He was let go because he was close with Hunter.
Confirmed with Link: Multiple staff leave Leafs front office
- Thread starter Kamiccolo
- Start date
You do realize only something like 20% of second rounders become legitimate NHLers right? If he got 2 in 5 second round picks, that's pretty good. Also, no picks outside of Matthews were easy. There were always other contenders for those picks, and he looks to have chosen the right guy. Marner vs Hanifin was heavily debated. Hell, most of Bob's scouts had Hanifin ahead of Marner, Central Scouting had Crouse and Hanifin ahead of him. Again, with Liljegren, there were higher rated guys left by both CSB and Bob's list.
paulhiggins
Registered User
- Feb 4, 2006
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Marner vs Hanifin could still be heavily debated. Really it seems it was always between them and Provorov and it looks like to this point there were no bad choices to make. Hence why it was easy imo.
As for Liljegren. He was one of the highest rated players coming into his draft year and had his season completely sidetracked by mono. When he slipped to us, being a RHD especially, the package was too tantalizing to pass up.
Grundstrom at early glance looks like a good pick in the 2nd (yes I'm aware of success rates), we'll see how he keeps developing, but he gets props for that one. Dermott is far less clear how much of that pick was Hunter, so he gets half credit for that one.
Als0 it's not like Hunter makes picks in a silo. It's debatable how much he actually personally watched a player like Grundstrom vs trusting the scouts in place.
I'm not saying he was bad. I'm not saying he was good. I'm saying jury is out on whether his drafting in Toronto vs Dubas makes a lick of difference.
He's not ready for a senior role if he gets one. And, he'll only get one because he's friends with Dubas. Its completely an old boys network type hire, except these guys are the new school. I'm pretty skeptical of it, but if you trust Dubas, you should trust his hires.
Why is Dermott less clear if he was a Hunter pick? Dubas had control over trades (which frustrated the scouting staff), but that was a Hunter/Hofford/Paliafito pick.
Menzinger
Kessel4LadyByng
And likely held pretty different views from Dubas. Likely more to a firing than simply “he was friends with a guy”
ITM
As Long As It Takes
- Jan 26, 2012
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With an emphasis as to how nonsensical it was to consider selecting Hanifin over Marner perhaps.
Its a clearout of Hunters guys. Expect more names to follow, and Dubas will replace them with his buddies. Some of the names I've heard floated will get an interesting response around here.
Menzinger
Kessel4LadyByng
I'm pretty meh on Hofford, if Dubas wants to shoot him into the sun have at it I say, the only guy I don't like losing is the one grabbing the UFA'S out of Russia, he's been pretty solid whoever that is
I can't say I'm thrilled with Clark either but if he's not an area manager or head scout it's not as bad as it could be I guess?
Menzinger
Kessel4LadyByng
Well it’s normal to bring in people that you’re close with, I mean that’s exactly what Hunter did when he was hired.
But there is clearly as it has been reported a fairly wide divide between how Dubas and Hunter viewed the game, so it’s also not surprising that Dubas would have pretty different views from hunters fellow scouts and as such reason to replace them.
ShaneFalco
Registered User
Dubas had clear input in the 2015 draft which he did not have in 2016 and 2017 and also a knowledge of the OHL. I'm not just taking it for granted that Hunter was the guy who wanted Dermott most. May have been, but there is no way to quantify that.
Hofford was kept in check by basically having Hunter with him monitoring the same region. That won't happen with Clark, who will be given free reign over Ontario at a minimum.
Hunter had full say over picks in 2015, just not the trading down aspect of it which was a contentious issue.
SprDaVE
Moderator
- Sep 20, 2008
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Zaitsev is very likely traded because he isn't very good and his contract is scary for a team going into a cap crunch.
Menzinger
Kessel4LadyByng
Great, it wasn't reported Hunter would quit in November if Dubas was hired. Guess what happened.
My apologies that I don't just take it a face value that you apparently have intimate knowledge of the inner workings of the Leafs draft table.
Menzinger
Kessel4LadyByng
Ive seen it reported from different writers that Dubas had input on the the ‘15 draft, but that influence was essentially cut off for the ‘16-17 drafts. So it doesn’t sound as if Hunter was completely full decisions without any oversight/influence
Dubas had control over trades, and therefore could force a trade down (which he did). But, Hunter had final say on all picks. To try to say he only gets half credit on Dermott is ridiculous. He ran our scouting meetings and our board. It is trying to devalue what Hunter did at the time.
This set-up clearly wasn't going to work, and was contentious with Shanahan not wanting to be the deciding vote, hence why he brought Lou in, and sent Hunter and Dubas to their own parts of the organization, as he realized that a co-gm situation or one answering to the other wasn't going to work.
