MLB: New PBA Proposal would Eliminate 25% of Minor League Baseball in 2021

[oknazevad]

furthermore, I propose that the new minor league team in Pawtucket be owned by Hasbro, which is based in the city, and be called the Rhode Island Transformers, as an extension of the Transformers brand, with Optimus Prime as the team mascot

ok, I've been thoroughly annoyed by your constant harping on fantasy alignments and nonsense about a 40-team MLB (not happening for at least 50 years. Just give it up please!)

But this is brilliant. Like absolutely genuinely brilliant.

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

It just so happens the Nashville Sounds franchise is now again the AAA affiliate of the Brewers.

As part of MLB's expansion to Nashville, I see the Brewers purchasing the Sounds franchise with the intention of moving it to New Orleans upon the establishment of the Volunteers. To accomplish this, the Brewers would also purchase the Shrine on Airline with the intent of demolishing it and building a new AAA-ready stadium on the site.

 

[oknazevad]

I could see that. Or the new Nashville team affiliates with a new New Orleans AAA team. Indeed, I would think the relatively short travel distance between Nashville and New Orleans aligns well with the stated intention of reducing travel distances between MLB teams and their high affiliates. Either way, if they can get a new (or heavily renovated) park, New Orleans is a prime choice for a AAA team. If that were to happen and Nashville were to affiliate with New Orleans, Milwaukee could conceivable grab Wichita moving up to AAA, being that Wichita was supposed to be a AAA team only for them to get squeezed to AA before they got to play a AAA game. But of course that would mean at least 2 new AA teams would need to be created. One to affiliate with the Twins to make up for Wichita moving up and one to become Nashville's AA team.

And that's not even accounting for the other expansion team – presumably Montreal – which would also need a set of affiliates; I could see them putting their AAA team in Ottawa, as the stadium is big enough and it would curry favor with the federal government. But that would displace (or adopt) a Frontier League team. So there's be more knock on.

And that's a big part of the reason MLB expansion is so complicated. Any MLB expansion inherently entails minor league expansion. So it's not just two new teams being created, it's ten.

But, as an aside, I don't think Nashville would be called the Volunteers. Sure, the name may have been used in the past, but that was a different time when the college sports programs weren't national powerhouses. I'd actually expect them to keep the Sounds name. I think part of the reason the AAA team changed their logo a few years back into something more staid looking was to set that up.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

University of Tennessee might not allow the use of Volunteers, nevermind the SEC/NCAA

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

I want Memphis to be Nashville's AAA team. There are plenty of MLB teams with AAA affiliates in the same state.

 

[oknazevad]

I want Memphis to be Nashville's AAA team. There are plenty of MLB teams with AAA affiliates in the same state.

Memphis does make some sense, but the Redbirds seem pretty happy with the Cardinals (and vice-versa).

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

Memphis does make some sense, but the Redbirds seem pretty happy with the Cardinals (and vice-versa).

I'm sure the Cardinals will be willing to let Memphis go, considering MLB will want to better organize the AAA affiliations by geography once expansion to 32 is done. Under this plan, the Dodgers would let go of Oklahoma City, and perhaps promote their Low-A affiliate, Rancho Cucamonga, to AAA to serve as their new top affiliate. OKC would align with the Cardinals.

 

[oknazevad]

I'm sure the Cardinals will be willing to let Memphis go, considering MLB will want to better organize the AAA affiliations by geography once expansion to 32 is done. Under this plan, the Dodgers would let go of Oklahoma City, and perhaps promote their Low-A affiliate, Rancho Cucamonga, to AAA to serve as their new top affiliate. OKC would align with the Cardinals.

I don't see the Dodgers giving up OKC considering they own the team outright. If they were going to they would have done such already in this reorganization, as it really is the most illogical of affiliations geographically speaking (well, except for Vancouver being the Blue Jays' High-A affiliate, but that has the Canadian aspect to it). If the Dodgers did want a AAA affiliate in California, they would have adopted Fresno instead of that team dropping to Low-A.

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

Well, the Dodgers would relocate their OKC team to Rancho Cucamonga (which is part of the LA metro area and TV market). A new team in OKC owned by the Cardinals would be awarded (the Cardinals no longer own Memphis outright), and Memphis would sign up with Nashville.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Memphis does make some sense, but the Redbirds seem pretty happy with the Cardinals (and vice-versa).

Z, seems to be misinformed about Tennessee..... there's a reason why Nashville only has the Sounds, the Predators, and the Titans, not to mention Nashville SC, not to mention the perception that Tennessee and Vanderbilt, who calls Nashville its home market, are rivals in the vein of Kentucky/Louisville, Michigan/Michigan State, or USC/UCLA.

Memphis, not already besides being the home of FedEx, has their own unique market, which extends across the state line to Southhaven, Mississippi , with the Memphis Hustle, owned by the Memphis Grizzlies

 

[tank44]

Memphis does make some sense, but the Redbirds seem pretty happy with the Cardinals (and vice-versa).

StLouis has owned Memphis & been affiliated for over 20 years. Memphis is also in close proximity to STL (and closer than OKC). LA has only been involved with OKC for 5 years.

If Nashville were to get MLB expansion I would assume one of Chattanooga, Knoxville/Tennessee or Birmingham being promoted from AA to become their AAA affiliate. Milwaukee would then look at New Orleans, Wichita or San Antonio as their AAA options.
If Portland were to get MLB expansion, I would assume Fresno or Vancouver would be the top options available out west
If Montreal were to get MLB expansion, I'd think they'd take over the Rochester affiliation and Washington would look at promoting Richmond, Harrisburg or Bowie to be their local AAA tea

If there was relocation, the new city may not match the minor league baseball teams as well as the original franchise. Maybe some dominoes would fall later but not sure how local issues could affect these teams going forward.

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

I already said that STL no longer owns Memphis.

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

Of course if the NCAA allows players to be paid for their services (which they should), then the Appalachian League can one day return to being a professional league in a sense, despite their teams no longer being part of MLB farm systems.

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

Names for new minor league teams:
32-team alignment:
New Orleans Baby Cakes (reused name from defunct team)
Pawtucket - Rhode Island Transformers (as mentioned above)
Lexington Legends (moving in from Atlantic League)
Annapolis Destroyers (Annapolis is home to the Naval Academy, and destroyers are a class of ships in the navy)
Olympia Titans (alludes to city name)
Victoria Regals (alludes to Queen Victoria)
Santa Barbara Barbers
North Port Manatees
Port Charlotte Gulls

40-team alignment:
San Jose Seals (named after former San Francisco Seals)
Rockford Forests (Rockford also called Forest City)
Ottawa Titans (moving in from Frontier League)
Quebec Capitales (reusing name of defunct team)
Boise Hawks (moving in from Pioneer League)
Rocky Mountain Vibes (moving in from Pioneer League)
Orem Smiths (in honor of Joseph Smith)
Flagstaff Dark Skies (Flagstaff is Dark Sky City)
Santa Fe Kringles (in reference to Santa Claus)
Long Beach Doggs (would be owned by Snoop Dogg, a native of Long Beach, also refers to Dodger affiliation via Dodger Dog)
Oceanside Jarheads (near Marine Base Camp Pendelton, Jarhead is a term for a Marine)
Salem-Keizer Volcanoes (possibly moving in from Pioneer League)
Tri-City ValleyCats (moving in from Frontier League)
Springfield (MA) Rifles (after the rifles once manufactured in the city)
Tallahassee Senators (Tallahassee is capital of Florida)
Cleburne Railroaders (moving in from American Association)
Long Island Ducks (moving in from Atlantic League)
Dover Pinschers (refers to Doberman Pinschers)
Ann Arbor Tiger Cubs (reflects status as Detroit Tigers affiliate)
Athens Olympians (named after the Ancient Olympics)
Columbia Torches (a reference to the Columbia Pictures logo)
Springfield (IL) Capitals (Springfield is capital of Illinois)
Bend Elks (moving in from collegiate summer West Coast League)
Corvallis Knights (moving in from collegiate summer West Coast League)
Medford Rogues (moving in from collegiate summer West Coast League)
Springfield (OR) Isotopes (named in honor of The Simpsons)
Merced Bears (old CA League team)
Monterey Jacks (refers to the cheese)
Imperial Emperors
Santa Ana Saints
Melbourne Kangaroos (named in reference to Melbourne, Australia; that country has a lot of kangaroos)
St. Augustine Saints
Petersburg Griffins (named in reference to Peter Griffin from Family Guy)
Albany (GA) Dukes (named in honor of the namesake of the city's namesake)
Columbus (GA) Explorers (named in honor of the city's namesake)
Florence Nightingales (named in honor of the nurse)
Savannah Twinkies (as part of a marketing deal with Hostess, based on Savannah being called "The Hostess City of the South")
Spartanburg Spartans
High Point Rockers (moving in from Atlantic League)

48-team alignment:
Evansville Otters (moving in from Frontier League)
Hamilton Hammers (in reference to a nickname for Hamilton)
Mariachis de Guadalajara (moving in from Mexican League)
Vermont Lake Monsters (moving in from collegiate summer Futures Collegiate Baseball League)
Hagerstown TBD (moving in from Atlantic League)
Williamsport Crosscutters (moving in from MLB Draft League)
Tri-City Triplets (TN/VA, reason for name is obvious)
Gainesville Suns (Florida is the Sunshine State)
Macon Peaches (reviving name of defunct team)
Valdosta Azaleas (Valdosta is Azalea City)
Baton Rouge Cajuns (Louisiana is known for their Cajun culture)
Shreveport Captains (reviving name of old team)
Victoria Generals (in honor of the city's namesake)
Calgary Cattle (in honor of Cowtown nickname)
Carson City Johnnies (in reference to Johnny Carson)
Bridgeport Bluefish (reviving name of defunct team)
Southern Maryland Blue Crabs (moving in from Atlantic League)
Lowcountry Gators
Abbotsford Abbots
Redding Herrings (playing on the term red herring)
Duluth-Superior Dukes (reviving name of defunct team)
Fargo-Moorhead RedHawks (moving in from American Association)
Sioux Falls Canaries (moving in from American Association)
Winnipeg Goldeyes (moving in from American Association)
Sioux City Explorers (moving in from American Association)
Gastonia Honey Hunters (moving in from Atlantic League)
Atlantic City Blackjacks
Gettysburg Generals
Lancaster Barmstormers (moving in from Atlantic League)
Trenton Thunder (moving in from MLB Draft League)
York Revolution (moving in from Atlantic League)
Chico Chickens
Salinas Missions
Santa Rosa Roses
San Luis Obsipo Bishops (in reference to namesake)

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Names for new minor league teams:
32-team alignment:
New Orleans Baby Cakes (reused name from defunct team)
Pawtucket - Rhode Island Transformers (as mentioned above)
Lexington Legends (potentially moving in from Frontier League)
Annapolis Destroyers
Olympia Titans
Victoria Monarchs
Santa Barbara Barbers
North Port Manatees
Sarasota Gulls

40-team alignment:
San Jose Seals
Rockford Forests
Ottawa Titans (moving in from Frontier League)
Quebec Capitales (reusing name of defunct team)
Boise Hawks (moving in from Pioneer League)
Rocky Mountain Vibes (moving in from Pioneer League)
Orem Smiths
Flagstaff Dark Skies
Santa Fe Kringles (in reference to Santa Claus)
Long Beach Doggs
Oceanside Jarheads
Salem-Keizer Volcanoes (possibly moving in from Pioneer League)
Capital District Yankees (or Tri-City ValleyCats can be reused)
Springfield (MA) Rifles
Tallahassee Senators
Cleburne Railroaders (moving in from American Association)
Long Island Ducks (moving in from Atlantic League)
Dover Pinschers
Ann Arbor Tiger Cubs
Athens Olympians
Columbia Torches (a reference to the Columbia Pictures logo)
Springfield (IL) Capitals
Bend Elks (moving in from collegiate summer West Coast League)
Corvallis Knights (moving in from collegiate summer West Coast League)
Medford Rogues (moving in from collegiate summer West Coast League)
Springfield (OR) Isotopes (named in honor of The Simpsons)
Merced Bears
Monterey Jacks
Imperial Emperors
Santa Ana Saints
Melbourne Kangaroos
St. Augustine Saints
Petersburg Griffins (named in reference to Peter Griffin from Family Guy)
Albany (GA) Dukes
Columbus (GA) Explorers
Florence Nightingales
Savannah Colonials
Spartanburg Spartans
High Point Rockers (moving in from Atlantic League)

Pawtucket/RI likely is done, AS A MARKET, nevermind the Stadium, Z, its fate was sealed a la New Britain's exit from affiliated baseball, when Hartford became the focus of affiliated baseball, Norwich, to a lesser degree, was phased out, as you saw with Trenton, being replaced by Somerset, among others....

you will have tweaks here and there, but the list of 119 probably is as accurate as it'll be.

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

A new stadium can always be built on the site on the old

When a city loses a team over stadium issues, they work hard to build a new stadium for a replacement team (like Seattle when it lost the Pilots after only one season).

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

A new stadium can always be built on the site on the old

When a city loses a team over stadium issues, they work hard to build a new stadium for a replacement team (like Seattle when it lost the Pilots after only one season).

Why would the State of Rhode Island rebuild McCoy Stadium, Z, where would they place it, as Pawtucket tried doing that and nothing came to pass, hence the end of Pawtucket as an affiliated franchise, nevermind, why Worcester acquired the franchise....

it's why density of the region is an issue, and why Norwich/New Britain eventually ceded their status to Richmond, and Hartford, at least at the Double AA Level

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

McCoy Stadium would be demolished, and a new stadium built on the site.

You didn't seem to get my message about when a city loses its team because the stadium is not up to modern day standards, they work hard to get a replacement team.

An example in football is when the Baltimore Colts left for Indianapolis in 1984. The city of Baltimore refused to build a new stadium for the Colts, but when they left, they decided not only to build a new football stadium eventually in the hopes of the NFL returning (which it did with the Ravens in 1996), but in order to keep the Orioles from relocating, they build Camden Yards.

So, if Rhode Island wants to get back into minor league baseball bad enough, they will demolish McCoy Stadium and build a new AAA-ready stadium on the site, though they'd probably get an AA franchise first. Since Hasbro is headquartered in Pawtucket they could lead the drive to bring affiliated baseball back.

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

Furthermore, New Britain is a suburb of Hartford. So the team there really relocated within the metro area.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Furthermore, New Britain is a suburb of Hartford. So the team there really relocated within the metro area.

wrong, were u there when the Yard Goats were relocated from New Britain to Hartford, New Britain elected not to pursue keeping the team there once that decision was made, Z, same reasoning as to why Worcester acquired the Pawtucket franchise and spent the latter 2 seasons building the branding of Worcester Baseball.

 

[oknazevad]

I already said that STL no longer owns Memphis.

The still are part owners (like 25%, iinm).

 

[oknazevad]

wrong, were u there when the Yard Goats were relocated from New Britain to Hartford, New Britain elected not to pursue keeping the team there once that decision was made, Z, same reasoning as to why Worcester acquired the Pawtucket franchise and spent the latter 2 seasons building the branding of Worcester Baseball.

He's not entirely wrong regarding the New Britain/Hartford situation. There's a reason the Atlantic League team in New Britain that replaced the now-Yard Goats dropped down to summer collegiate ball after only a couple of years. They just couldn't keep up in the market with the Yard Goats and their newer, more centrally located (if delayed) ballpark. It really is the same market and is still being served by the same franchise, albeit in a new ballpark and with a new name.

This is different from the Pawtucket/Worcester situation, where the team went from one sub-market to another within the same larger metro area. Unlike Hartford/New Britain, the Providence/Pawtucket market is now open. I don't agree, however, that there's going to be that much of a push for a new ballpark if it's not for a Red Sox affiliate.

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

He's not entirely wrong regarding the New Britain/Hartford situation. There's a reason the Atlantic League team in New Britain that replaced the now-Yard Goats dropped down to summer collegiate ball after only a couple of years. They just couldn't keep up in the market with the Yard Goats and their newer, more centrally located (if delayed) ballpark. It really is the same market and is still being served by the same franchise, albeit in a new ballpark and with a new name.

This is different from the Pawtucket/Worcester situation, where the team went from one sub-market to another within the same larger metro area. Unlike Hartford/New Britain, the Providence/Pawtucket market is now open. I don't agree, however, that there's going to be that much of a push for a new ballpark if it's not for a Red Sox affiliate.

Well, I have Bowie moving up to AAA as a Nationals affiliate, which means a new Red Sox AA affiliate could take their place in the EL. Portland would hook up with Montreal.

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

Well, under my geographic reorganization (in terms of alignment and affiliations) of AAA would call for this:

The OKC partnership, which includes the Dodgers, would purchase class A Rancho Cucamonga, relocating the class A team to Santa Barbara, and the OKC team to Rancho Cucamonga, retaining the Quakes identity from class A.

The Memphis partnership (including the Cardinals) would then move the current Memphis team to OKC (and assume the history of previous AAA teams in OKC), thereby operating as the Oklahoma City Redbirds.

A new team in Memphis, owned by the Nashville Volunteers, would be awarded and assume the Redbirds' history, potentially called the Memphis Blues (in honor of the blues music scene there).

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

Ultimately when I want each level of organized baseball to expand to 40 teams, the new Pawtucket team would move up to AAA to serve as the affiliate at that level for Hartford's MLB expansion team. It's about time the Red Sox had real competition in New England.