McKeen's Final Ranking, Top 15

[borro]

Being the son of Bill "Minus 82" Mikkelson is a good thing?

Apparently it is for him, seeing as how he is rated as a first round pick. I remember Bill Mikkelson with the Caps. He was a marginal winger on a team despearte for players.

 

[pei fan]

One scout I talk to often said it to me like this one time:

"I don't even look at Central's list. I don't get Redline or McKewan's, or whatever. I only know of ISS because you told me about it. The (NHL team name) doesn't pay me to base my opinions by reading everyone else's list; they pay me for my list."

Draft lists are like snowflakes; no two are ever identical.

Good post.A scout almost has to have that attitude or he will be too
influenced by opinions around him.Teams also look at players based on
their needs and also on special characteristics they see in a player and
how he might fit in with the present team.

 

[Fozz]

Good post.A scout almost has to have that attitude or he will be too
influenced by opinions around him.Teams also look at players based on
their needs and also on special characteristics they see in a player and
how he might fit in with the present team.

Consider these lists as what and NHL team's list might look like. Almost as if McKeen's, Red Line and ISS were the 31st, 32nd and 33rd team in the NHL. Their rankings differ and so do all 30 NHL teams' rankings and that's obvious but at least, it gives us an idea of what players are out there.

 

[Hobey Baker]

Let's not forget that teams get to talk to these kids at some point to gauge their attitude, get an idea of their level of intelligence and coachability, etc. This has much to do with how their lists get slotted. Buffalo could have Johnson on their list at #2, talk to the kid and decide that he's a impossible punk, and move him down accordingly. I'm not so sure these guru sites have the same luxury. They formulate the lists on mostly on ability/potential alone. I don't understand how there's such an uproar when these rankings come out anyways, but I'm sure the services eat it up!

 

[Anthony Mauro]

Well I can tell you without hesitation that NHL scouts'/teams lists will vary AT LEAST by this much on their rankings. I once worked for an NHL team and I can tell you that some of our final rankings would have shocked posters on this board.
I would bet my first and second born that some team has Brule or Ryan in the 20's or Juraj Mikus as a top 8 pick. Happens all the time.

They are pro scouts yeah- but that hardly means consensus.

Where would we be without knowledgable people?

The Rangers had Lauri Korpikoski ranked 6th on their lists, when HF'ers had him from 15-40 it seemed.

 

[Cole Caulifield]

Bourret is way too high. Crappy rankings.

 

[MikeC]

Bourret is way too high. Crappy rankings.

how many times did you see Bourret play to say this?????

If the answer is none how can you judge him??????

So read on him and talk after then people will give you credit for what you say

 

[rt]

Draft lists are like snowflakes...

That's just beautiful. You, my friend, are a true poet.

 

[FearTheFlyers]

7. Benoit Pouliot

Where he should be.

 

[BobMarleyNYR]

This is by far the dumbest argument I've ever seen on this board.

 

[Seachd]

Completely off-topic, but apparently Ryan O'Marra was born in Tokyo. I didn't know that.

Useless? Yes, but give me time. I can do worse.

 

[Anthony Mauro]

7. Benoit Pouliot

Where he should be.

According to you and one publication.

 

[ZombieMatt]

With every list, professional publication or a poster's thoughts, it is always the same old comments.

"Player X - read, the complaining poster's preferred prospect - will NOT fall out of the top ten.

"Team Y will NOT pass on Jimmy George if he's available at 15."

Etc, etc, etc.

When will people stop making ridiculous definite claims about where a player will be picked or what team will absolutely choose a player? Every year we hear about how one flavour of the week absolutely, definitively, will not fall out of the top ten, or fifteen, or twenty, and every year at least one of them does. And yet nobody pays attention to this and the same thing happens every year.

 

[Anthony Mauro]

With every list, professional publication or a poster's thoughts, it is always the same old comments.

"Player X - read, the complaining poster's preferred prospect - will NOT fall out of the top ten.

"Team Y will NOT pass on Jimmy George if he's available at 15."

Etc, etc, etc.

When will people stop making ridiculous definite claims about where a player will be picked or what team will absolutely choose a player? Every year we hear about how one flavour of the week absolutely, definitively, will not fall out of the top ten, or fifteen, or twenty, and every year at least one of them does. And yet nobody pays attention to this and the same thing happens every year.

Never, and it gets pretty tiresome after awhile.

 

[Hobey Baker]

I'll try to sum it up simply like this:

Draft lists are kind of like ranking the hottest chicks in your school......everyone sees them differently. Scouting bureaus, NHL teams, and posters here at HF are no different.

 

[turnbuckle*]

Bloodlines? Mikkelson is Bill Mikkelson's son. He is a big guy and plays reasonably aggressive. I have no idea why the mercurial rise, but often such players max out their potential. I would not pick him over Staal.

Mikkelson's bloodlines produced the worst plus-minus in NHL history (when he was with the Caps), while Staal's bloodlines have produced older brother Eric and two other future NHL brothers. I'll go with the Staals, but I like Brendan from what I saw at the Under 18s.


It's safe to say that he helped his ranking with his play at the Under 18s, especially when it comes to rushing the puck - the kid has wheels.
Always funny to see the goalie rankings - they're the toughest to gauge. Red Line has Levasseur in the top ten, THN and others have Price in the top ten and McKeen's has Rask in the top ten.


The odds of all three being top ten picks are slim to say the least - which team would pass on Staal or Ryan over Rask? The obvious teams that had goalie prospect questions (St. Louis, LA, Carolina) adressed them in the past year. Florida would be one of the few teams willing to draft a goalie early IMO, and even then it would have to be a later pick in the top ten

I'm guessing that a goalie may not be taken until the teens. Most teams are looking for forward and defenceman needs - and are willing to take chances on goalies in later rounds or in free agency. That philosophy has landed the Habs Roy, Theo, Garon, Danis, Vokoun, and others through the years, I'm not expecting them, among other teams, swaying from that philosophy unless they end up with the 20th pick and Price is rated 5th overall on their list. I somehow doubt that scenario.

IMO these are the seven players that will definitely go in the top ten.

Crosby
Ryan
Johnson
Kopitar
Pouliot
Staal
Brule

Five forwards, two defencemen. Other candidates for the top ten? Skille, Bourdon, Hanzal, Bourret, O'Marra, Zagrapan, Price.......this is a tough year to predict, but those 14 appear to be consensus top 20 picks at least.

 

[BobMarleyNYR]

These disputes make me think sometimes that these such boards are nothing more than a rat-race for high esteem and looking the most intelligent.

 

[RussianProspects]

I am really glad the McKeen's rankings started such a discussion.

My two cents regarding the rankings put out by the various services, they are, as Kirk puts it, different perspectives put together for the fans. Obviously the rankings are aimed at the NHL clubs, but we, the publishers of the rankings, all understand that they are primarily read by the fans.

I am sure RussianProspects rankings off the top Russians may vary from rankings put out by other services. I am sure those who read the RP rankings and those of CSB can see how vastly different they are on certain players. There is certain information that one source may know that another one may not, and finally, all rankings are, afterall based on opinions of people.

Sadly, there may be only one Russian drafted in the first round if that, so there is not much else I can contribute to the top 15 discussion, but maybe next year, though 89 looks stronger. There are quite a few interesting prospects who will likely be picked up in the second or third round.

 

[NYR469]

bourret is too high...its virtually splitting hairs between johnson, brule, kopitar, ryan and pouliot imo so i have no problem with pouliot dropping below those guys but there is absolutely no reason why any of those guys should be outside the top 6. those 5 and crosby are the top 6 players, its just a question of what order 2-6 fall.

 

[NYR469]

Completely off-topic, but apparently Ryan O'Marra was born in Tokyo. I didn't know that.

Useless? Yes, but give me time. I can do worse.

thats an interesting little tidbit. where did you see that?? erie's site lists him as from Mississauga but i guess that is just his hometown.

do you know if he is of japanese descent at all??

 

[NYR469]

One scout I talk to often said it to me like this one time:

"I don't even look at Central's list. I don't get Redline or McKewan's, or whatever. I only know of ISS because you told me about it. The (NHL team name) doesn't pay me to base my opinions by reading everyone else's list; they pay me for my list."

Draft lists are like snowflakes; no two are ever identical.

and thats how it should be...the different draft guides are great for informing fans that can't travel around to see all the prospects live, but any scout or team that relies on them should be fired immediately. you don't pay a handful of scouts for them to read someone else's report.

 

[Seachd]

thats an interesting little tidbit. where did you see that?? erie's site lists him as from Mississauga but i guess that is just his hometown.

do you know if he is of japanese descent at all??

I don't know anything behind it, but CSS lists his birthplace as Tokyo.

They also list Adam Hobson as being born in Sweden.

 

[MattintheHatt]

Wow, highest I've ever seen Bourret...thats cool, that means teams want him, and I like Bourret.

 

[TeamPlayer]

I'll try to sum it up simply like this:

Draft lists are kind of like ranking the hottest chicks in your school......everyone sees them differently. Scouting bureaus, NHL teams, and posters here at HF are no different.

Yeah but it gets a little tricky, because the girls in school that "everybody" scored with, were in high demand but they usually ended up pregnant or with a disease and nobody wanted them after, but the players that score are priceless.

Where do we draw the line???

 

[Cole Caulifield]

how many times did you see Bourret play to say this?????

If the answer is none how can you judge him??????

So read on him and talk after then people will give you credit for what you say

I don't know about 10 times ? Is that enough for you ? Never seen him live though, but TV is good too. Besides, even if I had never seen him play, we're on a hockey message board and if I know people who've seen him play and told me things about him, if I've read scouting reports, then I can have an opinion too can't I ? But I usually abstain from talking about players I've never seen play.

I don't like Bourret's potential. I don't see him turning into a first line player at the NHL level where as players like Zagrapan and Latendresse have much more potential.

Bourret is a good safe bet to be a NHL player though. But if I'm going to pick in the top 10, I'm going to try to get someone with more potential than Bourret has.

He's not a bad player. I like his hockey sense, his playmaking abilities and grit but I don't like his top end potential. I don't think the overall package warrants a top 10 selection.

If you go by McKenzie's article his 15 rank is much more like it with Zagrapan ahead. And it's definately not out of the question that someone could take a flyer on a guy like Latendresse before anyone pick Bourret.

EDIT :

By the way, the reason I mention McKenzie's article about the top 30 prospects for the upcoming draft is because he actually goes out to ask real NHL scouts what they think of the players and that's how he rank them, 100% based on NHL scouts opinions. It's usually very reflective. So it's not like I'm alone thinking Bourret is too high on that list.

Now I could be wrong. Bourret could be picked in the top 10 and could prove later on that he was worthy of being picked there. But it's not what I believe from what I've seen of him. If Bourret is a top 10 pick then it's a weak draft IMO.