My updated 2012 top 60

[saska sault]

says the Sault Ste. Marie fan



Why do you think so?

Obviously my view is a bit "homerish" but he is already hard to get around, a good PP quarter back, he uses his body well while almost never getting out of position. He plays a similar game to Nick Lidstrom, but needs to learn to use his shot more often. I can see him easily becoming one of the best defensemen in the league next year, he was our best defender this year as a rookie, and will surpass Daley, Jackman, and Jordan Smith as the best defensemen in recent Greyhound years. From what I saw from Cam Fowler in his draft year, I can see him being a slightly less regarded version of that kind of player.

 

[LifeIsLoud]

29. Dylan Bigell—D—Brampton Battalion

Who? Do you mean Dylan Blujus? If yes, he had a great rookie year this year.

 

[Scouter]

It is not about 5 TOI with men in Europe... some great guys have heavy TOI in senior league.

It is about developing, about learning european style of game... there are tons of Canadiens who can hit, can play tough game but Canadiens dont have sense of game like Europeans, technique, skating, thinking... look at Forsberg, Jagr, Bure, Fedorov etc.. Europeans playing CHL dont bring anything special to NA game.. they just learn NA style, they became solid players, but not unique... it is not just my opinion, it is reality!!

Canadiens dont have to go to european junior leagues.. because it is other style of game. Look, some Canadiens play european senior leagues and they play very solid.. no problem.

You dont consider about the fact that European kids learn something and suddenly they change enviroment... they are not developed in european style of game.. they come to CHL and they can not developed to NA style of game like Canadiens who learn it all they life. It is difference, fact which some guys dont want to understand

1. I guess you don't watch NA players because this is simply not true, look at Crosby to name just 1 of many who have as much or more skill than any Russian, plus they can do something most Russians can't and that's play defines, there are more skilled Canadians playing in the NHL than there are Russians, it's because the Russians just haven't been good enough, it has nothing to do with coming to NA, if they were good enough then they would have made the NHL, simple as that for the most part.

2. Is it really though, do you think that all of the Europeans passing the puck too many times in Europe is unique also.

3. So some Europeans are not good enough to play in NA, I certainly agree with this, if anything though I feel that Europeans have an easier time adapting to smaller ice than the other way around,
playing on smaller ice makes them have to make quicker decisions, maybe not all can cope, but the really good players can.

 

[Scouter]

Did Yakupov do best when moved to CHL? Would not be better for him to develop at home? Look at Kucherov, Grigorenko, Gusev, Kuznetsov, Tarasenko, Bobrovsky...

Look at Filatov though, he wen't back there and it did not seem to help him.

 

[Scouter]

you dont understand it... did you read this article which I posted above? or other articles...

European national federations want one thing - to develop as many great players as possible. And it is so sad that they lose many talents who come to NA too early. Maybe one player developed good in CHL but 99 will disappear

Give me example of players who played 2-3 years in CHL and after that they were/are NHL superstars - like Ovechkin, Malkin, Datsyuk, Fedorov, Naslund, Alfredsson, Pallfy, Hossa, Gaborik, Jagr, Hasek are/were... try to write their names.. I am curious

That may be what they wan't but that's not always what they actually do, for instance Sweden does a better job of producing players than Russia, Canada is obviously the best producer of NHL level talent in the world, the coming to NA too early argument I don't think is a viable one, more often than not I think it's not true, Russia apparently doesn't really coach goalies in technique at all, that's why they are best developed here, also Canada produces more NHL talent than anyone because our grassroots are stronger than anyone, we have the most rinks per capita, and available ones, once the other nations fix their grassroots situation they won't match Canada.

 

[Scouter]

Im a QMJHL scout in talks right now of moving up to the NHL for next year......I will say right now that being a scout is only an educated opinion on anything of the sport. My take is that moving to the CHL gives the kids the playing time needed, in leagues like sweden, finland, czech etc etc it is not all the U18s and U20s playing together you have the top talent spread out, some are playing U20 Elite, some are playing U18 one league and some play in different parts of the league it is pretty spread out...some of the players who were thought good might not be as good as people think once they play a steady flow of talented depth teams. In the CHL the main players get the playing time which a player might not get in Europe (being a player moves up a level and gets on the 3rd or 4th line for the year playing as a 17 year old in the 19 year old league and players do not improve like that).

I saw above you said Landeskog made a mistake coming to the CHL...How you blow my mind with that comment, he is ranked to go top 3 in the draft, if he played in the main league in sweden, his game would not have shined like he wanted it too, he is not as developed as the men who play thus not making his physical game as intimadating as it is right now, I think if Landeskog played in Europe we should have still had him 1st round but not top 3 overall. Now im not saying every player should come over and it does not make everyone better and ovechkin and malkin did fine staying over then coming to the NHL.....but i will say this, euro players can not play the euro game all there life with the change in game style in the NHL they will have to change and it is worst trying to learn the NHL game when your in the NHL, better doing it in junior and if the players don't pan out in the CHL trust me they would NOT and i do repeat THEY WOULD NOT have survived in the NHL so best the secret came out early before a team wasted a pick on them IMO, becuase if the player was good enough if he can not adjust to a junior league he would not adjust to the NHL.

If the euro players stayed over there they still would not get to play against all the top junior players like in the CHL......such as in sweden Calle Andersson plays U20, Kalle Torniainen plays U18, then even in the J18 leagues there is different divisions like Elit or Allsvenskan...the top talent is so spread out you never get a clear cut what a player is really like and thus is such a farce to the article you just gave to saying that because all the top players are coming CHL there are no rolemodels or the players don't get to play against there good players well they are so spread out it is impossible almost anyways at least in the CHL they are going to play in the top junior league in the world really and they get to play against all the top guys.

I could not have said it better myself.

If I was an NHL club hiring scouts I think I would have to strongly consider you.

 

[Fulcrum]

Look at Filatov though, he wen't back there and it did not seem to help him.

He went back being a different player. Having left in the first place is the point.

The thing about Filatov is that he wasn't playing on the 1st team in Moscow under Bykov, and there was no MHL to speak of. The 2nd team, and the whole league in-fact, was a complete joke. KHL and the 2nd teams were night and day. He was above what is MHL now, but it made all the more desirable to leave.

Now, there is an option for these guys, and a visible path to the KHL. MHL has better infrastructure, much better competition and so on.

I expect that we'll start to see MHL guys promoted to the KHL, which in-turn will promote less Russian juniors picking CHL as an option. That's their plan anyway. The U20 win helps that cause as well.

 

[Scouter]

Can you prove that the reason Niemi isn't any good (or Seitsonen or Marjamaki or whoever) is because he left Finland?

In Niemi's case, he was in a good program in Saskatoon, so no I don't think it was where he was playing that was the issue there, Marjamaki got drafted 2 times, he was in Red Deer for 2 seasons which is a good program, then he wen't to Moose Jaw which isn't as good and may have hurt his development, Seitsonen was in a pretty bad program in Prince Albert IMO, so he may have been hurt playing there.

 

[Scouter]

He went back being a different player. Having left in the first place is the point.

The thing about Filatov is that he wasn't playing on the 1st team in Moscow under Bykov, and there was no MHL to speak of. The 2nd team, and the whole league in-fact, was a complete joke. KHL and the 2nd teams were night and day. He was above what is MHL now, but it made all the more desirable to leave.

Now, there is an option for these guys, and a visible path to the KHL. MHL has better infrastructure, much better competition and so on.

I expect that we'll start to see MHL guys promoted to the KHL, which in-turn will promote less Russian juniors picking CHL as an option. That's their plan anyway. The U20 win helps that cause as well.

I think he made that point better later though, not digging that quote up right now though, maybe tomorrow.

 

[Scouter]

You can't say that all or most Euro's would be best served for their development staying in Europe, it's just not true, you have to look at each hockey program individually, not judge a whole continent, in NA there are good programs and not so good ones, just like in Europe, good ways to develop players and not good ones, it's the same in Europe.

 

[Raptactics29]

Hey Scoutman..

What are the chances Andreas Athanasiou moves up come draft day? I'm interested in your likes and dislikes of him also. I have my opinions and I want to see if you back me.

Thanks in advanced.

 

[S E P H]

Hey Scoutman..

What are the chances Andreas Athanasiou moves up come draft day? I'm interested in your likes and dislikes of him also. I have my opinions and I want to see if you back me.

Thanks in advanced.

Sorry I don't want to butt in, but Andreas is definitely one of my favourite prospects of 2012. Very fast skater is really hard to control entering the offensive zone. Already has a great shot and a good frame and needs to build on that for the upcoming season. Somewhere around 6'2 - 185/190 is what I would like to see in the pros. As of right now I see him as a high 2nd rounder.

 

[Raptactics29]

Sorry I don't want to butt in, but Andreas is definitely one of my favourite prospects of 2012. Very fast skater is really hard to control entering the offensive zone. Already has a great shot and a good frame and needs to build on that for the upcoming season. Somewhere around 6'2 - 185/190 is what I would like to see in the pros. As of right now I see him as a high 2nd rounder.

Ya, he definitely still has room to grow. I feel next season with a much bigger role here in London that his numbers will skyrocket. You can definitely see the skills there to be a dangerous offensive weapon. I wouldn't be surprised if he sneaks in the 1st round next season even with how deep it is supposed to be. He has to be a top 5 skater in this draft.