#Melnykout/The Melnyk problem

Sensung

Registered User
Oct 3, 2017
6,101
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So if the Ottawa Senators Players are entitled to 50% of the HRR generated by them playing for the Senators Franchise, owned by EM, who is entitled to the other 50% ... how do not abandon the players, when you boycott the owner, by emptying the arena as you suggest?

Can you ask to only pay for the 50% of the ticket/Beer/Burger/parking that the players receive?
The players will get every penny of their guaranteed contracts.

Boycotting the Sens games makes Melnyk feel the pain he promised was coming....
 

YouGotAStuGoing

Registered User
Mar 26, 2010
19,339
4,913
Ottawa, Ontario
There is actually a more direct link too, gates go down, HRR for league as a whole suffers, and less Escrow is returned to the players league wide. Our poor gates affects the salaries of every player in the NHL in that regard.
Good point. And surely both the NHL and the PA won't like that one loose screw is ruining it for everyone, right?
 

Micklebot

Moderator
Apr 27, 2010
53,145
30,369
Good point. And surely both the NHL and the PA won't like that one loose screw is ruining it for everyone, right?

I suppose, but it's a bit of a drop in the bucket. What would the Board of Governors be more concerned about; a rogue owner that is costing everyone money, or a fanbase that tries to out one their own?

I think the saving grace is if the other owners think Melnyk's issues are more related to mismanagement, relocation won't be viewed as a solution, as the same problems will persist.
 

Peptic Balcers

Registered User
May 1, 2010
1,586
1,283
Ottawa, Canada
I'm pretty sure that Melnyk can't sell the team to someone who wants to move the team, just because he wants to and there's a buyer (if there was one). And I don't think he can just pick up and move the team either. I think it has to do with the NHL approving the market. Otherwise Jim Balsillie would have moved either Nashville or Arizona to Hamilton.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I forget the exact rule.
 

Micklebot

Moderator
Apr 27, 2010
53,145
30,369
I'm pretty sure that Melnyk can't sell the team to someone who wants to move the team, just because he wants to and there's a buyer (if there was one). And I don't think he can just pick up and move the team either. I think it has to do with the NHL approving the market. Otherwise Jim Balsillie would have moved either Nashville or Arizona to Hamilton.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I forget the exact rule.

If I remember correctly BOG needs to approve any change in ownership or any stake over 5%, and can set the price on relocation fee for a franchise. They likely have to approve the market too, but in effect they could just set the fee prohibitively high, and the only recourse would be taking them to court.
 

branch

#GirlBoss #Vibes
Jan 12, 2008
8,837
7,233
Dave Lozo is such a clown. Stupid looking man with a stupid face. He's been an anti-Ottawa guy for years. Just hates the team.
 
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Bileur

Registered User
Jun 15, 2004
18,475
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Ottawa
Even aside from the fact that Ottawa is a market that can and does work when he owner isn’t a lunatic; moving the team makes no sense.

Honestly, if you were a hockey fan in Québec or Seattle or Houston pining for a local NHL team would you even want the team if it means Melnyk is your owner? I think not. This is likely Quebec’s last kick at the can, they can’t afford for it to be a shot show. Do you really want an owner who is likely blackballed by a number of players, agents and hockey professionals? Do you really want an owner who is in it for the $ and who won’t be a « cap team »? Of course not, you would want a different owner who actually gives you a shot at winning.

For that matter I can’t imagine the NHL risking not only expansion fees but the potential launch of successful franchises in Houston or Seattle by letting Melnyk move there. Bettman already takes enough heat for expansions in the states, he can’t afford failures with out of control owners.

Melnyk moving the team is just not something that will be allowed to happen.
 

Zorf

Apparently I'm entitled?
Jan 4, 2008
4,946
1,566
Based on what I recall about Atlanta moving to Winnipeg, the only reason it happened was because the NHL and Atlanta ownership had thoroughly exhausted any and all possibilities of keeping the team in Atlanta. Once it was accepted that there were no potential owners who were able to keep the team in Atlanta, that's when the NHL allowed ownership bids that included relocation to jump in.

Plus, if Eugene wants to relocate, what's he going to do? Relocate to a city that already has a rink? So basically Quebec? But, he won't be the owner of the rink, so that's a pain for him to pay rent, not own the rink, and then no be able to split the income so he can cry poor.

That makes the other option being that he'd have to negotiate with the new city and state/province to build a new arena in the new city. If he's lucky they'd cover what, 50% of the cost? So he'd need to come up with roughly $250M in cash for the new rink and I would guess $75M for the relocation fee. Add that $325M to his already burdensome debt of around $150M, and you've got a guy who's now broke as a joke. Plus, cities and provinces/states never just give up the money. It's always tied to some sort of repayment plan, either by special tax, or the team pays back a certain amount over a 20 year span. So that could also potentially eat into his profits.


Good luck getting approval from the NHL for all of that.


I guess he could sell CTC and surrounding land, but I don't think that would cover his costs.

It's not happening while he's the owner of this team.
 

Gil Gunderson

Registered User
May 2, 2007
30,545
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Ottawa, ON
Based on what I recall about Atlanta moving to Winnipeg, the only reason it happened was because the NHL and Atlanta ownership had thoroughly exhausted any and all possibilities of keeping the team in Atlanta. Once it was accepted that there were no potential owners who were able to keep the team in Atlanta, that's when the NHL allowed ownership bids that included relocation to jump in.

Plus, if Eugene wants to relocate, what's he going to do? Relocate to a city that already has a rink? So basically Quebec? But, he won't be the owner of the rink, so that's a pain for him to pay rent, not own the rink, and then no be able to split the income so he can cry poor.

That makes the other option being that he'd have to negotiate with the new city and state/province to build a new arena in the new city. If he's lucky they'd cover what, 50% of the cost? So he'd need to come up with roughly $250M in cash for the new rink and I would guess $75M for the relocation fee. Add that $325M to his already burdensome debt of around $150M, and you've got a guy who's now broke as a joke. Plus, cities and provinces/states never just give up the money. It's always tied to some sort of repayment plan, either by special tax, or the team pays back a certain amount over a 20 year span. So that could also potentially eat into his profits.


Good luck getting approval from the NHL for all of that.


I guess he could sell CTC and surrounding land, but I don't think that would cover his costs.

It's not happening while he's the owner of this team.
Plus, the relocation fee was that low for Atlanta because they need to get out of there.

Pheonix's fee was set at $195 million 9 years ago. With the increase in league value, I could see it being around $300 million now.
 
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PeterSidorkiewicz

HFWF Tourney Undisputed Champion
Apr 30, 2004
32,442
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Lansing, MI

The guy didn’t make any arguments in the article for moving the team though. That was like, a really really bad article. Then again I cannot stand most sports journalism, but that was really bad IMO.

Can I also say that Travis Yost might be the biggest hack in sports journalism I’ve ever come across? That guy sucks horribly at his job, but congrats I guess on being able to carve out a career at something you’re terrible at? Yeesh.
 
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Sensung

Registered User
Oct 3, 2017
6,101
3,357
The haters are frothing at the mouth and jumping of the top of the "pile on the Sens" mound.

Just sit back and laugh.
 

Take a Bath Son

Registered User
Jan 15, 2018
217
233
I think people are really not reading the article thoroughly. The author is advocating sale to someone who will keep it in Ottawa

“There's only one way Senators fans can have their faith restored.
Melnyk has to sell, and he has to sell to someone that will keep the team in Ottawa”

This is a fact. He is only adding that if Melnyk refuses to sell he’ll have to leave town because he’s toast in Ottawa.

This article, while by no means in depth is really saying the same thin Duthie said yesterday.
 

PeterSidorkiewicz

HFWF Tourney Undisputed Champion
Apr 30, 2004
32,442
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Lansing, MI
I think people are really not reading the article thoroughly. The author is advocating sale to someone who will keep it in Ottawa

“There's only one way Senators fans can have their faith restored.
Melnyk has to sell, and he has to sell to someone that will keep the team in Ottawa”

This is a fact. He is only adding that if Melnyk refuses to sell he’ll have to leave town because he’s toast in Ottawa.

This article, while by no means in depth is really saying the same thin Duthie said yesterday.

Oh I got it and read it thoroughly, I just thought it was something that was churned out in like, 15 minutes? I just thought it was bad.
 

NorthCoast

Registered User
May 1, 2017
1,250
1,167
Leeder droppin truth bombs.



Bingo. Plus the posts above on Relo costs.

Plus the stadium costs.

Plus the rebranding and new marketing costs to build a new fanbase.

Plus new city doesn't have a 40 mil per year tv deal and won't for a long-time.

And add that the new city stadium would have to be attached to a multi-billion land deal so that the financial opportunity would be the same as ottawa---because if you are spending as much as Lebreton cost, wouldn't you want the same potential return.


Find me the city that can overcome the above, besides the fact that the NHL is not moving profitable teams (which the sens are minus Melnyk's debt) out of Canadian cities.

Either Melnyk can afford Lebreton or he will sell to someone who can. Period.

- Stays in kanata - Loses money he doesn't have
- Relocates, NHL won't approve and costs same as Lebreton

Only other option is to sell and if you don't think that their are wealthy business entities (Desmarais, Ruddy, Greenbergs, etc) that will purchase a profitable sports team tied to a multi-billion dollar land deal with significant money to be made then I would be curious to hear your reasoning.
 

Erik Alfredsson

Beast Mode Cowboy!
Jan 14, 2012
13,034
5,037
I want to make myself clear, I am in full support of voicing displeasure to Melnyk. The way this organization has run in the past year is a complete joke and unacceptable. I would love it if everyone were to boycott ticket sales, because we shouldn't stand for this. However, it needs to be backed up by a display that shows that we support the team, just not Melnyk. Maybe a protest outside of the CTC during the home opener? Imagine if nobody bought tickets to the game but you had 18,000 people standing in front of the building showing Sens support.
 

Qward

Because! That's why!
Jul 23, 2010
18,930
5,897
Behind you, look out
Bingo. Plus the posts above on Relo costs.

Plus the stadium costs. Quebec has an arena already built

Plus the rebranding and new marketing costs to build a new fanbase. Nordiques still have a brand and fan base.

Plus new city doesn't have a 40 mil per year tv deal and won't for a long-time. Quebecor is the largest media company in Quebec.

And add that the new city stadium would have to be attached to a multi-billion land deal so that the financial opportunity would be the same as ottawa---because if you are spending as much as Lebreton cost, wouldn't you want the same potential return. Quebec City has already made their deal and is place for years to come.


Find me the city that can overcome the above, Done. besides the fact that the NHL is not moving profitable teams (which the sens are minus Melnyk's debt) out of Canadian cities. Melnyks debt is Ottawas debt. Miss payroll is Ottawas problem.

Either Melnyk can afford Lebreton He cannot. or he will sell to someone who can. Period. Let's hope so.

- Stays in kanata - Loses money he doesn't have
- Relocates, NHL won't approve and costs same as Lebreton

Only other option is to sell and if you don't think that their are wealthy business entities (Desmarais, Ruddy, Greenbergs, etc) that will purchase a profitable sports team tied to a multi-billion dollar land deal with significant money to be made then I would be curious to hear your reasoning. Melnyk is a stubborn as a mule and would cut off his nose to spite his face.

My points in red
 

Micklebot

Moderator
Apr 27, 2010
53,145
30,369
My points in red
I think the league would see a move to Quebec as lateral at best in terms of market viability, and be highly skeptical of Melnyk's ability to find success there given what's going on here, and that's before you add in a relocation fee that would undoubtedly exceed 200 mil if there's a chance of keeping the team in Ottawa under new ownership given what the set as a relocation fee for Phoenix.

Also, Melnyk would have to either purchase the already built arena, or rent it and sacrifice the ancillary revenue streams. Again, not ideal, though he could sell his arena and land here to help offset that.
 

Sensung

Registered User
Oct 3, 2017
6,101
3,357
I want to make myself clear, I am in full support of voicing displeasure to Melnyk. The way this organization has run in the past year is a complete joke and unacceptable. I would love it if everyone were to boycott ticket sales, because we shouldn't stand for this. However, it needs to be backed up by a display that shows that we support the team, just not Melnyk. Maybe a protest outside of the CTC during the home opener? Imagine if nobody bought tickets to the game but you had 18,000 people standing in front of the building showing Sens support.
Of course, the boycott needs to be planned and executed in a manner that makes it clear the fans support the Sens, but want #Melnykout.
 

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