World Cup: National Team threads

Discussion in 'Soccer' started by Evilo, Mar 16, 2017.

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  1. hatterson

    hatterson Registered User

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    Just saw the highlights from the FRA/ESP game.

    Words cannot describe how stupid I think offside reviews are.
     
  2. Power Man

    Power Man Grrrr

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    Only watched the 1st half

    Kurzawa looked lost defensively. Mbappe played it safe but smart

    How did they do in the 2nd?
     
  3. joe89

    joe89 #5

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    The Swedish team was full reserve aswell, only Granqvist remained from the qualifying game. The 2-0 lead was not deserved at all, Portugal had one and a half scoring chance and scored two goals that half.. The game pretty much looked the same all throughout and the score balancing out eventually was justified. Even if the 3-2 own goal on the last kick of the game was cherry on the top.

    That said, I believe some of the players that played tonight are really on their way onto the team. The depth is strong from the U21 winning generation, in some cases the only difference to the starting XI is lack of experience. Both the U19 and U21 teams have qualified for this summer's Euros aswell so even more coming.
     
  4. Power Man

    Power Man Grrrr

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    Busquets on the 2nd goal, DAMN
     
  5. Milos Krasic

    Milos Krasic Ballin' in Poland

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    Neustadter was at fault for all 3 Belgian goals.
     
  6. Evilo

    Evilo Registered User

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    Kurzawa, Rabiot, Tolisso and Jallet were awful. But frankly, save from Griezmann and Mbappé on the few balls they had (and Koscielny who doesn't know what a friendly is), the team was in vacations.
    Saw a bit of the second half and then I quit after the penalty.
     
  7. Corto

    Corto Faceless Man

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    Why? It takes 20 seconds, and ensures teams don't get screwed over by wrong decisions and games aren't swung one way or the other by referees.

    Like the Spanish 2nd goal.
    30 seconds. Literally.

    Why on Earth would anyone not want the right call there?
     
  8. Evilo

    Evilo Registered User

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    I also think it's nice to get a firm opinion, but for instance the first goal was literally inches offside. Don't think this needs overturning. OTOH, the spanish goal was rightfully overturned.
    Remains the penalty decisions, which is often hard to tell even with a replay. And yesterday's was wrong IMO.

    All in all, the video decisions, except for the second spanish goal, were really arguable before the video and still arguable after the decision. I don't mind Griezmann's goal being overturned because he WAS offside, but by so few it didn't warrant a non goal IMO. And the penalty wasn't the right decision.
     
  9. Corto

    Corto Faceless Man

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    I'm not quite following...

    They should only overturn decisions that are offside (or onside) by a LOT, and not close calls?

    If they're doing it, they're doing it for all big calls... I don't have issues with that.

    I'd much rather have 3-4 minute-long breaks in a game and make sure the calls are correct, than "not interrupt the flow of the game" and have one team get shafted and possibly lose a WC game because of a blown call.

    IMO that's the first step to bringing back some integrity into football:
    - step 1 - video replays
    - step 2 - retroactive bans for cheating, faking injuries and diving

    Start with that, and go from there... There's no reason why football wouldn't be better off with steps like that implemented.

    ...

    Every sport has embraced video replays and the fairness that comes with it.
    American football, basketball, hockey, tennis, etc. Every single one.

    Football organizations are the only dinosaurs left who keep telling fans "referee mistakes are a part of the game", without ever doing anything to mitigate or prevent it.
     
  10. Evilo

    Evilo Registered User

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    No what I mean is that refs should really not call for the video review for tight offside decisions that result into goals. In cas of doubt, give the offense the nod.
    OTOH, when a goal is refused and there's a doubt, it's a good thing to ask for video review (Spain's second goal).
    And I'll reiterate that video review sometimes don't make decisions right : case in point the penalty.
     
  11. Corto

    Corto Faceless Man

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    Got any link for the penalty?

    I didn't see the game, just saw the Spain goal and the resulting ref talk-over and decision...

    (but yeah, in general, I agree it's got its own issues...
    in case of fouls it gets a lot more complicated... You could have 9 people saying the Suarez dive vs PSG was a blatant dive - for me it was, but if 1 in 10 people who thinks that should be a pen is deciding on the video replay, things can get messy)
     
  12. Evilo

    Evilo Registered User

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    Yes, fouls are hard. Even offsides can be tough.
    This is why I'd like video review to be used only in specific cases. And by the coaches, not by the ref.
    As I've said numerous times : one challenge per substituion. If you fail a challenge, you can't use a sub.
     
  13. hatterson

    hatterson Registered User

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    Because I don't want it to turn into the garbage the NHL has where we have to zoom in 400x to see if something was a millimeter offside, and that's generally where replay heads over time if it gets a foothold.

    You also have the question of how far back you're allowed to go to call offside. I'm actually not sure what the rule is right now, but I can guarantee that over time people will want to push it back in the play. Guy is offside on a holdup play, but it doesn't lead straight to a goal, but instead it's passed out wide, then crossed in again where someone finishes it, does that get called back because of a missed call 30 seconds earlier? What if it's 5 minutes of solid possession before the goal?

    If you can guarantee it'll only be a 30 second (max) review, and they won't go back further into the play, then I'm alright with it. But when it inevitably begins creeping up in length to micro analyze frames or when a goal gets called back and minutes of play is wiped out, that's where I have an issue.
     
  14. hatterson

    hatterson Registered User

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    I actually would hate it being a risk for the coaches. Granted, that makes it so they don't spam the challenge button (or throw a flag, or whatever way they'd trigger it) but I fundamentally disagree that a coach should have to risk something to overturn a referees mistake.

    To me, either ref mistakes are part of the game or the refs themselves (via the fourth official or some similar mechanism) should correct them.

    Coach has used 2 subs, it's the 85th minute. Defender is running back defensively and pulls a hamstring. Right after that there's a really close offside that leads to a goal. Now the coach is stuck with the decision to be down a goal with 5 minutes left and play the rest of the game with a full squad, or to risk a challenge and if he loses it, still be down a goal but not have a sub left to replace the injured defender.

    Or a situation where all three subs have been used already and then a goal is scored on a play that's miles offside. Coach can't challenge it now cause he's out of subs so I guess his team gets screwed.
     
  15. Duchene2MacKinnon

    Duchene2MacKinnon Dybalascibar

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    Argentina to finally name a president later today. Probably means Bauzo will be gone too, IF(big if) they can find a willing replacement.
     
  16. Luigi Habs

    Luigi Habs Captain Saku

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    The issue with offside video review is that it will serve to disallow an offside goal, but I don't see how it would work if the ref calls offside on a legit goal. Because basically the ref blows the whistle before the ball goes in, so how would the review work? In some cases it's almost instantaneous, but some times, specially when a striker goes on a breakaway, the whistle is blown before he even kicks the ball.

    I think the only stance to use the video review is for penalty calls or red cards. Leave offside calls as is.
     
  17. Corto

    Corto Faceless Man

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    Just putting this out here, to vent.

    Our FA is corrupt, led my Mamic and former-great-player-and-Golden-Boot-turned-toady-FA functioner-and-overall-****-human-being-Davor Suker; everyone knows that by now.

    One of the ways they do business is to arrange friendlies only with weaker opposition and basically sell our appearance somewhere.
    The games are of low quality, with never the "A" side playing (sometimes not even the "B" side) and are never of any use to anyone.
    From the China trip this season for 2 games with a "C" team, to playing Mexico in May in the US with what will likely be the "C" team again, to a pre-EURO game vs Gibraltar as part of the preparation process.

    Well, we just played Estonia. In March. In Estonia. On a horrible pitch. In a pointless friendly.
    With a "B" team sprinkled with some guys that come on as subs for the "A" team (Perisic and Vida were the only starters).
    We lost 3-0 (lol), but noone cared or cares anyway.

    What we did lose was Marko Pjaca, out for 6-8 months with a torn ACL on that horrible pitch.

    ...

    So, yes, f.ck Croatian FA. :rant::rant::rant::rant::rant::rant:
     
  18. Havre

    Havre Registered User

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    "%"%% just saw video of that injury. Not sure if one can blame the pitch, but that is just ridiculously unlucky - even for an ACL tear (which usually is just an unlucky twist of the knee).
     
  19. Corto

    Corto Faceless Man

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    To top it all off, the Croatian FA consored Ivan Perisic's statement after the game (he captained the side for the game).

    Here's Ivan Perisic, to the press, after the game:
    The pitch we played on is unworthy of professional football and there is no point in arranging matches of this kind. I would advise Mr. Šuker to pick better opposition with facilities of higher quality because we can only lose more players on such horrendous surfaces. The biggest defeat of this friendly was losing Pjaca.

    And here's Perisic's statement on the FA's official website:
    ''The hardest thing is what happened to Pjaca, this is our biggest loss. Unfortunately, these conditions, that pitch, is not suited for professional players. The terrain was terrible, but that's not an excuse for this defeat. We had our chances, we did not use them, and the very motivated Estonians used theirs''

    ...

    Dear Lord.
    As much as people here loved Suker for the player he was, they now hate him for the corrupt power hungry piece of sheet he is now.
    (to be clear, by all accounts, he was always a rubbish human being, just that when he played and scored countless goals for the NT and Real/Sevilla, noone cared)
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2017
  20. Havre

    Havre Registered User

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    I don't doubt that the pitch was terrible, but that doesn't mean it caused the injury.

    That said I do agree that high level professional games shouldn't be played on pitches that aren't up to a certain standard.
     
  21. ProPAIN

    ProPAIN I am the DANGER!

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    Gbamin and Boga choose to represent Ivory Coast at international level.

    Thoughts, Evilo? :popcorn:
     
  22. Evilo

    Evilo Registered User

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    Boga lost his career in Chelsea's loan, like many so no big loss. Gbamin probably didn't have a french NT career ahead of him, but he should be a decent defenseman down the line.
    Gbamin is born in ivory coast IIRC, so even if he moved early, I don't see a problem with it so to speak. Don't know at what age he came to France, so maybe he started football there.
    Boga was born in Marseille, never lived in IC, went to french school, learnt his football in France and went through french NT youth selections. Also Boga managed to be recruited by Chelsea without costing them a dime, using the famous "oh, my father suddenly founc a job near Stamford Bridge !" type of deal. That's so outrageously unethical.
    So this guy is a mercenary without any ethics, so i'm not surprised to see him play for a country he's never lived in. And quite happy he didn't amount to anything as well. Too bad because he did have tremendous talent. Maybe if he had stayed in a french academy, he would now be a quality player.
     
  23. Pavel Buchnevich

    Pavel Buchnevich AV AND GORTON OUT

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    This sounds exactly like a few Russian posters in the NHL Draft section when a Russian player goes to NA too early. :laugh:
     
  24. Pavel Buchnevich

    Pavel Buchnevich AV AND GORTON OUT

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    On topic, the USA rarely loses any notable players to anyone, we've only lost a few good players like Subotic and Rossi. But that will change since we are producing more players that other countries want to poach. Its already starting to become a problem for the USA in some of the younger age groups, and thats going to trickle up to the mens team eventually.
     
  25. Cory Trevor

    Cory Trevor Smokes, Let's go

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    Pretty accurate. Was more upset about the Subotic one because I think he's excellent but Rossi, good riddance. Jersey trash will always be Jersey Trash.

    It'll forever be a problem going forward though especially for players for those teams who are better or on a similar level in the world which is roughly 20-40 of them. Teams like Brazil, Argentina, Colombia, Chile, Germany, England, France, Italy, Netherlands, Belgium, etc.. we will have to fight for them in the future.

    World football is not about your nationality anymore, it's about the biggest profile you can get.
     
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