May have been asked before but....Zherdev vs Ruutu?

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CBJSlash

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Let's give Zherdev a season that he isn't being hunted by the Russian Mob before we start discounting this one trick pony.

Ruutu is a fine player I've always regretted the Jackets not taking him, but Zherdev IMO Zherdev has more offensive talent than Nash, who has more than Ruutu, so by the transitive property Zherdev > Ruutu.

Zherdev only played half a season, with no camp, no home, as a runaway, on smaller ice, in a new system, with a new language, against superior players and by the end of the season didn't look out of place (Some games the most dominant player on the ice ie. 3/21/04 against the Canucks, 2 goals and assist in final 12 minutes to win 5-4). Give him 2 years and compare 2007 Zherdev to 2005 Ruutu, IMO the only fair way to compare. Ruutu is fine, but Zherdev will make people laugh at that comparison.
 

Legionnaire

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CBJSlash said:
Let's give Zherdev a season that he isn't being hunted by the Russian Mob before we start discounting this one trick pony.

This has got to be the lamest defense of a player I have ever seen. Strike that. It's second next to Skoula having more puck poise than Lidstrom.
 

Tiki

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Hawkhead said:
Roenick is a better player now and has been.

Roenick never "has been better" the Federov. Never.

He is not as offensively skilled, not as gifted of a skater, or as good defensively. The only the Roenick has is more of a physical edge.
 

CBJSlash

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Legionnaire said:
This has got to be the lamest defense of a player I have ever seen. Strike that. It's second next to Skoula having more puck poise than Lidstrom.

That was sarcasm, finish reading....go on....go ahead.
 

CBJSlash

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Here are Ruutu's stats the year after he was drafted

01-02 Jokerit Helsinki 51 games 7 goals 16 assists +3, 69 PIM

Doesn't look like he was setting the world on fire the year after he was drafted either. :dunno:

OH those stats aren't even from the NHL, ooook. Guess 19 year old Zherdev has the edge over 19 year old Ruutu. Zherdev even had 54 PIM in 57 games.


Don't take this as a knock on Ruutu, I think he's a fine player, I like him. These are two players that really don't compare well. If it's who you think is better I'm going with Zherdev.
 

Hawkhead

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roshiajin said:
Are you being sarcastic? Especially the Feds vs. JR comparison.




I didnt "compare" the two


I dont know if you speak english but vs. is seeing who is better. Roenick and Federov were both great young players around the same time. Like Ruutu and Zherdev.



Understand?
:handclap:
 

HockeyMan9

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Hawkhead said:
Forgot to add something else.


Ruutu is one of the best passers in the world. Im not sure how Zherdev is because he never passes.

Have you ever watched Zherdev play, he's by far and away one of the best passers i've ever seen play. Your arguement may be valid with Nash, but to say Zherdev never passes is just plan wrong.
 

The Boot

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Two very different players, offensively i'd give Zherdev the edge, he's faster, has better hands and playmaking skills. This is not to say that Ruutu is slow and doesn't have good hands and doesn't pass but simply put Zherdev is better in those areas. I'd say it is a wash in terms of goal scoring ability, both have equally impressive wristers, very accurate. However Ruutu has a definite edge in physical play, he is a wicked open ice hitter anyone remember when he blindsided Tootoo in the WJC's a couple years back? that was nasty, in a good way.. not to mention the people he has layed out in the NHL. Zherdev is fairly fiesty himself but not close to Tuomo. Defensive play goes to Ruutu as well, it really isn't hard to be better than Zherdev in that department at this point, from what i've seen of Nikolai he is pretty close to being a liability in that department. Leadership, i don't know how to guage this one, i haven't heard much about Zherdev being a good or bad leader. As for Ruutu he wore and A for Finland in his first WJC's and was the captain in his second appearance. If his passion on the ice means anything he should be a great leader and future captain down the road. It really is a close call between the two, Zherdev will get more points than Ruutu during his prime, just my opinion. But I think Ruutu is a more complete package so i would take him over Zherdev, now and long term.
 

sandels

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I'd give Zherdev a slight edge in puckhandling and overall finesse offensive skills. Tuomo has good vision and has already shown he can also use also his strength to bulldoze through defensemen if need be but Zherdev seems more of a puck wizard at times. Both are capable of creating offense out of nowhere by themselves.

I'm not sure what are Columbus fans' or Russian fans' early impressions Zherdev's leadership qualities but as a one who has seen Tuomo play since a kid he is definately a player who has Playoff Warrior written all over him.

He's a tough kid who has played through great pain already and also shown that he has the ability to thrive under pressure. He started smashing people to the boards from the first time he hit the ice in training camp with a sore knee and never looked back. He was at times badly banged up during the regular season but appeared in every game. When vets were traded away Tuomo said he wants Chicago to be his team and that he is ready to step up. He was given a chance and he was their best player. He did the same in HIFK when Alpo made Tuomo their first line center at the age of 19 and Tuomo was among the FEL's leading scorers until his knee was busted. He played hurt in WC finals and put on an extra gear to score an awesome goal.

It remains to be seen, but I am confident that once Blackhawks get to the postseason Tuomo will play his best hockey every year. Maybe Nik will too, we'll see.
 
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Beukeboom Fan

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roshiajin said:
Zherdev, hands down. Why? Because I've seen Zherdev play a lot and I think he's one of the best young players in the league, but I haven't seen Ruutuu for mor than a few games, and he didn't impress me at all.

I'm wondering - did you see Ruutu play in the first 50 games, or the last 30? The first 50 games Suttter stuck TR playing on the 4th line with stiffs like Travis Moen and Scott Nichol. After the trades of Sullivan & Zhamnov, he finally was given a chance on a scoring line and averaged over a PPG with Arnason & about 50% of Daze (coming off of back surgery). If you saw TR play in the first 50 games, I can see why that would be your impression.

I LOVE both players. Like many posters have said, Zherdev definetely has the higher offensive potential, where Ruutu is more of the total package. This is one of those comparisons that win-win IMO, and shouldn't denigrate into Ruutu is 10 times the player that Zherdev is (or vice versa).

As a Hawks fan, I would rather have Zherdev, just because Ruutu's style of play (which I love) scares the crap out of my with regards to injuries.

EDIT: Also to everyone in the thread, don't let Hawkhead's trolling get to you.
 

name

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Hawkhead said:
I didnt "compare" the two


I dont know if you speak english but vs. is seeing who is better. Roenick and Federov were both great young players around the same time. Like Ruutu and Zherdev.



Understand?
:handclap:

I certainly don't.

How would you determine which of two players is better? You'd compare them. Are you sure that you speak English?

I'll take Ruutu and his more complete game over Zherdev.

I'll take Fedorov and his mad defensive skills over Roenick (although this is a closer call, I like Roenick's physical play and I think that he is a better leader).
 

Archijerej

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Not saying that I would take Zherdev but I'm sick of those "more complete" and "more physical" thing. Peter Mahovlich was probably "more complete" and "more physical" then Kharlamov and I would still take Kharlamov.
 

wilka91*

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Hawkhead said:
I dont know if you speak english but

I don't know why on this forum, more than on any other forum that I know, personal attacks are so common. Whenever someone's not happy, the "discussion" gets personal. :dunno:
 

X0ssbar

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Beukeboom Fan said:
EDIT: Also to everyone in the thread, don't let Hawkhead's trolling get to you.

Was gonna waste my time formulating a reply until I read this tip - thx for the heads up.
 

Hawkhead

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roshiajin said:
I don't know why on this forum, more than on any other forum that I know, personal attacks are so common. Whenever someone's not happy, the "discussion" gets personal. :dunno:


Honestly i wasnt attacking you, I just figured that by your username and picture and by defending all euros in everythread that you were russian and maybe english wasnt your mother tongue.
 

Hawkhead

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Beukeboom, just shutup man. How am i trolling? Because I happen to think Ruutu is a better player then Zherdev and I think we will win the division.


Nice call beukeboom real nice.
 

The Boot

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Archijerej said:
Not saying that I would take Zherdev but I'm sick of those "more complete" and "more physical" thing. Peter Mahovlich was probably "more complete" and "more physical" then Kharlamov and I would still take Kharlamov.

I am a little too young for being able to appreciate Mahovlich or Kharlamov. But it's not really only that Ruutu has better physical, leadership or defensive skills or is "more complete". Ruutu has the potential to be an elite offensive player in the league as does Zherdev, Zherdev will probably get more points than Tuomo. The offensive difference isn't huge and the other things that Ruutu bring to the table on top of his offensive skills are what gives him a slight edge over Zherdev in my opinion.
 

Beukeboom Fan

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Hawkhead said:
Beukeboom, just shutup man. How am i trolling? Because I happen to think Ruutu is a better player then Zherdev and I think we will win the division.


Nice call beukeboom real nice.

Just calling it as I see it.

How about this thread? http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=167280&page=2

Remember quotes like this?

"Ovechkin can develop into a much better version of sergei krivokrasov, peace.

Ruutu for prez!"

Or how about this?

"Ovechkin would be tanked so hard by Ruutu he would have his career ended period."

You have a serious hard-on for Russian's - probably because the Hawks have failed to develop so miserably, so you paint them all with a very broad brush. You are bombastic and impossible to debate with, thus IMO, you are a troll.
 

wilka91*

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Beukeboom Fan said:
Remember quotes like this?

"Ovechkin can develop into a much better version of sergei krivokrasov, peace.

Ruutu for prez!"

LOOOOOOOOOOL :biglaugh: :biglaugh: :biglaugh:
 
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