Salary Cap: Mitch Marner Contract Discussion Part X | Will Mitch get an OS?

[Suntouchable13]

The fact that the majority of the best players in the League has always been centers seems to confused the issue. Orr, Howe, Hull and his Son, Kane etc. If you are the best player on your team you will be the highest paid. That has always been the way.

It's debatable whether he is the best player on the team.

 

[ORRFForever]

LOL, but they also trying to give you 80M over 8 years.

True, but like I said, the kids got an ego and thinks he can get 88.

 

[diceman934]

It's what any kid would do at 22?

Aho just accepted fair market value. He's the same age.

Did Aho sign in Toronto? He signed for below his value and in Montreal where he would not be the team’s best player. Marner has been our best player and he wants to be paid as such. In fact I am sure he will take less then our highest contract but not going to sign for a lot less.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

Did Aho sign in Toronto? He signed for below his value and in Montreal where he would not be the team’s best player. Marner has been our best player and he wants to be paid as such. In fact I am sure he will take less then our highest contract but not going to sign for a lot less.

Who on Montreal (or Carolina for that matter) is better than Aho?

 

[HolyCrap]

Did Aho sign in Toronto? He signed for below his value and in Montreal where he would not be the team’s best player. Marner has been our best player and he wants to be paid as such. In fact I am sure he will take less then our highest contract but not going to sign for a lot less.

Sign for a lot less? What are the a lot less offers? Everything I seen speculated is more than market value or at least fair

 

[Kiwi]

Please put some numbers around it for me that shows he is a better talent than Marner instead of a few random tosses that obscures team play vs player performance.

Franchise leading 1C
Doesn't play with anybody as good as Tavares
Lead his team through 3 rounds of the playoffs
Scored 83 points during the regular season only 11 less than Marner
Much better goalscorer on his ECL

He's more valuable, he was offersheeted, Marner wasn't

I don't think the league agrees with your assessment

 

[18leafsfan18]

Nick Kypreos just asked on PTS (I'm paraphrasing)...

How come Kawhi Leonard is getting nothing but love during his negotiation, but Mitch Marner is getting raked over the coals as a "greedy little kid"?

Mr. Kypreos has a point.

Not even close to the same.

Did marner win the city a Title ?

Was Kawhi traded here and was one of the best players in the league when traded ?

Is Kawhi from Toronto and was drafted here ?

What a dumb comparison, but doesn't surprise me coming from kypreos.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

Franchise leading 1C
Doesn't play with anybody as good as Tavares
Lead his team through 3 rounds of the playoffs
Scored 83 points during the regular season only 11 less than Marner

He's more valuable, he was offersheeted, Marner wasn't

I don't think the league agrees with your assessment

Let's also add Marner had 67 elc goals, and Aho had 83. We were all told in the Matthews threads that goals were FAR more important than points.

 

[gamer1035]

Franchise leading 1C
Doesn't play with anybody as good as Tavares
Lead his team through 3 rounds of the playoffs
Scored 83 points during the regular season only 11 less than Marner

He's more valuable, he was offersheeted, Marner wasn't

I don't think the league agrees with your assessment

Exactly. I would take Aho easily over Marner.

Our rfas are terrible. All 3 are gonna go to UFA for sure, unless we give an overpayment

 

[Kiwi]

Let's also add Marner had 67 elc goals, and Aho had 83. We were all told in the Matthews threads that goals were FAR more important than points.

Very true

 

[Sypher04]

If the Leafs walk away from their best player (provided he's offer sheeted), I'll be pissed.

Luckily Matthews is already signed. I'm only have joking here. I think Matthews and Marner both have some points of argument for being the best on the team. Fact of the matter is though, There are existing comparables and metrics that dictate pay and they favour Matthews being paid more highly than Marner. And even at that, there is a general feeling Matthews got a bit too much. None of that supports Mitch's ask for Matthews money.

 

[socko]

It's what any kid would do at 22?

Aho just accepted fair market value. He's the same age.

Aho doesn't have Dubas.

 

[Funk21]

Nick Kypreos just asked on PTS (I'm paraphrasing)...

How come Kawhi Leonard is getting nothing but love during his negotiation, but Mitch Marner is getting raked over the coals as a "greedy little kid"?

Mr. Kypreos has a point.

Kypreos is an idiot. There is nothing similar:

Kawhi just won an NBA Championship, the first in the Raptors 24 year history. It was his first year with the Raptors and coming off an major injury. He has two championships and two finals MVP. Why doesn’t Kypreos look up the players on that list and say Marner would be the equivalent-what a joke.

Kawhi won the Finals MVP and if there was a playoff MVP he would have won that too.

He is going to get max money from Toronto or any other team he plays for unless he decides to join a super team and make slightly less.

Kawhi is one of the top 5 players on the planet. Would you say that about Marner?

Lastly he is a UFA, Marner is not. If fact he doesn’t have arbitration rights.

Getting back to NHL, there is a hard cap. NBA has a soft cap and Luxury Tax. You have to take everybody’s salary into consideration when building your team.


When Marner plays 60 mins a night then he can ask for 13 million.....see how stupid we can all sound. Just because Kypreos has a platform doesn’t mean his words are any wiser than any of the fans in this site.

 

[ORRFForever]

Just because Kypreos has a platform doesn’t mean his words are any wiser than any of the fans in this site.

Not wiser, but certainly worth more.

 

[Jmo89]

Nick Kypreos just asked on PTS (I'm paraphrasing)...

How come Kawhi Leonard is getting nothing but love during his negotiation, but Mitch Marner is getting raked over the coals as a "greedy little kid"?

Mr. Kypreos has a point.

Its a bad point for two reasons. The first being that there is no negotiation over Kawhi's contract. He's getting the max, just like lesser players in Middleton and Harris got the max. The NBA has a completely different team building than the NHL and half decent players get max money.

The love is in trying to get Kawhi to stay over going home to LA. Marner is already home.

Second, Kawhi lead the team to a championship on a bad knee. He won a finals MVP. His biggest moment was probably the game 7 buzzer beater (first in NBA history) against Philly. Marner's biggest moment last year was a blocked shot in game 1 and then he slowly faded.

If you're a fan of both sports and both teams, none of the Leafs deserve the kind of love Kawhi is getting right now. The Raps exceeded expectations. The Leafs continued to disappoint.

 

[ORRFForever]

Its a bad point for two reasons. The first being that there is no negotiation over Kawhi's contract. He's getting the max, just like lesser players in Middleton and Harris got the max. The NBA has a completely different team building than the NHL and half decent players get max money.

The love is in trying to get Kawhi to stay over going home to LA. Marner is already home.

Second, Kawhi lead the team to a championship on a bad knee. He won a finals MVP. His biggest moment was probably the game 7 buzzer beater (first in NBA history) against Philly. Marner's biggest moment last year was a blocked shot in game 1 and then he slowly faded.

If you're a fan of both sports and both teams, none of the Leafs deserve the kind of love Kawhi is getting right now. The Raps exceeded expectations. The Leafs continued to disappoint.

I don't care about basketball. I love the Leafs and want the best team possible. Mitch Marner is on that team.

I don't understand why no one likes the idea of low balling Marner with a 4 year deal at $8M/yr. If he jumps, we saved $3M in Cap space per year. Yes, he will be a UFA sooner, but we may have a Cup by then.

 

[Suntouchable13]

Its a bad point for two reasons. The first being that there is no negotiation over Kawhi's contract. He's getting the max, just like lesser players in Middleton and Harris got the max. The NBA has a completely different team building than the NHL and half decent players get max money.

The love is in trying to get Kawhi to stay over going home to LA. Marner is already home.

Second, Kawhi lead the team to a championship on a bad knee. He won a finals MVP. His biggest moment was probably the game 7 buzzer beater (first in NBA history) against Philly. Marner's biggest moment last year was a blocked shot in game 1 and then he slowly faded.

If you're a fan of both sports and both teams, none of the Leafs deserve the kind of love Kawhi is getting right now. The Raps exceeded expectations. The Leafs continued to disappoint.

I am sure if Marner lead us to a cup AND won the Conn, then none of us would really care how much money he would make. It's that simple. That's why there is a huge difference here.

 

[Funk21]

Not wiser, but certainly worth more.

Unfortunately!

 

[hamzarocks]

Kypreos is an idiot. There is nothing similar:

Kawhi just won an NBA Championship, the first in the Raptors 24 year history. It was his first year with the Raptors and coming off an major injury. He has two championships and two finals MVP. Why doesn’t Kypreos look up the players on that list and say Marner would be the equivalent-what a joke.

Kawhi won the Finals MVP and if there was a playoff MVP he would have won that too.

He is going to get max money from Toronto or any other team he plays for unless he decides to join a super team and make slightly less.

Kawhi is one of the top 5 players on the planet. Would you say that about Marner?

Lastly he is a UFA, Marner is not. If fact he doesn’t have arbitration rights.

Getting back to NHL, there is a hard cap. NBA has a soft cap and Luxury Tax. You have to take everybody’s salary into consideration when building your team.


When Marner plays 60 mins a night then he can ask for 13 million.....see how stupid we can all sound. Just because Kypreos has a platform doesn’t mean his words are any wiser than any of the fans in this site.

Spot on kypreos made no sense with the Kawhi comp. Kawhi is the greatest athlete to play for any Toronto franchise since the 90s. If he decides to stay here hell have a statue built I'm sure and his number retired. No leaf player currently even compares to him.

 

[Jmo89]

I don't care about basketball. I love the Leafs and want the best team possible. Mitch Marner is on that team.

I don't understand why no one likes the idea of low balling Marner with a 4 year deal at $8M/yr. If he jumps, we saved $3M in Cap space per year. Yes, he will be a UFA sooner, but we may have a Cup by then.

I want Marner signed as well. I love his energy and I think this core can get it done in the next 5 years.

Management (dating back to Lou) and the big 3 have handled this situation poorly IMO, and honestly I'm tired of hearing about it at this point. Either sign the guy and fix the D by next off-season, or let him walk and use the assets to plug the holes.

And btw, my post was moreso in reply to Kypreos. It's a poor comparison IMO.

 

[Superstar]

Nick Kypreos just asked on PTS (I'm paraphrasing)...

How come Kawhi Leonard is getting nothing but love during his negotiation, but Mitch Marner is getting raked over the coals as a "greedy little kid"?

Mr. Kypreos has a point.

Not surprised...Paul probably told Kypreos that Kawhi is Marner's comparable now...

 

[DarkKnight]

MB would, and a hell of a lot of other GM’s, you build through the C position.

Panarin is just as talented only got 11.6 for 7 years. Kucherov 9.5 for 8. Marner needs to understand he isn’t the greatest hockey player in the world. He will get paid and handsomely but fair market would be 9.5-10.5 for 7/8 years.

Nobody would, again that's why everyone says he gets more than Aho, it isn't an accident.

 

[gabeliscious]

Nick Kypreos just asked on PTS (I'm paraphrasing)...

How come Kawhi Leonard is getting nothing but love during his negotiation, but Mitch Marner is getting raked over the coals as a "greedy little kid"?

Mr. Kypreos has a point.

1) kawhi brought our first championship ever home
2) he is a ufa who earned the right to sign anywhere

Marner needs to put in his dues. I agree marner is getting slammed in the media but that is entertainment. I do believe each side is on good terms with each other and they are negotiating.

Hopefully the aho offersheet sets the bar at what marner can expect. One would think an offersheet would be a higher price so the fact that ahos was only 8.5 probably is a sign of things to come for marner

 

[Notsince67]

It seems we have to pay each leaf player based on what their specific individual strengths are compared to similar players, while ignoring everything else about their game.

With Matthews it was g/60, but we'll ignore that his career high is 73 points, and he "played with scrubs".

With Marner it's now primary points, but we'll ignore goals and ignore Tavares.

This is a dangerous way to run a team.

There are minimal differences between goals and primary assists when it comes to randomness. I already posted the correlation coefficient differences between the two. I am interested in results, not random mantras that are unsupported statistically. I want pay to reflect ability. I've already said that the market league wide supports a contract north of 9MM for 5 years based on Kane being the closest comparable. Unfortunately, Dubas has altered the market dynamics and Marner will likely be paid a better contract than that. If he doesn't, the piper will still be paid down the road. Nobody knows how good Marner will be but if he maintains his play, he would be the best Leaf the team has ever seen in it's history. Imagine losing that to free agency because of random favoritism.
I would really like to know...if next year is identical to this one, is Marner still the third best player on the team? Does he still deserve the 4th best $$/points on the team?

 

[dubey]

Nick Kypreos just asked on PTS (I'm paraphrasing)...

How come Kawhi Leonard is getting nothing but love during his negotiation, but Mitch Marner is getting raked over the coals as a "greedy little kid"?

Mr. Kypreos has a point.

He only has a point if you actually believe that Dave Stieb had as big of an impact on the Blue Jays as Kawhi had on the Raptors LOL