Nashville sale thread--Leipold PULLS OUT of sale, Balsillie's bid OUT

[Fugu]

Doctor No wants to play in the NHL. GHOST wants a team in Winnipeg. Fugu wants .......... whatever it is that Fugu wants.

To RULE THE WORLD!


Meh, dream big and if I get to be like IB some day at least it's a step in the right direction...

 

[mr. Blase]

I don't know why gscarpenter insists on bashing his hometown. I visit Hamilton regularly and find it has all the amenities of any other city I visit. Two restaurants downtown? That's ludicrous. Hess Village is just a few blocks from Copps and has everything from pubs and bars to fine dining, clubs and lounges. I've personally eaten at at least ten good restaurants downtown (with actual chefs). According to the city of Hamilton, there are 30,000 people working in downtown Hamilton. I'm sure some of them eat.

Hess Village alone could provide enough dining and entertainment for visitors to NHL games.

 

[toastman344*]

Irish Blues :

That is a fantastic emotional argument ( BLS ) . It does absolutely nothing to help Southern Ontario get a team (much like any emotional argument won't help bring a team back to Winnipeg, Quebec City, or Hartford nor will it bring a team to Houston, Kansas City, Las Vegas, Portland, Seattle or any other interested city) ... and honestly, fairness isn't an issue here at

Just because I'm making an emotional argument, doesn't make any of my contentions untrue ...Besides emotional/ demonstrative arguments ...oft times can and do achieve positive results... Ever heard the expression ? : " The squeaky wheel gets the grease "

a lot of folks in Kanuckastan...esp in S. Ont , right now are saying: " God Bless Balsillie !!! " Notably, Balsillie IS also acting in mighty demonstrative/ emotional fashion too eh? ...and Thousands of everyday citizenry hereabouts...inclusive of the Corporate community are waving their cheque books enthusiastically in sympathetic response ...Essentially saying: " Right On Balsillie...We're with ya brother !

The Endgame isn't here yet ...Balsillie may get rebuffed by NHL bog's...But that sure won't mean he's all out of money/bullets !

Southern Ontario is THE MOST IMPORTANT MARKET...IN THE WORLD...FOR HOCKEY! TV wise/ advertising dollar wise etc...which in the final analysis pours a Helluva lotta dough into NHL Bog's coffers


You think that thousands of folks in Southern Ontario...couldn't get an angry email campaign going to CBC, TSN/ their sponsors ...Labatt's, Molson's, Steelback etc etc...Saying hey...We're the ones that fill ur Golden Coffers too...We're the ones that indirectly send millions upon million upon millions thru u and ur clients to the NHL Brass...

***

Letter to TSN / CBC : Dear Sirs/ Madams

Start making some Sympathetic Noise as of NOW !!!...Start producing some Angry News Stories..vis a vis the unfairness of the mistreatment of S. Ontario ‘s NHL fan base ...for years and years...by the NHL

Start rattling Bettman & companies cages !!!...Start Demanding in no uncertain terms a second team in Southern Ontario...OR ELSE...

Or Else ??? ...Or Else...WE THE S. Ont FANS...Will start a public boycott of ur HNIC etc Sponsor's Products ...for ur and their failure to publically support us..the S. Ont Fans !

A Few Websites...And roughly 10, 000 demonstrative emails strategically placed would be enough...

***

CBC/TSN ( owned by ESPN ) and their sponsors ..Know who butters their bread...it's the good folks in Southern Ontario...Those Hockey Media Giants are also Big Time Players vis a vis the NHL BOG's

S. Ont Grass Roots Anger / Indignation/ Insistence....Coupled with CBC/ TSN Corporate response...Coupled with Balsillie's Own Big Bucks / Even more demonstrative Antics= another NHL team ( finally ) in Southern Ontario !

Could it Be Done...That Way ??? HELL YES !!!

Squeaky Wheel Gets The Grease !

 

[Ted Hoffman]

The Endgame isn't here yet ...Balsillie may get rebuffed by NHL bog's...But that sure won't mean he's all out of money/bullets !

Please explain how he's going to buy an NHL team and put it where he wants if the BoG never approves his bid. (Hint: the answer is "it'll never happen.")

Southern Ontario is THE MOST IMPORTANT MARKET...IN THE WORLD...FOR HOCKEY!

Not that you're stretching things a whole lot, but ... "in the world?"

You think that thousands of folks in Southern Ontario...couldn't get an angry email campaign going to CBC, TSN/ their sponsors ...Labatt's, Molson's, Steelback etc etc...Saying hey...We're the ones that fill ur Golden Coffers too...We're the ones that indirectly send millions upon million upon millions thru u and ur clients to the NHL Brass...

You're veering wildly towards the absurd, and the rest of your post isn't much more logical. Of course, if you really think that your proposed campaign would be successful, I assume you'll be starting such a campaign today ... right?

I predict it would be just as successful as the "let's not buy gas on Tuesday and show oil companies we're tired of being gouged!" campaigns that have had absolutely no effect on gas prices at the pump.

 

[toastman344*]

Originally Posted by BLS
Southern Ontario is THE MOST IMPORTANT MARKET...IN THE WORLD...FOR HOCKEY!

Irish Blues :

Not that you're stretching things a whole lot, but ... "in the world?"

I'm not stretching things one iota...absolutely its the most important Hockey Market in the World in terms of the HNIC/ TSN Hockey Telecast/ NHL viewership / the NHL advertising revenues it generates etc...

Name me a Bigger/ More Financially lucrative Hockey Market ??? Good luck with that

 

[Bear of Bad News]

Letter to TSN / CBC : Dear Sirs/ Madams

Start making some Sympathetic Noise as of NOW !!!...Start producing some Angry News Stories..vis a vis the unfairness of the mistreatment of S. Ontario ‘s NHL fan base ...for years and years...by the NHL

Start rattling Bettman & companies cages !!!...Start Demanding in no uncertain terms a second team in Southern Ontario...OR ELSE...

Or Else ??? ...Or Else...WE THE S. Ont FANS...Will start a public boycott of ur HNIC etc Sponsor's Products ...for ur and their failure to publically support us..the S. Ont Fans !

A Few Websites...And roughly 10, 000 demonstrative emails strategically placed would be enough...

Some helpful advice - if you're actually going to send this letter, and you want it to have a chance of being taken seriously, I'd have a friend proofread it first.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Irish Blues :

I'm not stretching things one iota...absolutely its the most important Hockey Market in the World in terms of the HNIC/ TSN Hockey Telecast/ NHL viewership / the NHL advertising revenues it generates etc...

Name me a Bigger/ More Financially lucrative Hockey Market ??? Good luck with that

If Southern Ontario decided tomorrow that it wasn't going to support hockey, would the sport wither up and die? Absolutely not. I find it ironic how just a few days ago you were touting the greatness of the entire country of Canada as a reason why teams should go there, but now it's only about Southern Ontario?



Let's see you start this boycott proposal - I'm truly curious how many people would jump on board, and how successful it would really be.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

To RULE THE WORLD!


Meh, dream big and if I get to be like IB some day at least it's a step in the right direction...

Yeah ... you should at least try to set your goals a little higher than the top of the storm drain, thanks.

 

[Semantics]

BLS, you are clearly not interested in actual information exchange. There is exactly one restaurant (roadhouse-type) in the mall to which Copps is attached. There are two restaurants about 15-20 minutes walk from downtown. That is it. Do you understand? THAT'S it. The restaurants are all on the mountain. Hamilton downtown has nothing. Shocking, perhaps, but true.

Given your self-proclaimed business acumen, Big Carp, and ignoring the speciousness of your claim, you must be well-aware that an NHL franchise in the area would act as a catalyst for development of supplementary entertainment establishments, perhaps even those of high enough brow at which a politician or lawyer might be inclined to let themselves be seen.

 

[Fourier]

To chime in with your discussion with GC....

In negotiations, some people prefer to throw out as much as they can so that in essence they later look like they're really giving up something. I wouldn't put it past Balsillie, as the real end game is to get an NHL team in Southern Ontario.

Of course, chime in all you want. Though even if we are right about the end game.
How the rest plays out seems very much up in the air.

 

[kdb209]

Ghost,

As stated above, Powers Management (who runs the Sommet Center) is making a lot of money from the Predators that is not being counted as Predators revenue although Powers Management is a sister company to the Predators and is being sold outright with the Predators.

As for AHL hockey in the Sommet Center...you have got to be kidding me. As a Hartford native who lost the Whalers and then bought season-tickets for the Wolf*Pack...I know that the Sommet Center is too big for the AHL as the HCC is too big for the Wolf*Pack and Copps Coliseum is too big for the Bulldogs. Sure, you might get those big crowds sometimes that fill the place, but those crowds are the exception, not the norm. Furthermore, the travel costs associated with having an AHL team in Nashville would be prohibitive and I don't think the club would be successful. AHL hockey in Nashville would never make money and would lose both the city and whomever comes in to run the Sommet Center millions of dollars.

I think what is being overlooked is that the $238 million purchase price is not only for the Predators, but also for a very profitable company that runs the day to day operations of the Sommet Center.

Powers Management is very profitable and is also solely owned by and is being sold with the Predators (aka Craig Leipold).

Powers Management's master lease on the Sommet Center is contingent upon the Pred's lease - correct?

So, if/when Ballsillie exercises the out clause, Powers Management effectively disappears as a profitable entity and control of the Sommet Center reverts back to the city of Nashville.

 

[ej_pens]

Ghost,

As stated above, Powers Management (who runs the Sommet Center) is making a lot of money from the Predators that is not being counted as Predators revenue although Powers Management is a sister company to the Predators and is being sold outright with the Predators.

That may have been true pre-lockout, but now that HRR (hockey related revenues) are detailed in the new CBA, I doubt it is as widespread as people would believe.

The CBA is very specific on entities like Powers Management. They are affiliated with the club and any revenues that are "funneled" through PM are subject to be counted as Predators revenues, including luxury suites, parking, and concessions.

 

[MAROONSRoad]

Please explain how he's going to buy an NHL team and put it where he wants if the BoG never approves his bid. (Hint: the answer is "it'll never happen.")

I agree that there is a good chance the BOG will reject Balsillie. I think the strategy he is adopting is too aggressive, although he may be lining up the ducks for some type of legal argument/strategy. However, I'm not a big fan of comments like "it will never happen," "the BOG will never approve," etc. If you keep on making statements like that you're going to be wrong once in a while. JMHO.

GHOST

 

[kdb209]

That may have been true pre-lockout, but now that HRR (hockey related revenues) are detailed in the new CBA, I doubt it is as widespread as people would believe.

The CBA is very specific on entities like Powers Management. They are affiliated with the club and any revenues that are "funneled" through PM are subject to be counted as Predators revenues, including luxury suites, parking, and concessions.

True, but that's not the issue here - we're not talking about the HRR reported to the league - we're talking about statements made for public consumption.

Leipold can truthfully claim $72M in losses on the Preds and conveniently ignore the $45M in profits made by Powers Management.

The Sharks can claim $5M in losses this year and conveniently ignore the profits made by SVSE.

And HRR only includes the revenues of the affiliated entities that are directly generated by the NHL games (rent, game day revenues, etc). It does not include the significant revenues that entities like Powers Management and SVSE get from all the other non-NHL events at their arenas - even though the only reason they control the master leases and get that revenue is because they own the NHL teams.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

I agree that there is a good chance the BOG will reject Balsillie. I think the strategy he is adopting is too aggressive, although he may be lining up the ducks for some type of legal argument/strategy. However, I'm not a big fan of comments like "it will never happen," "the BOG will never approve," etc. If you keep on making statements like that you're going to be wrong once in a while. JMHO.

GHOST

Please re-read what I said. I did not say (nor have I ever said) that the NHL would never approve Balsille as an owner - I asked how Balsille was going to put an NHL team in [insert location here] if the NHL never approves him as an owner.

There's a huge difference between what I actually said and what you think I said.

 

[MAROONSRoad]

Apparently Balsillie is a competitive guy. Interesting read:

"As a referee evaluator for the National Basketball Association, and as a supplier of whistles to several major sports leagues, Ron Foxcroft has been fortunate enough to watch many of the world's greatest competitors. Few of them, he insists, could hope to match the fiery drive of his good friend Jim Balsillie, the co-chief executive officer of BlackBerry manufacturer Research In Motion Ltd.

"He's the most competitive guy I've ever met in my life," Mr. Foxcroft said. "This guy would slit your throat to win a Ping-Pong game or a checkers game."

Just how much does Mr. Balsillie hate to lose? Not long ago, during a round of golf in Hamilton, Mr. Balsillie lost a bet to Mr. Foxcroft on the 18th hole.

When it came time to grudgingly hand over the money, the high-tech CEO, whose net worth has been estimated at more than $1.6-billion (U.S.), was visibly shaking.

"He said, 'I'm not going for a drink. Here's your $20,' " Mr. Foxcroft recalled. "I said, 'It's only $20.' And he said, 'No it isn't. It's all about pride.' "

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20070615.BALSILLIE15/TPStory/Sports

GHOST

 

[Olaf]

Apparently Balsillie is a competitive guy. Interesting read:

"As a referee evaluator for the National Basketball Association, and as a supplier of whistles to several major sports leagues, Ron Foxcroft has been fortunate enough to watch many of the world's greatest competitors. Few of them, he insists, could hope to match the fiery drive of his good friend Jim Balsillie, the co-chief executive officer of BlackBerry manufacturer Research In Motion Ltd.

"He's the most competitive guy I've ever met in my life," Mr. Foxcroft said. "This guy would slit your throat to win a Ping-Pong game or a checkers game."

Just how much does Mr. Balsillie hate to lose? Not long ago, during a round of golf in Hamilton, Mr. Balsillie lost a bet to Mr. Foxcroft on the 18th hole.

When it came time to grudgingly hand over the money, the high-tech CEO, whose net worth has been estimated at more than $1.6-billion (U.S.), was visibly shaking.

"He said, 'I'm not going for a drink. Here's your $20,' " Mr. Foxcroft recalled. "I said, 'It's only $20.' And he said, 'No it isn't. It's all about pride.' "

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20070615.BALSILLIE15/TPStory/Sports

GHOST

He waged a six-year battle with tiny NTP Inc., a Virginia company that accused RIM of violating its technology patents. When NTP won a $23-million court ruling, Mr. Balsillie dug in, disputing the verdict all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court.

By the time the dust had settled last year, RIM agreed to pay a staggering $612.5-million to settle the long-running dispute, prompting some to question Mr. Balsillie's notoriously competitive streak.

"We thought we had an agreement for $450-million and then he started horsing around and we ended up at $612.5-million," said James Wallace, a Washington lawyer who represented NTP.

Mr. Wallace said NTP probably would have settled the case for $50-million at the outset, and recalled flying to France to negotiate with him. By the time he arrived, Mr. Balsillie had changed his mind. "The meeting lasted 12 minutes."

No doubt he is competitive, but doesn't come across as the brightest or most stable wealthy fella.

 

[PhotoCrasher]

Some helpful advice - if you're actually going to send this letter, and you want it to have a chance of being taken seriously, I'd have a friend proofread it first.

LMAO...

 

[Fugu]

No doubt he is competitive, but doesn't come across as the brightest or most stable wealthy fella.

Well seeing he's the guy that is a billionaire now, thanks to leading the business side of RIM, I'd say he can't be all that dumb either.

 

[mouser]

Interesting perspective by Steve Simmons (didn't see this posted previously, apologies if a duplicate)

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/Nashville/2007/06/15/4263335-sun.html

 

[AgentOrange*]

Thanks for the numbers. Although I have to ask...how is comparing a single, non-traditional State to three provinces and "The State of Hockey" relevant?

BTW, as for the 10 listed in Nashville. I believe three of those rinks are not open to the public and the one in Gatlinburg is a seasonal outdoor rink that hasn't been around in over a year.

In no way am I trying to say that ice hockey is played more here in TN than in other areas. I'm not crazy and wouldn't ever claim that hockey is even in the top 5 played sports in this state. However, I do claim there is a growing group of players here with a solid base currently and much room to grow.

BTW, there is a new ice and inline rink opening in Hendersonville, TN (a suburb of Nashville) this summer. So that would make the list up to 11 rinks for what it matters.

How many indoor ice rinks are there in Nashville?

I dont know if I would include inline roller hockey rinks in this discussion as IMO, as it still different from ice hockey. How many people play roller hockey with the thought of a possible career in ice hockey later on?

 

[mr. Blase]

The Globe and Mail now reports that "[t]wo days into the campaign, the number of people putting deposits on season tickets for a potential National Hockey League team in Hamilton overtook the number of season-ticket holders of the Nashville Predators."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/serv...5.wsptpreds15/BNStory/GlobeSportsHockey/home/

 

[bleed_oil]

Please re-read what I said. I did not say (nor have I ever said) that the NHL would never approve Balsille as an owner - I asked how Balsille was going to put an NHL team in [insert location here] if the NHL never approves him as an owner.

There's a huge difference between what I actually said and what you think I said.

To be honest, I dont think much of Balsilles chances. He has already stepped on a lot of toes and the Leafs will battle him right to the end to stop him from getting into Hamilton.
I would expect when all is said and done we'll have the Kansas City Predators.

 

[mr. Blase]

^^that's what I expect too. As if Missouri needs two teams when southern Ontario can't have two. (Sure Ottawa is in Ontario, but it's really far away from Toronto, much closer to Montreal.)

 

[Jarnberg]

To be honest, I dont think much of Balsilles chances. He has already stepped on a lot of toes and the Leafs will battle him right to the end to stop him from getting into Hamilton.
I would expect when all is said and done we'll have the Kansas City Predators.

If the Balsillie deal falls through, there is likely a Nashville group waiting in the wings. If the rumors are true as to who the people involved are, they have a very large sum of personal wealth.