages.

California Gov. Gavin Newsom at center of perfect storm for NCAA on name, image, likeness

Best explainer I have read.

On Monday, he recalled his interactions during that time with NCAA officials, including President Mark Emmert.
“They talked about how they wanted to voluntarily engage us,” Newsom said. “Well, they slow-rolled us. And, with respect, they consistently play around the edges of reform. Now, they can’t do that. I think, ultimately, this is going to force their hand. I think invariably, they’re going to have (to) make some significant concessions to the status quo … and while the threat of litigation may overhang, I think reforms are going to be forthcoming despite how stubborn the next year or two may be.”

 

[LadyStanley]

Governor Newsom speaks on law

 

[Saskatoon]

I'm not saying the NCAA model "Works," I'm simply saying that if you were to start with a blank sheet of paper for an NCAA rule book and think of what would work better, NOTHING works better than the NCAA rule book -- except for "every NCAA athlete gets X percent of the revenue."

People talk about English Soccer lacking competitive balance, and they have 20 teams. Try it with 353.

Why do all 353 schools have to be equal? Seems like free market principals that a lot of professors at these schools would be teaching these same athletes.

If someone told me you we have to pay you less than your worth because its not fair to the other businesses that they don't have someone of such good quality you would rightly call bs.

And this isn't even pay - just endorsements.

 

[Voight]

I'm hoping the NCAA finally loses hard on this. Any attempt to punish these schools would be a huge anti-trust violation....

Theoretically could they not kick said schools out of the NCAA and then ban their own schools from facing them?

"And James said that he skipped college because they wouldn’t pay him, and he desperately needed to help his mother financially."

OK no reason to lie, Bron. There was no point in him attending college and even if his mom didn't need the financial help, he was offered 90 million dollars by Nike alone and nobody is going to say "I'd rather attend school for a year than sign that deal..."

& we all know if he did attend college, the back door money would have been huge for him so his mom would have been just fine.

 

[David Dennison]

Theoretically could they not kick said schools out of the NCAA and then ban their own schools from facing them?

That's when it goes into the anti-trust realm, NCAA would be punishing organizations for following state law. If the NCAA was confident in that legal strategy, they would have filed a lawsuit yesterday. But they didnt, so I think they know they stand to lose a lot more if they were to go that route.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

It’s called “the veil of ignorance.” John Rawls.

Make a system in which NCAA athletes can legally be paid for endorsements, but can’t be exploited by boosters to lure recruits. You can’t.

SMU is the only major program to get “The Death Penalty.” They are in the news for being ranked in football this week for the first time since it was imposed in 1987. Now, the important thing to note here is that SMU did NOT pay their players. SMU BOOSTERS paid their players.

SMU was terrible for 30 years before they started cheating, but suddenly they landed top recruiting clssses and were a top 5 program. So everyone in college football said “They’re cheating!” The NCAA investigated and they paid recruits, so they got a bowl ban, a TV ban and probation. But they kept winning and the NCAA kept investigating. Turned out, they didn’t bribe recruits, they literally had their roster ON A PAYROLL. So they got busted AGAIN, and got the Death Penalty.


Now, again, SMU Athletics didn’t pay the players. SMU Boosters did. They were Dallas business owners sick of their alma mater being terrible. Everyone viewed SMU as a cheating pariah.

This California law basically says the SMU scandal is okay. Everyone should DO THAT:
“Sign with Cal and you get a $1 million endorsement contract!”

The NHL has a salary cap and revenue sharing and there’s still teams that can never sign a marquee free agent and people complain about THAT. Now imagine the difference between Wofford and Cal when a VP at Google can say “Hey, we’ll sign you to an endorsement deal if you sign with Cal.”




The number of kids who get a $25,000 one-year endorsement check and never make the team/graduate is going to be extremely bad for the athletes and society. This gives control to BOOSTERS, not athletes. And boosters will use kids because they think it will help their alma mater win.



Just because something isn’t perfectly level doesn’t mean you destroy any chance of it being level. That viewpoint is like saying “people smoke, let’s eliminate the law that says you have to be 18 to buy cigarettes and the law that prevents advertising cigarettes to children.”

The playing field isn’t level because of TV money. But when everyone gets just a scholarship, the inequality is “TV time and how nice your locker room is.” Why add cold hard cash from boosters to the mix.

There is no chance of it ever being level playing field. Stop it. Let players make money off their own goddamn intellectual property.

 

[edog37]

The number of kids who get a $25,000 one-year endorsement check and never make the team/graduate is going to be extremely bad for the athletes and society. This gives control to BOOSTERS, not athletes. And boosters will use kids because they think it will help their alma mater win.

Not everyone wins in society. And why this notion the playing field should be level? And why is it bad for society anyway? It's called being an adult. We need to quit coddling people & develop them to compete...

 

[Voight]

That's when it goes into the anti-trust realm, NCAA would be punishing organizations for following state law. If the NCAA was confident in that legal strategy, they would have filed a lawsuit yesterday. But they didnt, so I think they know they stand to lose a lot more if they were to go that route.

Could they not argue that the schools aren't following their rules? I mean, I guess state and then federal law supersedes an organizations rules but I feel like they could argue that its detrimental and unfair to the rest of the teams in the event no other states follow suit. Could use the "fair play" excuse, I.E. the law gives them an unfair advantage over schools in the other states seeing as players don;t get paid in them.

 

[David Dennison]

Could they not argue that the schools aren't following their rules? I mean, I guess state and then federal law supersedes an organizations rules but I feel like they could argue that its detrimental and unfair to the rest of the teams in the event no other states follow suit. Could use the "fair play" excuse, I.E. the law gives them an unfair advantage over schools in the other states seeing as players don;t get paid in them.

All fair points but the second they punish a school for it, they open themselves up to anti-trust violations. It's the cleverness of how the law was written and the precarious legal position the NCAA finds itself in.

But really this goes one of two ways
1. NCAA agrees to reforms, saves face, looks progressive. Newsome gets a feather in his cap and doesn't have an extended legal battle over an issue that isn't super important in the big scheme of things.
2. NCAA goes nuclear, delays, delays, delays, penalizes, gets sued, counter sues and this all ends up in court for several years and they end up probably losing.

 

[Voight]

I think the 2nd option is the most likely.

NCAA will never agree to reform, they are one of the most archaic organizations in North America, never mind sports. They are the definition of their way or the highway, no ifs ands or buts. They have somewhat infinite resources and probably don't care if this drags out in court for years on end, they are not one to compromise.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Why would there even be a law to prohibit this kind of thing anywhere?

 

[David Dennison]

I think the 2nd option is the most likely.

NCAA will never agree to reform, they are one of the most archaic organizations in North America, never mind sports. They are the definition of their way or the highway, no ifs ands or buts. They have somewhat infinite resources and probably don't care if this drags out in court for years on end, they are not one to compromise.

Yeah and it will probably be to their detriment. The one thing that the NCAA doesn't want to happen is Mark Cuban or someone like him offers to pay 18-22 year olds and creates a mini league of the best prospects. It doesn't make much sense with football (50+ players per team), but is completely workable for basketball where the talent is watered down with 300+ teams in the NCAA and you would only need a dozen players per team.

 

[1989]

Why would there even be a law to prohibit this kind of thing anywhere?

Capitalism works best when other people don't make money, only you.

 

[Voight]

Yeah and it will probably be to their detriment. The one thing that the NCAA doesn't want to happen is Mark Cuban or someone like him offers to pay 18-22 year olds and creates a mini league of the best prospects. It doesn't make much sense with football (50+ players per team), but is completely workable for basketball where the talent is watered down with 300+ teams in the NCAA and you would only need a dozen players per team.

Like LaVar Balls JBA, but run by someone with an actual brain + money behind them.

With the amount of money to be made I would not be shocked to see something like this within the next decade.

 

[cutchemist42]

So just released that Pennsylvania is now looking at this....dominoes falling?