More accusations Pete Rose corking his bat

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Pete Rose accused of using corked bat during brief time with Montreal Expos

Pete Rose was accused of using corked bats during his time with the Montreal Expos, a former groundskeeper at Olympic Stadium said in an interview last week.

Joe Jammer, who worked with the Expos for 11 seasons, told the Montreal Gazette he saw Rose corking his bat in 1984. It was Rose’s lone season in Montreal. He was traded to the Cincinnati Reds later in the year

“Pete Rose would have his bats corked in the visitors’ clubhouse at Olympic Stadium,” Jammer told the Gazette. “I found out he was corking bats.

“Pete was too smart to deal with Expos equipment manager John Silverman [to cork his bats],” Jammer said. “So Bryan Greenberg, who worked in the visitors’ clubhouse, did it. He took me into a room, a door to the left, and underneath tarps there was this machine.”

Greenberg told the Gazette he “wasn’t at liberty to discuss” the issue.

Rose’s representative declined to comment when reached by The Gazette.

In 2010, Deadspin published a photo of a bat commissioned by Rose for his chase to the all-time hits record in 1985. An X-Ray of the Mizuno PR4192 appeared to show some object inside the bat. Deadspin determined it was a corked bat.

Rose’s longtime friend Tommy Gioiosa told Vanity Fair in 2001 that Rose was using corked bats in 1985 when he was in his second stint with the Reds.

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[Quid Pro Clowe]

It's cheating and totally in Rose's nature, but corking makes no difference from a performance standpoint.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

This is me being shocked...

Also, corking your bat is stupid.

 

[The Great Mighty Poo]

Cue the geriatric slapasses that will still want him reinstated and in the Hall of Fame.

 

[Hoverhand]

Cue the geriatric slapasses that will still want him reinstated and in the Hall of Fame.

geriatric? It's the die hard pearl clutching traditionalists that want him to stay out of the hall of fame. Like it or not, it's young people who think Rose, Shoeless Joe, and Bonds should be in the hall of fame.

 

[Vegeta]

It's cheating and totally in Rose's nature, but corking makes no difference from a performance standpoint.

In a power sense it doesn't, but it does speed the bat up due to it being lighter. It certainly could have helped a spray hitter like Rose.

At this point, let's just give that hits record back to Cobb.

 

[rent free]

Greatest hitter of all time can play by his own rules.

 

[Foots]

Maybe Rose has been corking his bat his whole career.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Yeah, I'd have like to have seen how Mr. Singles would have handled the extreme shift era.

Would have been nice to see Ray Fosse finish his career, too.

 

[Cubs2024WSChamps]

In a power sense it doesn't, but it does speed the bat up due to it being lighter. It certainly could have helped a spray hitter like Rose.

At this point, let's just give that hits record back to Cobb.

Ehhhh no.

Rose was a damn tank. He beat Cobb and a corked bat isn't gonna help too much if at all.

How many here actually saw Cobb?

How many here actually saw Rose?

Curious

 

[Vegeta]

Ehhhh no.

Rose was a damn tank. He beat Cobb and a corked bat isn't gonna help too much if at all.

How many here actually saw Cobb?

How many here actually saw Rose?

Curious

All I know is this: Cobb was the greatest player of his era. For a long while he was considered the GOAT.

Rose wasn't even the best player on his own team. He wasn't even the second best. Hell, there were 3 Reds better than him during different parts of his prime.

Robinson, Bench and Morgan run circles around him.

He's the epitome of a compiler. People like him because he was blue collar and relatable at the time.

But the reality is, he has crapped on the game's integrity. Not once, but twice.

If Shoeless Joe isn't in the hall, and Barry's HR record isn't recognised, then Corky McBettypants shouldn't be given a damn thing either. Both those guys are much better players, who are being more harshly penalised for imo, less damning offenses. (Shoeless Joe is totally innocent.)

Rose should be kicked to the curb.

 

[82Ninety42011]

Ehhhh no.

Rose was a damn tank. He beat Cobb and a corked bat isn't gonna help too much if at all.

How many here actually saw Cobb?

How many here actually saw Rose?

Curious

Saw Rose in 80's on TV if that counts but I don't remember much to be honest.

 

[Lt Dan]

He's the epitome of a compiler. People like him because he was blue collar and relatable at the time.

Plus he rocked a mean bowl cut

 

[BKIslandersFan]

In a power sense it doesn't, but it does speed the bat up due to it being lighter. It certainly could have helped a spray hitter like Rose.

At this point, let's just give that hits record back to Cobb.

The racist?

 

[Vegeta]

The racist?

That has been thoroughly debunked.

His "racist" reputation was fabricated by a biographer (Al Stump) that profited off Cobb's death by smearing his memory (The trash Tommy Lee Jones movie is based on Stump's "works"). It was discovered in 2010 that Stump fabricated almost the entire thing. What most people think they know about Cobb today is a big, fat, lie.

There was a great book that delved into the whole subject. Ty Cobb: A Terrible Beauty.

That you called him a racist 10 years after the whole thing was exposed shows just how messed the whole situation is. It's easy to lose a reputation. It's almost impossible to earn it back.

As they say, the big story makes the front page, and the retractions are on page 10.

Funny enough, if we go by actual empirical evidence, Cobb is one of the few Golden Era players to support integration in baseball.

When he was asked about Jackie Robinson in 1952, he told the Sporting News

“The negro has the right to compete in sports and who’s to say they have not?”

and also

“I see no reason in the world why we shouldn’t compete with colored athletes as long as they conduct themselves with politeness and gentility. Let me say also that no white man has the right to be less of a gentleman than a colored man, in my book that goes not only for baseball but in all walks of life."

What Stump wrote wasn't just a lie; it was the furthest thing from the truth.

 

[Jumptheshark]

That has been thoroughly debunked.

His "racist" reputation was fabricated by a biographer (Al Stump) that profited off Cobb's death by smearing his memory (The trash Tommy Lee Jones movie is based on Stump's "works"). It was discovered in 2010 that Stump fabricated almost the entire thing. What most people think they know about Cobb today is a big, fat, lie.

There was a great book that delved into the whole subject. Ty Cobb: A Terrible Beauty.

That you called him a racist 10 years after the whole thing was exposed shows just how messed the whole situation is. It's easy to lose a reputation. It's almost impossible to earn it back.

As they say, the big story makes the front page, and the retractions are on page 10.

If we go by actual empirical evidence, Cobb is one of the few Golden Era players to support integration in baseball.

What got Cobb into trouble with certain people was he was a bit of an a-hole. Cobb was a very complicated person and pissed off a lot of people while he was alive and that lead to people rewriting Cobbs of field antics when Cobb passed away

 

[Jumptheshark]

Ty Cobb Was Not A Racist

 

[Vegeta]

What got Cobb into trouble with certain people was he was a bit of an a-hole. Cobb was a very complicated person and pissed off a lot of people while he was alive and that lead to people rewriting Cobbs of field antics when Cobb passed away

I just wish that Stump never picked up a damn pen.

 

[Jumptheshark]

I just wish that Stump never picked up a damn pen.

Because Cobb was born in Georgia and Georgia for years had a reputation has being a hot bed for a certain organization (the KKK) it was not hard to convince people Cobb was that way.

A few years ago I was helping a friend do a doc on myth vs reality when it came to historic sports figures and I did a little research on Cobb. He was a nasty piece of work and what irked some people are the fact that some viewed him as being too close to the owners and when players went to Cobb to try to get help he refused saying it was none of his business. He made a a lot of enemies with his teammates

 

[Vegeta]

Because Cobb was born in Georgia and Georgia for years had a reputation has being a hot bed for a certain organization (the KKK) it was not hard to convince people Cobb was that way.

A few years ago I was helping a friend do a doc on myth vs reality when it came to historic sports figures and I did a little research on Cobb. He was a nasty piece of work and what irked some people are the fact that some viewed him as being too close to the owners and when players went to Cobb to try to get help he refused saying it was none of his business. He made a a lot of enemies with his teammates

Yeah. The most notable of which is probably Sam Crawford. Those two apparently repeatedly butted heads, both literally and figuratively. Both men had egos when it came to their ability, and neither one would concede being second fiddle to the other.

All in all though, it seems to me that Cobb was just a man, flawed like the rest of us. He was deeply interested in finances, and was very business minded. It likely played a huge role in why he conducted himself the way he did when it came to the owners.

But he was also a fiery competitor that saw the field as his magnum opus. He wasn't ever going to let anyone out-compete or outwork him on the diamond. And he did have a rough edge to him clearly, but he also had moments of charity and graciousness as well, such as when he built a home for Bob Robinson and his family (who were black), in the 20s. He was a fantastic ambassador for equality within the game after he was out of the league as well.

At worst you could say he was capable of being an asshole. But race didn't play a role at all.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

The story behind how he got paid in specialized bats instead of money for an endorsement from Louisville Slugger is awesome. They said they saw some of them used in games over 10 years later.

 

[MS]

3.32 bWAR per season is not a HoFer.

Rose is the ultimate compiler. In 14k+ ABs he made less bWAR than Bagwell made in less than 8k ABs.

He also made only 3.32 bWAR per season.

Rose was worth 68 WAR in a 12-season stretch from 1965-76 (in Bagwell's best 12-season stretch, he was worth 71 WAR, by comparison). He was an elite player for well over a decade, and if he'd played only those 12 seasons (and not gambled on baseball) he would be in the BHOF.

Taking his string of crappy seasons in his 40s and dividing his total WAR by his seasons played to make it seem like he was an average player is ridiculous.

 

[Cubs2024WSChamps]

Im in the "Cobb wasn't a racist" camp.

He was an asshole, tho. The whole sliding with cleats up with a smile on his face is something he will never live down considering the cleats back in the day looked like mini nails

 

[ChiTownPhilly]

That has been thoroughly debunked.

His "racist" reputation was fabricated by a biographer (Al Stump) that profited off Cobb's death by smearing his memory (The trash Tommy Lee Jones movie is based on Stump's "works"). It was discovered in 2010 that Stump fabricated almost the entire thing. What most people think they know about Cobb today is a big, fat, lie.

There was a great book that delved into the whole subject. Ty Cobb: A Terrible Beauty.

That you called him a racist 10 years after the whole thing was exposed shows just how messed the whole situation is. It's easy to lose a reputation. It's almost impossible to earn it back.

As they say, the big story makes the front page, and the retractions are on page 10.

At the risk of some thread-drift, Leehrsen's book, or at least working knowledge of its key points, should be required reading for anyone purporting to speak on the topic as though they have any authority.

As for the header-topic [Pete Rose- corked bat?]: not 100% sure it's true, (certainly) not 100% sure it's false, but am 100% sure that it's entirely consistent with his character to do such a thing.

 

[montreal]

I got to watch many games of Pete Rose when he was in philly but I was only a small kid so I was too young as I barely remember the '83 World Series (just turned 8 that summer) Just the other day though I watched a game on youtube where the phillies beat the cubs 23-22 in 10 innings. It was nuts, I forget how many hits Rose had but corked bat or not the man could flat out hit.

I'm in favor of him and Shoeless Joe getting in, I'm not in favor of any of the roids guys getting in.