Player Discussion Mikko Koivu (Part II)

[Dr Jan Itor]

Risbrough left this team is disarray, it took a while to turn around and then we had to go through Chicago.

how many times did we lose a series to the eventual champion or conference finalist ? Almost every year ? That’s not on Koivu, gotta start it somewhere and he’s fitting for it. I think 1000 games, longest tenured captain, holds a few franchise records. He’s earned it.

3 out of 9 times.

 

[NHL1674]

A big F#$@ YOU to Covid (for obvious reasons), but for also stealing the chance to have a proper send-off for Koivu and the fans. I wanted that final game at the Xcel.

 

[Webster]

A big F#$@ YOU to Covid (for obvious reasons), but for also stealing the chance to have a proper send-off for Koivu and the fans. I wanted that final game at the Xcel.

I'm sure when the covid crap is gone and the fans are back at the X they will invite Koivu and his family back for a ceremony that includes #9 being retired. He's been here for a friggin 19 years.

 

[NHL1674]

I'm sure when the covid crap is gone and the fans are back at the X they will invite Koivu and his family back for a ceremony that includes #9 being retired. He's been here for a friggin 19 years.

I'm sure they'll have a ceremony, but that's very different from seeing him play that final home game. Not even close.

 

[mezcal]

Koivu has been a hallmark on this team for some time, and you can’t blame the Wilds rocky past solely on him. He has been a great leader and holds so many franchise records, has been the most loyal player this franchise will probably ever have. If you can’t recall the sh*t show this teams front office has been for I don’t know, since it’s inception, then I don’t know what to say.

Koivu should have his number retired at the very least, deserved to have a cup under his belt. I feel bad this teams management let him and others down so consistently. Always complacent, barely aggressive in the off season. What’s the last time we were aggressive in the off season, Parise and Suter??

 

[Victorious Secret]

Koivu deserved to have a cup under his belt.

Cups are earned, not given out.

 

[TaLoN]

Cups are earned, not given out.

Cups are earned by great teams. Individual players can't drag bad teams to winning cups.

 

[mezcal]

Cups are earned, not given out.

This team has never come close to “earning” anything but a golfing session since 2004

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Retired at the very least? What would be more than that?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I get that it’s not his fault that there are no Cups, but sometimes circumstances just aren’t fair.

 

[Aftershave]

I personally hope they retire his jersey. The way I see it it’s not about the numbers, points and championships won. To me it’s really the contrary actually. Retiring a number is what you do to commemorate players who brought something else than just measurable statistics to a franchise imo. Sure Mikko didn’t bring a cup and doesn’t have a long series of personal awards and league trophies. But it’s definitely not about that. It’s about people you don’t want to forget as a franchise. And I know some on this board will say they actually want the franchise to forget the “Mikko era”. I get that, but personally I think they’re wrong.
If a franchise doesn’t retire the jersey of its first full-time captain who wore the C for so many consecutive years and is the first to have played 1000 games for the franchise, who do they retire?
In my view (and this is really personal I know) Mikko and his older brother were part of the reason I loved hockey in the first place. I first saw Mikko as the “little brother” and not as the wild’s captain. I always saw him as the guy who managed to step out of Saku’s shadow and to create his own “legacy” (or at least his own story). He’s the kind of guy that I always found reassuring on the ice. The guy you can trust. And that’s not something that translates into numbers. Add to that the fact that fans really loved him for so many years, I think it meets the conditions to retire a jersey.
But that’s just my opinion... so long Mikko! Best of luck for the things to come.

 

[mezcal]

Retired at the very least? What would be more than that?

A gold star.

I really didn’t meant to include that, but I think they should just retire his number. It has nothing to do with championships and numbers but everything he brought to the team and fans over the years.

Lots of people hate Koivu and will disagree, but he brought a lot to the team and was the staple since this franchise was installed. Simple as that.

 

[mezcal]

Cups are earned, not given out.

Exactly, this team has never earned one or deserved to earn one. Let me rephrase “Wish the guy could have won a cup in his career”

MAN, you guys are itching to argue these days.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

A gold star.

I really didn’t meant to include that, but I think they should just retire his number. It has nothing to do with championships and numbers but everything he brought to the team and fans over the years.

Lots of people hate Koivu and will disagree, but he brought a lot to the team and was the staple since this franchise was installed. Simple as that.

I like Koivu a lot and I disagree.

 

[Hall of Faber]

I have been in the camp of no #9 retirement. He lead this team to a 15-35ish playoff record. I don’t accept he was the face of the franchise for 15 years argument. I’m not going to accept 15 years of failure and embarrassment. We Minnesota fans need higher expectations.

 

[DaJackal]

I don't get this "he didn't win us one single cup" thing.

A retired number is an individual "award" to the player.
Stanley cup is a team award to the whole team. There is no single player that can carry a team to winning a cup by his own - no matter how great he is. (See Edmonton.)

For those who think that retiring a number of a player who was the face of the franchise for 15 years, a captain over 10 seasons and played his whole career (1000+ games) in the same team is "setting the bar too low" could ask themselves a question: are this kind of players common in the league? Name me even 1 player who has been their teams franchise 1C or 1D for a decade and played 1000+ games for them (let alone only for them) and not gotten their number retired. There might be some, but I don't think that list will be long. Saku Koivu comes close, but he played like 800 games or so with Montreal and spent the last 5 seasons in a Ducks uniform. Even though that his name is often in discussions whether Montreal should retire his number (which they won't do and I think it's the right decision, btw).

There are some organizations that have retired numbers of some average or even marginal players who have happened to die tragically during their active years. IMO this isn't a good decision criteria either.

And if I'm honest, I think the organization already set the bar so low by retiring #1 for "Wild fans" that it can only go up from there.

 

[traffic cone]

I think if he was Canadian or American (like Parise) and had the career like that there would be no people speaking against his number's retirement. Just funny.

His number will be retired. Don't worry about it. Nothing you can do against it or to change it. And it will be a great moment for him and even greater for the Minnesota Wild organization.

 

[57special]

If he was a local guy from, say Elk River, you might have a pojnt. Otherwise, I don't see it. No one on here has anything against Finns, and there are some that would prefer them to Canadians.
Seems like you are inventing an issue where there isn't one.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I think if he was Canadian or American (like Parise) and had the career like that there would be no people speaking against his number's retirement. Just funny.

His number will be retired. Don't worry about it. Nothing you can do against it or to change it. And it will be a great moment for him and even greater for the Minnesota Wild organization.

You're full of shit.

 

[BagHead]

I think if he was Canadian or American (like Parise) and had the career like that there would be no people speaking against his number's retirement. Just funny.

His number will be retired. Don't worry about it. Nothing you can do against it or to change it. And it will be a great moment for him and even greater for the Minnesota Wild organization.

Actually, it's more that he didn't win any individual awards or team awards. I think most around here quite like the Finns.

 

[Wasted Talent]

I don't get this "he didn't win us one single cup" thing.

A retired number is an individual "award" to the player.
Stanley cup is a team award to the whole team. There is no single player that can carry a team to winning a cup by his own - no matter how great he is. (See Edmonton.)

For those who think that retiring a number of a player who was the face of the franchise for 15 years, a captain over 10 seasons and played his whole career (1000+ games) in the same team is "setting the bar too low" could ask themselves a question: are this kind of players common in the league? Name me even 1 player who has been their teams franchise 1C or 1D for a decade and played 1000+ games for them (let alone only for them) and not gotten their number retired. There might be some, but I don't think that list will be long. Saku Koivu comes close, but he played like 800 games or so with Montreal and spent the last 5 seasons in a Ducks uniform. Even though that his name is often in discussions whether Montreal should retire his number (which they won't do and I think it's the right decision, btw).

There are some organizations that have retired numbers of some average or even marginal players who have happened to die tragically during their active years. IMO this isn't a good decision criteria either.

And if I'm honest, I think the organization already set the bar so low by retiring #1 for "Wild fans" that it can only go up from there.

This more or less summarizes what I used to think.

Then I looked at the jerseys retired in the past 10-20 years and honestly there aren't that many comparables to Koivu's career in there. The two closest comparables would be Elias and Doan. But their cases are much stronger; Elias has 1000 points and multiple cups. Doan has 500 more games than Koivu.

I'm now leaning towards honoring him some other way, like inducting him into Wild's own Hall of Fame for example.

 

[traffic cone]

You're full of shit.

Nice post.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Nice post.

It's all that's really required.

 

[TaLoN]

This more or less summarizes what I used to think.

Then I looked at the jerseys retired in the past 10-20 years and honestly there aren't that many comparables to Koivu's career in there. The two closest comparables would be Elias and Doan. But their cases are much stronger; Elias has 1000 points and multiple cups. Doan has 500 more games than Koivu.

I'm now leaning towards honoring him some other way, like inducting him into Wild's own Hall of Fame for example.

That's the point. It's rare that a player of that level reaches such a connection with a franchise. This isn't some ultra common situation. Linden, Broten, Doan are all equivalent with Koivu and all have retired numbers. It doesn't lessen the standard.

 

[traffic cone]

That's the point. It's rare that a player of that level reaches such a connection with a franchise. This isn't some ultra common situation. Linden, Broten, Doan are all equivalent with Koivu and all have retired numbers. It doesn't lessen the standard.

Or are they? Look closely. Some differences.