Post-Game Talk: More than half-way there.

jefferoni

your mother was a hamster
Oct 30, 2013
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VGN will get their pound of flesh but we are not the best style match up for them. They are better than they looked last night though.

That being said it’s nice to have the lead in the series. I really want to hold serve again tomorrow Knight.
K, Now I see what you did there... :nod:
 
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Tommigun

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Jan 5, 2018
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So Kulikov was skating in a regular jersey a while back. Is he still injured or just scratched? He’s been out for so long that he’ll probably not get to play in these playoffs even if healthy unfortunately.
 

objectiveposter

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Jan 29, 2011
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So Kulikov was skating in a regular jersey a while back. Is he still injured or just scratched? He’s been out for so long that he’ll probably not get to play in these playoffs even if healthy unfortunately.
No need to rush him back. Vegas is a joke. Not remotely close to a championship team. Jets will easily beat them without him. Finals are a different story. Hopefully he is back by then. A matchup with Tampa would be tough like the Nashville series.
 
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Tommigun

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No need to rush him back. Vegas is a joke. Not remotely close to a championship team. Jets will easily beat them without him. Finals are a different story. Hopefully he is back by then. A matchup with Tampa would be tough like the Nashville series.

Do you think they’ll sit Chiarot who’s been pretty good with a rusty Kulikov, or just go with the winning team in the finals?
 

Mortimer Snerd

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Are they overconfident, or is it just that there are two teams playing and competing? Can you provide more than anecdotal evidence?

That last bit is rhetorical, obviously. ;)

And obviously, I can't provide clinical proof. :laugh: Seen it many times though. It is often quite obvious - anecdotally only, of course. On the other side though, the supposedly weaker team needs to step up to take advantage of the overconfidence.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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If you watch some of the highlights of G1 against Vegas, you can see a key difference between the way Helle plays his pad against the post vs Rinne for those wrap around or bad angle along the ice shots. Rinne pushes his laid down skate blade up against the post which creates a space for the puck to enter the net due to the width of the skate. Helle positions his pad against the post - the part of the pad that is slightly ahead of the toe of the skate. There is zero space for the puck to enter on an on the ice bad angle shot. This is a key difference in skill and technique.

This is how Myers scored against Rinne in G7. You don't score against Helle on that shot.

You would think that the guys that are voting for the Vezina would be watching for these details. They are supposed to know this stuff. If Rinne wins the Vezina, it will be an embarrassment for the NHL.

I don't think Vezina voting is influenced by some technical details. It is about results not technique. Of course it will also be influenced by name recognition and familiarity over a number of years. The voters are far from perfect.

The Vezina voting has already taken place. It is based on regular season, not playoffs. Rinne had slightly better stats than Hellebuyck for the regular season. If Rinne wins it won't be embarrassing. It will be the correct result - based on the regular season.
 

YWGinYYZ

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And obviously, I can't provide clinical proof. :laugh: Seen it many times though. It is often quite obvious - anecdotally only, of course. On the other side though, the supposedly weaker team needs to step up to take advantage of the overconfidence.

Do you record the times that it's not true as well? That's the other important part of your trail of evidence of overconfidence. Personally, I think it has more to do with parity in the league, and the overall difficulty in winning games even as the better team.

I think it may *seem* to be that a team is overconfident, when really it's just confirmation bias and a result of two teams competing on a relatively even basis.
 
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KingBogo

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I have to disagree KB. I've seen too many instances of overconfident teams in sports. You can say that it shouldn't happen to pros but they are human - it does. It is up to the coaches and leaders to nip it in the bud. That must be a fine line though. You want your team to be confident, just not overconfident.

I think it is more a case of "reading their own press-clippings", than it is taking the opposition lightly. They get a little full of themselves.
I think this may have been more true in the past then what we see today. The gap even between the best and worst teams is quite small. Teams all work with sports psychologists and have mastered the importance of routine in leveling out highs and lows and keep everyone focused at the task at hand. I was going to ask something along the line that GIN did below, but I can't think of a single NHL team that I thought lost a series because they were over confident. Us fans on the other hand is a whole different story. Just lucky we have no impact on the outcome:laugh:
 

KingBogo

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So Kulikov was skating in a regular jersey a while back. Is he still injured or just scratched? He’s been out for so long that he’ll probably not get to play in these playoffs even if healthy unfortunately.
I think there were a couple practices later in the Nashville series where all players, even those likely still injured had full contact jerseys on. It appeared to me that Maurice and Lavy had some gamesmanship going and didn't want to tip their hands on lineup decisions. Reports from practice indicated there was no drills involving contact so it was a bit of a moot point what colour jersey a player is wearing. We are also half way through the playoffs and no one is banging around in practice.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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Do you record the times that it's not true as well? That's the other important part of your trail of evidence of overconfidence. Personally, I think it has more to do with parity in the league, and the overall difficulty in winning games even as the better team.

I think it may *seem* to be that a team is overconfident, when really it's just confirmation bias.

I don't know what you mean by the times that it is not true. All the games where neither team is overconfident? The times when a team is overconfident, but wins anyway? :laugh: This subject really isn't rocket science. I don't think there is any way to pin it down scientifically.

I suspect that sometimes it is as you say. Game 6 against the Preds had the appearance of the Jets being overconfident, but I wouldn't be prepared to swear that was the case. As you say, parity. That was a case of 2 fairly evenly matched teams. You can really only identify the overconfidence thing when the 2 teams are an apparent mismatch and the underdog wins.

We don't have that here either, although it should not be as close as the Preds/Jets. VGK finished with only 5 fewer points than the Jets in the regular season. We can claim that they also had an easier division but they won 2 of 3 between the 2.

In any game in this series the losers may claim that their team was overconfident. No one will be able to either prove or disprove that. Given the parity between the teams it probably won't be true - but it might be true. Maybe VGK was overconfident yesterday, after disposing of LAK and SJS rather easily.
 
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Farmboy Patty

Senior Hockey Analyst
Nov 2, 2017
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Copp Lowry Army


Gaze on that bottom 6 and Just let that sink in for a minute......that is nuts. Either of those lines could go up against anyone. Not sure about you guys but when Copp Lowry and Army are on the ice I can breath easier because they so rarely make mistakes.
Same here :laugh: When Copp Lowry Armia are on the ice, I know that I can relax for a while. Just as their line gives the 1st and 2nd lines some time to recover, they buy all the Jets fans some well needed unclenching time in these clench offs.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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I think this may have been more true in the past then what we see today. The gap even between the best and worst teams is quite small. Teams all work with sports psychologists and have mastered the importance of routine in leveling out highs and lows and keep everyone focused at the task at hand. I was going to ask something along the line that GIN did below, but I can't think of a single NHL team that I thought lost a series because they were over confident. Us fans on the other hand is a whole different story. Just lucky we have no impact on the outcome:laugh:

Fair enough. Things have changed. But I still know I have seen many cases of overconfidence over the years. It may be less common, but it does exist.

Actually I think I have seen it most often in football - single games. Hockey series? I can't think of an example either.

Whattaya mean we have no impact on the outcomes? All this is for nothing? Does life have NO meaning? :laugh:
 
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folix

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Jul 24, 2011
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I think this may have been more true in the past then what we see today. The gap even between the best and worst teams is quite small. Teams all work with sports psychologists and have mastered the importance of routine in leveling out highs and lows and keep everyone focused at the task at hand. I was going to ask something along the line that GIN did below, but I can't think of a single NHL team that I thought lost a series because they were over confident. Us fans on the other hand is a whole different story. Just lucky we have no impact on the outcome:laugh:

Speak for yourself! I have to sit in a certain spot, my phone to one side, 3 ice cubes in my rum and coke, and can't have no socks on. I can't shave the day of or wear my under armour black sweater. If I got to the game I to wear my white jets hat and my white jeresy with jeans, they won't win if I don't do this.

Quite frankly I'm exhausted!
 

YWGinYYZ

Registered User
Jul 3, 2011
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I don't know what you mean by the times that it is not true. All the games where neither team is overconfident? The times when a team is overconfident, but wins anyway? :laugh: This subject really isn't rocket science. I don't think there is any way to pin it down scientifically.

I'm saying it's all hogwash. ;)

Fair enough. Things have changed. But I still know I have seen many cases of overconfidence over the years. It may be less common, but it does exist.

That's your projection, as you have no way of verifying this claim.
 

Jetfaninflorida

Southernmost Jet Fan
Dec 13, 2013
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I don't think Vezina voting is influenced by some technical details. It is about results not technique. Of course it will also be influenced by name recognition and familiarity over a number of years. The voters are far from perfect.

The Vezina voting has already taken place. It is based on regular season, not playoffs. Rinne had slightly better stats than Hellebuyck for the regular season. If Rinne wins it won't be embarrassing. It will be the correct result - based on the regular season.

It will be embarrassing because Helle is better and people saw it in a 7 game series Preds Vs Jets.

Hopefully a non issue because hopefully Helle wins it.
 

Jetfaninflorida

Southernmost Jet Fan
Dec 13, 2013
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So Kulikov was skating in a regular jersey a while back. Is he still injured or just scratched? He’s been out for so long that he’ll probably not get to play in these playoffs even if healthy unfortunately.

I don't think I want Kulikov working himself back in / shaking the rust off in an important playoff game. If we are up in games on Vegas and he can go, let's get him some sheltered ice time there, not in the finals.
 
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jefferoni

your mother was a hamster
Oct 30, 2013
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So Kulikov was skating in a regular jersey a while back. Is he still injured or just scratched? He’s been out for so long that he’ll probably not get to play in these playoffs even if healthy unfortunately.
PMo discussed Kuli after today's practice (9:39 mark)...

 

KingBogo

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Nov 29, 2011
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I don't think I want Kulikov working himself back in / shaking the rust off in an important playoff game. If we are up in games on Vegas and he can go, let's get him some sheltered ice time there, not in the finals.
I don't think Kulikov is going in any time soon. We are winning and healthy (knock wood) and can't imagine much in the way of roster moves.
 

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