Speculation: Missing two of our best has helped us become a better team.

Has the loss of Matthews and Nylander helped forge a better team?


  • Total voters
    65

meefer

Registered User
Jun 9, 2015
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Bangkok
Granted, it is impossible to definitively measure this idea, but I suspect that Nylander's contract stalemate and Matthews injury has had a beneficial impact on the team rounding into form. Tavares and Marner shouldering the main offensive thrust, Marleau and Kadri accepting the challenges and succeeding, Kapanen continuing - if not improving - in his breakout year, Johnsson's efforts improving as his presence was called upon, Leivo's hustle given the chance, even Lindlholm and Gauthier have upped their efforts as they are called upon to replace the minutes that have been lost because of two stars being unavailable. Further, Rielly has, imo, cemented his presence as a force to be reckoned with, while assuming the leadership role with his words and actions that go with being the low-key leader that allows others to express their contributions in the locker room while admiring Morgan's supreme dedication to the team. In this regard, Andersen can't be overlooked either. In fact, other than Hyman and Brown, and I say this as a compliment to both because they are the consummate motor type players, it's hard for me to see anyone on the team who hasn't picked up their game since Matthews went down.

Essentially, while the team knew and responded well to the absence of Nylander and by losing Matthews to injury, the team was forced to jell and respond as a team to succeed. They have done so. The Leafs are a stronger 'team' due to the absences of two of their best players. They will be even scarier to face when and if they both return.
 

Polaris1010

Registered User
Mar 23, 2017
3,800
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grandma's cellar
The team on the just concluded road trip is one of the strongest defensive Leafs team in a long time.

There is a premium #1 center, and a 2nd line center both 30 goal scorers. Both lines have wingers that can score.

Then the 3rd and 4th lines have finally gelled. Everyone knows their roles.

This road trip, rarely were the Leafs not in control regarding their defensive play. If they had a lead, they controlled the game.

Matthews is still a young center in the league. His defensive play is not as good as Tavares or Kadri, or even Lindhom.

Maybe Bozak really was that bad at center.

Matthews ... Bozak ... Kadri

Taraves ... Kadri ... Lindhom

It is like night and day how the team plays defense comparing who is down the middle from last year to the team finishing this road trip.
 
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LaPlante94

Registered User
Apr 12, 2011
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The team on the just concluded road trip is one of the strongest defensive Leafs team in a long time.

There is a premium #1 center, and a 2nd line center both 30 goal scorers. Both lines have wingers that can score.

Then the 3rd and 4th lines have finally gelled. Everyone knows their roles.

This road trip, rarely were the Leafs not in control regarding their defensive play. If they had a lead, they controlled the game.

Matthews is still a young center in the league. His defensive play is not as good as Tavares or Kadri, or even Lindhom.

Maybe Bozak really was that bad at center.

Matthews ... Bozak ... Kadri

Taraves ... Kadri ... Lindhom

It is like night and day how the team plays defense comparing who is down the middle from last year to the team finishing this road trip.

I wouldn't say Tavares is better than Matthews defensively. Tavares has some brain farts sometimes but that was more during the beginning of the year and hasn't happened as much lately. He does hustle back though to help the D on the backcheck unlike previous forwards we've had. A good example is the OT GWG we scored. Tavares lost it and hustled back to cause a turnover which led to our 2 on 1.
 

Antropovsky

Registered User
Jun 2, 2007
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I wouldn't say Tavares is better than Matthews defensively. Tavares has some brain farts sometimes but that was more during the beginning of the year and hasn't happened as much lately. He does hustle back though to help the D on the backcheck unlike previous forwards we've had. A good example is the OT GWG we scored. Tavares lost it and hustled back to cause a turnover which led to our 2 on 1.

I feel like he's done that backcheck to a goal play at least once prior to the Anaheim game.
 

LeafGrief

Shambles in my brain
Apr 10, 2015
7,616
9,532
Ottawa
It's given opportunities to Kappy and Kadri to produce more, but I don't think it's forcing the team to play better. This was always a fantastic team and Matthews/Nylander being out is the adversity that is proving how good the rest of the squad is.
 
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Liminality

Registered User
Oct 22, 2008
13,366
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I think that giving Kadri/Kapanen more minutes has given them way more confidence than if they were just given 3rd line minutes. I just hope they can keep this confidence for when they do go lower in the line up again. We need them to feast on 3rd pairing match ups.
 
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gabeliscious

Registered User
Jan 8, 2009
7,574
257
The team on the just concluded road trip is one of the strongest defensive Leafs team in a long time.

There is a premium #1 center, and a 2nd line center both 30 goal scorers. Both lines have wingers that can score.

Then the 3rd and 4th lines have finally gelled. Everyone knows their roles.

This road trip, rarely were the Leafs not in control regarding their defensive play. If they had a lead, they controlled the game.

Matthews is still a young center in the league. His defensive play is not as good as Tavares or Kadri, or even Lindhom.

Maybe Bozak really was that bad at center.

Matthews ... Bozak ... Kadri

Taraves ... Kadri ... Lindhom

It is like night and day how the team plays defense comparing who is down the middle from last year to the team finishing this road trip.

lindholm is a more suitable 3rd line center then bozak imo. bozak is more of a low grade 2c, he is not capable of playing challenging defensive matchups. it is crazy to see how dominant we can be with a franchise center and top line winger not in the lineup. if we could ever had a top pairing defenseman to gel with rielly we would be off to the races.
 

Buds17

Registered User
Nov 29, 2015
8,223
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Two of the forwards are going to be out of the lineup when Matthews and when/if Nylander returns, and a forward or d-man is going to be traded or waived. There should definitely be a sense of urgency in the opportunity at hand.

Teams unfortunately lose players to injury from time to time and they need to come together and pull through with no excuses. This Leaf team still has a very good amount of talent even with the absences, but the eventual returns will obviously be much welcomed.
 

meefer

Registered User
Jun 9, 2015
4,682
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Bangkok
From Brownscombe of Maple Leafs Hot Stove (and I swear, I hadn't read this before my OP :nod:)

"1. The Leafs just completed a rare and difficult sweep of their California road swing — formerly a trip that almost always exposed just how far the Leafs had to go if they were to ever be a competitive NHL hockey club. And they did it without William Nylander and Auston Matthews, who the Leafs are now 6-3-0 without.
It’s interesting, the psychological effect that can take place when two of the four most offensively-skilled players on the roster are out of the lineup. Certainly, it can break teams without enough depth of talent, but for good organizations with enough quality depth, it produces an opportunity as much as it does a challenge. Players further down the depth chart feel more emboldened and are no longer waiting around for the big boys to get the job done. It also seems as though Babcock has been able to get full buy-in and has the team in a better place structurally than prior to Matthews’ absence. Provided Matthews comes back healthy from this and doesn’t battle lingering issues and assuming Nylander eventually is signed, we may look back at this as one of the more valuable experiences the team went through as it gears up for playoff time."
 

IPS

Registered User
Sep 28, 2017
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No. We're a good team without Nylander/Matthews. Good teams know how to step up when their best player goes down, Pittsburgh constantly battles injuries with Malkin/Crosby and things always work out fine.
 

gabeliscious

Registered User
Jan 8, 2009
7,574
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Gardiner has become an anchor for the D. Hopefully Dubas gets him signed!

mackenzie or someone was talking about it on the radio a week or so ago and said that leafs flat out told gardiners agent that they cannot discuss an extension until matthews and marner are sorted. they also basically implied that gardiner would need to take a team friendly deal to stay in toronto. obviously nothing shocking. i think it just depends on what kind of term and salary he is looking for. i think the leafs would want him int he $5.5 x 5 years. he could obviously get well over $6 on the open market.
 

Jimmy Firecracker

Fire Sheldon.
Mar 30, 2010
35,559
34,105
Mississauga
I’m going to say yes because without Nylander's holdout and Matthews’ injury (both I wish didn’t happen/were happening) guys that are getting playing time now wouldn’t be otherwise. As a result guys like Kapanen, Lindholm, Gauthier, and Leivo wouldn’t be in the positions they’re in and wouldn’t have improved as much as players without the playing time now afforded to them.

Our depth guys playing more and tougher minutes will make them and the team all the better for it.
 
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HomerJLeafs

i just hope we make the POs
Dec 27, 2017
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back in the Sundin era when Mats was playing every player was ok hes gonna take care of everything and the team is doing the exact same thing when Matts is playing.
 

Pookie

Wear a mask
Oct 23, 2013
16,172
6,684
We are a good regular season team.

The dumb thing about this league and the gimmick point system is that if we hit a 3 game skid instead of 3 W’s out west, we’d be out of a playoff spot as of today.
 

Stephen

Moderator
Feb 28, 2002
77,850
51,520
As successful as the California trip has been, that state isn't what it used to be.
 

Mike1

Registered User
Jul 29, 2002
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I wouldn't say that it's made us a better team. It might have given certain players like Kapanen more confidence but thats it.

As good as a team as this has been, they would be even better with Matthews & a sharp Nylander. If the contract situation gets resolved, are you getting a sharp William Nylander? I'm not so sure. Everyone is focused on the numbers & not on what you would be getting for the rest of this season. The guy has missed two months of action & the games are going to get faster & sharper from here on in.
 

Shayne Corsi

Registered User
Oct 17, 2017
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I wouldn't say Tavares is better than Matthews defensively. Tavares has some brain farts sometimes but that was more during the beginning of the year and hasn't happened as much lately. He does hustle back though to help the D on the backcheck unlike previous forwards we've had. A good example is the OT GWG we scored. Tavares lost it and hustled back to cause a turnover which led to our 2 on 1.

Albeit largely relative to the eye test, Tavares looks to me to be significantly better than Matthews defensively. Matthews has great defensive potential, but he still makes a lot of mistakes; Tavares is just so much more consistent. This is actually something that I've noticed about Tavares more generally: he really is that true #1 200 foot franchise #C every night. It's actually remarkable how consistent Tavares is on both sides of the puck game in and game out. So while I think Matthews has higher upside than JT, to my eye he has not reached that same level of consistency yet (which, to be fair, is unsurprising for a 21 year old).
 

hector morrison

Registered User
Apr 1, 2018
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What it has done is (unfortunately) raised Marners value. If there were any doubts as to the players he is being compared to...there are none now. That boy gonna get paid!
 

Apotheosis

Registered User
Mar 27, 2014
11,605
5,140
Toronto, Ontario
No doubt. Now imagine how good this team will be when they come back. Marleau and Kadri have the chemistry they had prior. Johnsson has found his form again (could probably fill in on any line right now). Kapanen is still playing great.

Kapanen - Matthews - Nylander
Hyman - Tavares - Marner

As your top 6...

Rielly, Matthews, Tavares, Marner and Nylander as your first PP...

THEY MUST COME BACK ASAP
 

BertCorbeau

F*ck cancer - RIP Fugu and Buffaloed
Jan 6, 2012
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Its forced the depth guys to sink or swim.. luckily the leafs have the structure, top end calibre of players, and goaltending to help them succeed:

It will be interesting to see how these guys play once matthews and Nylander are back
 
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LaPlante94

Registered User
Apr 12, 2011
6,705
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Albeit largely relative to the eye test, Tavares looks to me to be significantly better than Matthews defensively. Matthews has great defensive potential, but he still makes a lot of mistakes; Tavares is just so much more consistent. This is actually something that I've noticed about Tavares more generally: he really is that true #1 200 foot franchise #C every night. It's actually remarkable how consistent Tavares is on both sides of the puck game in and game out. So while I think Matthews has higher upside than JT, to my eye he has not reached that same level of consistency yet (which, to be fair, is unsurprising for a 21 year old).

Idk. It's hard to say because Matthews stick checking abilities are just unreal, but Tavares is really good at that too and is stronger on his stick imo. Crazy to think we have both of them (hopefully long term)
 

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