Minnesota Wild General Discussion XIII

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BigT2002

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But Guerin didn't sign those....

But its pretty obvious in my mind that Guerin is trying to create cap space and potentially having contracts they can flip at the TDL for picks. I think Staal would've been hard to flip since he puts playoff teams on his NTC. While MOJO will be able to be moved.

Bonino is an analytic darling. He had a selke like season last year. Really like that pick up.

Guess it is the non-analytic in me coming out. I find those stats to be very misleading at times. As a fan, I'll give any player a shot so long as they want to be here and actually try. But players like Havlat and even Seto/Heater to an extent, have burned me in the past.
 
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TaLoN

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Guess it is the non-analytic in me coming out. I find those stats to be very misleading at times. As a fan, I'll give any player a shot so long as they want to be here and actually try. But players like Havlat and even Seto/Heater to an extent, have burned me in the past.
Analytics have their place when used correctly, but just like any stat, they can be used to say just about anything about anyone if taken out of context.
 
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HotDish

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Guess it is the non-analytic in me coming out. I find those stats to be very misleading at times. As a fan, I'll give any player a shot so long as they want to be here and actually try. But players like Havlat and even Seto/Heater to an extent, have burned me in the past.
You are definitely right that sometimes analytic darlings are not the best with the eye test. Hockey isn't like baseball where the underlining numbers can tell more of the story then when they can't.

For instance Soucy isn't the best when you at his advance stats, but I think many fans would say they were happy to keep him vs losing him. You got to weigh both when taking in account of the player's impact. I don't think anyone in the league could build a stanley cup winner just using analytics while I think there is a chance if you just used the eye test.

I think Bonino will surprise people, if you had to ask me what your hot take for next season is, I think Bonino might be our 1C to start off the season. For what is worth I think Bonino > Kunin. The only thing Kunin has is age, which who knows maybe Kunin will be a better player in his later years, but for right now the team is better with Bones.
 
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HotDish

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Philly only had 3 draft picks this year so I'll let that speak for itself.
@guitarhunterdude
What year are you talking about because they had 7 at the beginning of the 2020 draft but used some picks to move up ending with 5 draft picks in the 2020 draft.

In the 2021 draft they currently have 6 picks.
 

BigT2002

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You are definitely right that sometimes analytic darlings are not the best with the eye test. Hockey isn't like baseball where the underlining numbers can tell more of the story then when they can't.

For instance Soucy isn't the best when you at his advance stats, but I think many fans would say they were happy to keep him vs losing him. You got to weigh both when taking in account of the player's impact. I don't think anyone in the league could build a stanley cup winner just using analytics while I think there is a chance if you just used the eye test.

I think Bonino will surprise people, if you had to ask me what your hot take for next season is, I think Bonino might be our 1C to start off the season. For what is worth I think Bonino > Kunin. The only thing Kunin has is age, which who knows maybe Kunin will be a better player in his later years, but for right now the team is better with Bones.

Absolutely hope you're right!
 

HotDish

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I haven't finished the pod, but Buff's agent is on the recent talk north. They talked the possibility about him joining the Wild. Hankinson says it is a longshot, but there was a bit of interest from Buff(Don't get your hopes up). Of course I bet a lot of it comes from Hankinson getting a share of that contract money. Sounds like Guerin, Buff, and him met as recently as last month though face to face. Some other talk about some Minnesota guys like Bjugstad too.

The Russo Hockey Show
 

Yeolo

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What a weird signing that would be. Wild are stacked on defense with even Dumba being expendable.

Really goes against my train of though of why they traded off Staal.

I figured we got rid of Staal because we didn't want a player that wouldn't be here in 1-2 years padding our wins and screwing up our draft capital.

So at the same time we were trying to bring Buff in?

Just weird.
 
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HotDish

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What a weird signing that would be. Wild are stacked on defense with even Dumba being expendable.

Really goes against my train of though of why they traded off Staal.

I figured we got rid of Staal because we didn't want a player that wouldn't be here in 1-2 years padding our wins and screwing up our draft capital.

So at the same time we were trying to bring Buff in?

Just weird.
I don't think the Wild are planning on tanking/rebuilding. I think their goal is the playoffs.
 

Al Lagoon

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I still think BG has the train on the right tracks - the Wild he inherited was so damn top heavy with old lumber. They are getting younger, and more talented.

You can't expect this team to shift overnight. However little by little, they'll start looking good in a couple of years.

He gets an A for getting draft picks instead of trading them.
 

Yeolo

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Stumble?

Wild are going to field their best team in years.

In theory yes, it very well could end up being like that.

If everyone else performs like they usually do.

Then...

Fiala continues his path to emergence, Kaprizov has a strong entry year like expected, and Rossi has a solid rookie campaign.

Those things alone which aren't unbelievable and may actually be likely then we've got a pretty good team.

One surprise happens like a Greenway finally emerging, or an Ek coming into his own with better quality playing time, Dumba finally putting it all together for an entire season, Parise returning to peak form, etc. (Not all of these things happening, but at least one of them happening in tandem with the above)

If it ends up being that kind of season then yeah very possibly.

Very interesting year we have ahead of us.

While I fully expect that the main core pieces are already here, I don't think deep playoff pushes happen for another season or two.

That said I feel like for 5 years at least we knew what kind of team we were going to have.

This year? It could go so many different ways.
 

57special

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Yeah, that first game where Allen stopped 50+ shots killed us. I think having Yeo on the other side gave them an advantage, also. That was a very strong Wild team, but we once again failed to show up in the playoffs.

I thought Hanzl was fine, and would do that trade again. Everyone would have been complaining if we went into the playoffs as the 2nd best team in the league and we didn't do something at the TDL. A very late first is a small price to pay for a team that is going for the Cup. It just didn't work out.
 
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saywut

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ah I'm going to disagree on this. 2016-17 was one of our best teams in years. I think they have a real shot of going far. However, I always felt like line chemistry was messed up with the Hanzal pickup and Allen was playing out of his mind in the playoffs.

All Hanzal did to the lines was let Haula stabilize the 4th line. The difference in goaltending was the biggest factor. Granlund and Coyle(Nino too? Can't remember) playing injured affected their games. Staal was invisible in the series while Hanzal was our best center. So no, that trade wasn't the problem.
 

HotDish

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All Hanzal did to the lines was let Haula stabilize the 4th line. The difference in goaltending was the biggest factor. Granlund and Coyle(Nino too? Can't remember) playing injured affected their games. Staal was invisible in the series while Hanzal was our best center. So no, that trade wasn't the problem.
I’d argue the Haula moving to the 4th was the big issue. He was doing just fine on the 3rd line. Plus as we saw when he went to Vegas that he probably was a lot more deserving of a higher role than 4th line. There were some other issues it apparently brought out too, but at this point to but at this point no use trying to filter out what was truth and what was speculation.

Plus going back to the playoff let down that year. You can make an equally compelling argument that it wasn’t that Allen was so hot, but more that the Wild really didn’t have many quality shots. Allen and St. Louis really didn’t have to work hard. You could chalk it up as the Wild being out coached or the Wild just not executing good hockey.
 

2Pair

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I’d argue the Haula moving to the 4th was the big issue. He was doing just fine on the 3rd line. Plus as we saw when he went to Vegas that he probably was a lot more deserving of a higher role than 4th line. There were some other issues it apparently brought out too, but at this point to but at this point no use trying to filter out what was truth and what was speculation.

Plus going back to the playoff let down that year. You can make an equally compelling argument that it wasn’t that Allen was so hot, but more that the Wild really didn’t have many quality shots. Allen and St. Louis really didn’t have to work hard. You could chalk it up as the Wild being out coached or the Wild just not executing good hockey.
Haula was trash for the Wild. It also isn't too hard to speculate on his character when every team he has played on, dumps him the 1st chance that they get.
 

Yeolo

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I’d argue the Haula moving to the 4th was the big issue. He was doing just fine on the 3rd line. Plus as we saw when he went to Vegas that he probably was a lot more deserving of a higher role than 4th line. There were some other issues it apparently brought out too, but at this point to but at this point no use trying to filter out what was truth and what was speculation.

Plus going back to the playoff let down that year. You can make an equally compelling argument that it wasn’t that Allen was so hot, but more that the Wild really didn’t have many quality shots. Allen and St. Louis really didn’t have to work hard. You could chalk it up as the Wild being out coached or the Wild just not executing good hockey.

I still hold the view that the Wild's expansion draft blunder was one of the largest reason's for the Golden knights success and the Wild were one of if not the biggest loser that fateful night.

I also think Chuck Fletcher MIGHT still be our GM if not for that massive, massive failure.

Our number one prospect for a long time a young 6'4 power forward and a young speedster center who was able to shut other players down on defense when need be so, while also scoring.

How much did that night set us back?

Tuch would be on our first line and Haula I'm not sure where he would sit but that's a player that can play both an offensive and defensive role well.

My only consolation to that is it allowed us to lose enough to draft a Rossi and a Boldy.

Let's pray Boldy is at least as good as Tuch and Rossi is way better than Haula.
 

2Pair

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I still hold the view that the Wild's expansion draft blunder was one of the largest reason's for the Golden knights success and the Wild were one of if not the biggest loser that fateful night.

I also think Chuck Fletcher MIGHT still be our GM if not for that massive, massive failure.

Our number one prospect for a long time a young 6'4 power forward and a young speedster center who was able to shut other players down on defense when need be so, while also scoring.

How much did that night set us back?

Tuch would be on our first line and Haula I'm not sure where he would sit but that's a player that can play both an offensive and defensive role well.

My only consolation to that is it allowed us to lose enough to draft a Rossi and a Boldy.

Let's pray Boldy is at least as good as Tuch and Rossi is way better than Haula.
There was no expansion draft blunder from fletcher. FIO
 

HotDish

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Haula was trash for the Wild. It also isn't too hard to speculate on his character when every team he has played on, dumps him the 1st chance that they get.
Yeah I think his rumored persona and injury concerns now a days are completely valid to move on from him then and shy away from him today. I would disagree that he was essentially trash for the Wild though. I think he just suffered from a logjam of players. In a similar vein as Donato. Was Haula trash because he was a bad player or trash because he had to play a smaller role? I would argue the latter.

saying that it would be hard to justify sitting anyone to give him a bigger role. I don’t recall during that time people calling for Haula to get a top 6 spot or anything. That’s just hockey though. Sometimes teams don’t know what you have until given a chance.

my post was all 20/20 hindsight. I agree that at the time the trade seemed great, just more so due to unforeseen issues I believe the trade ended up hurting team. Plus it was already known that Haula wasn’t going to be resigned due to cap issues so it was smart to move him at the ED.
 

2Pair

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Yeah I think his rumored persona and injury concerns now a days are completely valid to move on from him then and shy away from him today. I would disagree that he was essentially trash for the Wild though. I think he just suffered from a logjam of players. In a similar vein as Donato. Was Haula trash because he was a bad player or trash because he had to play a smaller role? I would argue the latter.

saying that it would be hard to justify sitting anyone to give him a bigger role. I don’t recall during that time people calling for Haula to get a top 6 spot or anything. That’s just hockey though. Sometimes teams don’t know what you have until given a chance.

my post was all 20/20 hindsight. I agree that at the time the trade seemed great, just more so due to unforeseen issues I believe the trade ended up hurting team. Plus it was already known that Haula wasn’t going to be resigned due to cap issues so it was smart to move him at the ED.
The Wild had eight 50 point players and Haula in their top 9. Haula had 26 points. That isn't good. Haula was given multiple chances to take the 3rd line center spot, he failed every time.
 

HotDish

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The Wild had eight 50 point players and Haula in their top 9. Haula had 26 points. That isn't good. Haula was given multiple chances to take the 3rd line center spot, he failed every time.
Eh I think he fine in his last season with the Wild. However I agree at the time there certainly wasn’t anyone he deserved to take their role from.
 
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