Speculation: Mrazek trade to FLA?

[kliq]

Suddenly, Jimmy and Mrazek have almost the same stats.
Jimmy - .911, 2.82, won 38.9 percent of his starts. 47.2 percent of points
Petr - .910 2.86, won 46 percent of his starts, 53.8 percent of points.

Ya, that's the problem with small sample sizes. One or two good or bad starts and your stats can significantly change. I'm glad we are seeing more of Mrazek.

 

[SirloinUB]

I really want to believe that Mrazek is turning a corner here but I'm having a tough time buying in given his track record of inconsistency.

What makes people think this is any more than just a hot streak from a notoriously streaky goalie?

 

[hyduK]

I really want to believe that Mrazek is turning a corner here but I'm having a tough time buying in given his track record of inconsistency.

What makes people think this is any more than just a hot streak from a notoriously streaky goalie?

I guess my thing is...what's the point in keeping Howard?

He's a 33 year old that is a solid goalie when he's healthy, but he gets injured every season and then usually becomes a shell of that. He's peaked, by the time we are able to compete he'll probably be retired.

Mrazek is a young goalie who has been inconsistent but also shown streaks of brilliance that Howard never has. So best case scenario he turns out to be a franchise goalie, and worst case scenario he doesnt...but we're not any further behind than we are now.

I'm not sure why the organization doesn't like Mrazek? Because he's kind of cocky? Because he didnt' just roll over and accept whatever lowball contract KH gave him? Maybe KH should reevaluate himself.

Honestly, if I was a young player I wouldn't want anything to do with our organization right now. Lose a few years of your career/pay because you're fighting to get a spot from some mediocre veteran? Then when you do finally break in, fight for 3rd line icetime, get lowballed as an RFA because KH wants to save money to give to Justin Abdelkader?

 

[Henkka]

Career stats since Mrazek started:

SV%
Howard 91.4
Mrazek 91.3

GAA:
Howard 2.51
Mrazek 2.59

Win%
Mrazek 0.434
Howard 0.417

Somehow it feels like a team stat. Both are same, both have been mediocre guys.

We don't have any edge on goaltending department, no matter who is on the net.

 

[SirloinUB]

Mrazek is a young goalie who has been inconsistent but also shown streaks of brilliance that Howard never has. So best case scenario he turns out to be a franchise goalie, and worst case scenario he doesnt...but we're not any further behind than we are now.

To me it’s not so much about Howard vs Mrazek, but rather why should we put our faith in Mrazek?

I understand the theoretical upside with Mrazek but he is 26 and we know what he is. A talented, yet unreliable goalie. He has a tendency to over commit and as a result his positioning suffers. Teams know this and have made him pay.

I know many favour youth but I’d like to have a deeper discussion about why some think he can take the next step when all he has shown is inconsistency. Is his is upside more than just a date on a birth certificate and a strong 8 month stretch?

 

[Dotter]

Wings don't need 9 million tied up in 2 goalies. One has to go and Mrazek probably has the best trade value. Howard has proven to be the better team player.

Mrazek should be the odd man out.

 

[RedWingzz]

Wings don't need 9 million tied up in 2 goalies. One has to go and Mrazek probably has the best trade value. Howard has proven to be the better team player.

Mrazek should be the odd man out.

So what do you suggest we do after next season when Howard is a UFA? Dish out good money to a 35 year old goalie who has never won anything in this league? Howard is an ok starter. He's an ok goalie by NHL standards. Mrazek has a higher potential. I think it's nonsensical to give up on a 25 year old because he's been inconsistent. Qualify Mrazek, and give him the net from the start of the year and see what he can do.

I don't care if you're Sergei Bobrovsky, when you're playing 1 game every 2 weeks, the results won't be promising.

If we get rid of Mrazek, and Howard leaves next year then what's the plan? Give Jared Coreau the starter net? Petruzzelli and Larsson are 3+ years away, so who'se our goalie entering 2019-2020? Should we give Manny Legace a call?

 

[RedWingzz]

To me it’s not so much about Howard vs Mrazek, but rather why should we put our faith in Mrazek?

I understand the theoretical upside with Mrazek but he is 26 and we know what he is. A talented, yet unreliable goalie. He has a tendency to over commit and as a result his positioning suffers. Teams know this and have made him pay.

I know many favour youth but I’d like to have a deeper discussion about why some think he can take the next step when all he has shown is inconsistency. Is his is upside more than just a date on a birth certificate and a strong 8 month stretch?

2-way street man, why should we put our faith in Howard? Enlighten me with his long list of NHL accomplishments.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

26 is not old for a goalie

They become better later and stay better longer than skaters do

Move Howard

Sign a cheap veteran to back him up next season

 

[Winger98]

Career stats since Mrazek started:

SV%
Howard 91.4
Mrazek 91.3

GAA:
Howard 2.51
Mrazek 2.59

Win%
Mrazek 0.434
Howard 0.417

Somehow it feels like a team stat. Both are same, both have been mediocre guys.

We don't have any edge on goaltending department, no matter who is on the net.

The problem is that combined they're a bit on the expensive side and neither is dependable. And we don't have any great immediate option to turn to in the minors. If Coreau was putting together a big season in GR I think Holland's decision gets a lot easier.

 

[SirloinUB]

2-way street man, why should we put our faith in Howard? Enlighten me with his long list of NHL accomplishments.

I clearly said this isn't about Mrazek vs Howard. Trade howard, I don't give a shit.

Z4C had a partial answer but age alone doesn't inspire confidence

I just want to know why people think Mrazek is the answer. Why do you think he can sustain reliable play when he has only proven otherwise throughout his career?


We need a goalie for the future. We know it won't be Howard long term but what evidence is there to suggest Mrazek can be that? Most players who struggle with consistency don't just suddenly flip a switch and become consistent.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

I clearly said this isn't about Mrazek vs Howard. Trade howard, I don't give a ****.

Z4C had a partial answer but age alone doesn't inspire confidence

I just want to know why people think Mrazek is the answer. Why do you think he can sustain reliable play when he has only proven otherwise throughout his career?


We need a goalie for the future. We know it won't be Howard long term but what evidence is there to suggest Mrazek can be that? Most players who struggle with consistency don't just suddenly flip a switch and become consistent.

I think she is the ONLY answer

Both have their question marks

Neither is cheap

But Meazek has youth and time on his side and that' exactly what we need as we rebuild

 

[SirloinUB]

I think she is the ONLY answer

Both have their question marks

Neither is cheap

But Meazek has youth and time on his side and that' exactly what we need as we rebuild

Well if that's the case why wouldn't we sell him off for what we can? Most people around here want to sell off every other player who is 25+. Why is Mrazek the exception?

It's fine to keep Mrazek if you believe he can be the goalie of the future. If not, get back what you can and focus on other options be it a trade, prospect or FA signing.

I want to believe in the kid; he has been one of my favourite goalies since he put on a show at the U20s. I just really don't see much reason to believe he can be a long term fit.

 

[ShelbyZ]

So what do you suggest we do after next season when Howard is a UFA? Dish out good money to a 35 year old goalie who has never won anything in this league? Howard is an ok starter. He's an ok goalie by NHL standards. Mrazek has a higher potential. I think it's nonsensical to give up on a 25 year old because he's been inconsistent. Qualify Mrazek, and give him the net from the start of the year and see what he can do.

I don't care if you're Sergei Bobrovsky, when you're playing 1 game every 2 weeks, the results won't be promising.

If we get rid of Mrazek, and Howard leaves next year then what's the plan? Give Jared Coreau the starter net? Petruzzelli and Larsson are 3+ years away, so who'se our goalie entering 2019-2020? Should we give Manny Legace a call?

Why does everybody make it seem like the Wings are doomed to be stuck with Howard forever if they trade Mrazek? Like trading away Mrazek is going put the Red Wings FO in some trance that has them immediately draw up a 7 year extension for Jimmy Howard.

The guy is under contract for only one more season where they can move him at the deadline or let him walk as a UFA.

On that last bolded part, did I miss a new CBA item that says teams can only promote home grown goalies? I mean geez, remember when GMs used to sign pretty decent goalies on the UFA market every summer? Or when the signing rights to Ben Bishop cost a 4th rounder?

They'd also be in the same place as your doom scenario if they traded Howard now, gave Mrazek a 1year deal and then he bombs in 18-19 like he did the last 1/4 of 15-16, all of 16-17 and most of the current season up until the past few games... or if only agrees to a 1 year deal and walks as a UFA to get overpaid... If that happens, what to they do? GIVE THE #1 JOB TO THOMAS MCCOLLUM? GIVE JOEY MACDONALD A CALL?!?!? SEE IF TERRY SAWCHUK HAS ANY GRANDSONS THAT OWN GOALIE EQUIPMENT?!?!?

 

[LastWordArmy]

Petr Mrazek is playing better lately. What other teams could be interested in adding a goalie?

Petr Mrazek and His Rising Trade Value - Last Word on Hockey

 

[Dotter]

So what do you suggest we do after next season when Howard is a UFA? Dish out good money to a 35 year old goalie who has never won anything in this league? Howard is an ok starter. He's an ok goalie by NHL standards. Mrazek has a higher potential. I think it's nonsensical to give up on a 25 year old because he's been inconsistent. Qualify Mrazek, and give him the net from the start of the year and see what he can do.

I don't care if you're Sergei Bobrovsky, when you're playing 1 game every 2 weeks, the results won't be promising.

If we get rid of Mrazek, and Howard leaves next year then what's the plan? Give Jared Coreau the starter net? Petruzzelli and Larsson are 3+ years away, so who'se our goalie entering 2019-2020? Should we give Manny Legace a call?

Mrazek is turning 26 and will be past his prime by the time Red Wings start competing again. Wings are rebuilding, you trade the goalie that has the best return to help with the rebuild process. The goalie that should have the best trade value is Mrazek. A smart rebuilding team will trade him to get the best return. He won't be part of the future regardless if he is a Price quality goalie or Legacy quality goalie. It makes no difference.

 

[ShelbyZ]

Well if that's the case why wouldn't we sell him off for what we can? Most people around here want to sell off every other player who is 25+. Why is Mrazek the exception?

Actually the correct age is around 27 or 28. Once players hit that age, around here it's automatically assumed that they will never get better and if they aren't elite players, their trade value will never be any higher than it is and they need to go ASAP even if only for a 4th rounder at best. Before that age however, they still have a 100% chance of becoming a top line player and any fault in their game is 100% the fault of the front office or coaching staff mistreating/misusing the player and not immediately granting them 20 minutes of ice time despite how they play.

Even after being passed on by 30 other NHL GM's, even Teemu Pulkkinen and Tomas Jurco still have a chance.

If Mrazek does stick around, it'll happen to him too. If he gets a contract with some term, once he has a couple injuries and/or a rough stretch around 2/14/20 and of course "hasn't won anything" - regardless of the team in front of him, newly labeled "injury prone" Petr Mrazek's "bad contract" will need to be moved immediately.

 

[Redder Winger]

Career stats since Mrazek started:

SV%
Howard 91.4
Mrazek 91.3

GAA:
Howard 2.51
Mrazek 2.59

Win%
Mrazek 0.434
Howard 0.417

Somehow it feels like a team stat. Both are same, both have been mediocre guys.

We don't have any edge on goaltending department, no matter who is on the net.

Mrazek played most of his games for teams that were nowhere near as good.

 

[Redder Winger]

Actually the correct age is around 27 or 28. Once players hit that age, around here it's automatically assumed that they will never get better and if they aren't elite players, their trade value will never be any higher than it is and they need to go ASAP even if only for a 4th rounder at best. Before that age however, they still have a 100% chance of becoming a top line player and any fault in their game is 100% the fault of the front office or coaching staff mistreating or misusing the player.

Despite being passed on my 30 other NHL GM's, even Teemu Pulkkinen and Tomas Jurco still have a chance.

If Mrazek does stick around, it'll happen to him too. If he gets a contract with some term, once he has a couple injuries and/or a rough stretch around 2/14/20 and of course "hasn't won anything" - regardless of the team in front of him, newly labeled "injury prone" Petr Mrazek's "bad contract" will need to be moved immediately.

So? If Mrazek hits 28 years old and demands a 7 year, $6M a year deal and isn't worth it, why shouldn't fans judge him with that lens?

That's what the salary cap does. It forces people to judge players against their contracts.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

Mrazek should still be in his goalie prime 3 years from now

I wouldn' worry about that

And I don't know if he has that much more value than Howard today, maybe a 3rd rd pick vs a 4th?

 

[Red Stanley]

Career stats since Mrazek started:

SV%
Howard 91.4
Mrazek 91.3

GAA:
Howard 2.51
Mrazek 2.59

Win%
Mrazek 0.434
Howard 0.417

Somehow it feels like a team stat. Both are same, both have been mediocre guys.

We don't have any edge on goaltending department, no matter who is on the net.

It is a team stat. How many teams get consistently carried by their goalies nowadays? If your defense is shit, the goalie stats will be mediocre at best over a long enough period of time. Our defense has been total shit for a number of years now.

 

[Redder Winger]

Carey Price's stats:
.905 3.00

 

[Dotter]

Mrazek should still be in his goalie prime 3 years from now

I wouldn' worry about that

And I don't know if he has that much more value than Howard today, maybe a 3rd rd pick vs a 4th?

Yup. And he'll be exiting his prime by the time Red Wings are about ready to start competing again. My question tot he people who want to keep him... why? He's not part of the future. Cheap UFA will always be available until we are ready to compete again if Howard isn't capable.

 

[Redder Winger]

Yup. And he'll be exiting his prime by the time Red Wings are about ready to start competing again. My question tot he people who want to keep him... why? He's not part of the future. Cheap UFA will always be available until we are ready to compete again if Howard isn't capable.

We don't know when the Wings will be good again.

Say Detroit gets lucky and lands Dahlin this offseason.

And then signs Karlsson next year.

And Rasmussen pans out as a decent top 6 player.
And Svech as a top 6/9 guy

And one of Hronek/Cholo/Saarijarvi as a top 4 guy.

Bertuzzi Larkin AA
Tatar Nielsen Mantha
Abdelkader Rasmussen Svechnikov
Helm Turgeon Abdelkader

Dahlin Karlsson
Dekeyser Hronek
whoever whoever

Mrazek/wheover

That's a scenario that could playout for Mrazek at 27.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

Yup. And he'll be exiting his prime by the time Red Wings are about ready to start competing again. My question tot he people who want to keep him... why? He's not part of the future. Cheap UFA will always be available until we are ready to compete again if Howard isn't capable.

Ideally this team is competitive before mrazek turns 35

Goalies don' totally sour as young as skaters typically do

Goalies primes tend to be late twenties to mid 30s (27-34)

I think he is young enough to still matter