Maurice 3.0: Is it time for a coaching change or...

Blueline Bomber

AI Generated Minnesota Wild
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Oct 31, 2007
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Yeah, Westgarth is getting more time in the big club than Boychuk and he literally brings nothing of value to the team.

When he's getting ice time over Zach, especially on a team that can't score, it's a pretty good assumption Boychuk's time in Raleigh is done
 

Finlandia WOAT

js7.4x8fnmcf5070124
May 23, 2010
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Our current lack of success is based on Eric scoring at a 46 point pace, Semin at a 41 point pace and Jordan Staal at a 17 point pace. All of our "best" players outside of Skinner are on paces for abnormally low seasons.

Eric is infamous for starting the season slow, for whatever reason (though I do find it odd that he would start the season not caring every single year and then suddenly start caring around December or January). Jordan would do it in Pittsburgh, and he started his career here a PPG player for 10 games before doing nothing for the next 15 games, before producing at a normal pace. Semin is Semin.

After last nights game, the 'Canes are officially at 3 GA/G, which is a darn shame because it seemed that Muller's defensive system was working. At this point, I would put Pat Dwyer with Nash and Malhotra and use them as a 4th line against the other top lines, just to see if it can work. Roll:

Tlusty-E. Staal-Semin
Gerbe-J. Staal- Lindholm
Skinner-Dvorak-Ruutu
Dwyer-Malhotra-Nash

If we are going to use a defensive line, I really want to 'free' Jordan Staal. He needs to be our Brind'Amour, not a Brandon Sutter on steroids.

But really, any criticism on Muller makes the assumption that another coach could get E. Staal, Semin and J. Staal to be consistent producers. And I'm not sure that's the case.
 
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Boom Boom Apathy

I am the Professor. Deal with it!
Sep 6, 2006
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I just wondered aloud to my husband this morning if Muller was ready for primetime? Yes, I did like Paul Maurice a lot ... I thought he had a lot of bad luck with injured players ... but I know change can be good, and when a team isn't winning, coaches go. So I have given Muller a chance, though I really question how he treated Jussi Jokinen who is now red hot for Pittsburgh. I'm starting to doubt him now.

You are claiming Maurice had bad luck with injuries, but you are doubting Muller now?

Last year, Muller lost is #1 goalie and his #2 for a period of time. This year he has lost his #1 and #2 goalie. Muller has lost his #1 defenseman (Pitkanen) for most of last season and all of this season. Last year for a stretch, this team had injuries to Gleason, Pitkanen, and Faulk and were playing with Corvo, Harrison, Sanginuetti, Mcbain and a couple of callups from the AHL as the D. Muller has lost Skinner to concussion last year (and he was never the same) and lost him to injury again this year. Muller hasn't had a healthy Ruutu since he's been here.

I'm not casting judgement yet on Muller (positive or negative), but to claim Maurice had "bad luck with injuries" compared to what Muller has had to deal with is a bit much.
 

FlyingSquirrels

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Jul 5, 2011
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Been quiet for spell while this trainwreck has unfolded before us, again! It would be one thing if we sucked and had a loaded prospect pool. But no, the horrendous management of this team and it's assets has put this franchise in the precipice of complete disaster.

But while the defenders crow about JR's one good trade (Tlusty) it has been surrounded by a litany of disasters (JStaal, Gleason/Ruutu contracts, giving away assets to dump bad contracts onto other teams...contracts that JR wrote!)

Dare I say Buffalo is in better shape than us? At least Regier getting maximum value for his vets.

Change needs to happen at the top. No coach or slack lazy team captain can change a damn thing until the very foundation of this debacle is gutted. JR must resign now. The architect of this must be held accountable.
 

Ole Gil

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May 9, 2009
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Over the last two years:
Justin Peters = 4-16-1
Not Justin Peters = 19-16-6

There are a lot of what ifs and speculation about a lot of things. But it's tough to get around those numbers.

While there are surely many factors involved, you have to have an agenda to not pinpoint the epicenter at Justin Peters being terrible beyond all terribleness.
 

Blueline Bomber

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The only problem with that line of thinking is that while Peters may have been a problem (if not the problem) in the past, he's not the problem currently.

We could have some freaky mutant hybrid of Roy/Brodeur/Vezina/Hasek in net and we'd still be losing a lot of games. No team is going to have a lot of success scoring 2 goals a game
 

Finlandia WOAT

js7.4x8fnmcf5070124
May 23, 2010
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I disagree, if we had competent goaltending currently, our players would have faith that Ward or Qudoba would make the save.

Whether he's been playing above what we are expecting or not, it's obvious that the players have no faith in Peters' to win them games. I wouldn't, either.

That's not necessarily Peters' fault, but his presence dose have a negative effect on the team.
 

What the Faulk

You'll know when you go
May 30, 2005
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Peters was competent against Tampa and Pittsburgh and for 2 periods against the Rangers, and they scored 0 even strength goals. That excuse is a cop out.
 

TheBigKahuna

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Dec 6, 2010
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Unfortunately, I think Muller will be fired soon enough, while the real problem will be ignored.

The REAL problem being lack of veteran leadership, and overpaid players who don't give 100% effort for 60 minutes. Then there's the GM who hands out bad contracts like candy on Halloween.

Muller will be the scapegoat. And Daniels will be brought up to coach the Canes. Proving that it really wasn't coaching all along.
 

Finlandia WOAT

js7.4x8fnmcf5070124
May 23, 2010
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Peters was competent against Tampa and Pittsburgh and for 2 periods against the Rangers, and they scored 0 even strength goals. That excuse is a cop out.

Our current lack of success is based on Eric scoring at a 46 point pace, Semin at a 41 point pace and Jordan Staal at a 17 point pace. All of our "best" players outside of Skinner are on paces for abnormally low seasons.

It's part of the problem...not THE problem.

If it makes more sense, the team's mental fragility could be blamed. Peters' gets scored on, and it's "Oh, here we go again".
 

What the Faulk

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May 30, 2005
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It's part of the problem...not THE problem.

If it makes more sense, the team's mental fragility could be blamed. Peters' gets scored on, and it's "Oh, here we go again".

That's a different story, but part of a larger problem and that doesn't really have to do with Peters himself. They've been scored on first in 11 of their 14 games. Muller called them fragile after the Rangers game, and it's definitely showing.
 

Ole Gil

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If it were just this season, or if the contrast wasn't so sharp, maybe you could get away with deflecting the blame onto the offense or Muller.

The Canes offense was already struggling for 9 games, and they were 4-2-3 getting 2 goals a game most nights. They were coming off 3 really good games against Chicago/Toronto/NYI getting 5 of 6 points. Jordan and Tlusty just got off the snide.

Everything was moving in the right direction. Then Peters, then 0-5 in landslide losses after having only 2 non-one goal games in the first 9, they rattle off 5 straight.

It's a big coincidence.
 

Ole Gil

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May 9, 2009
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It's part of the problem...not THE problem.

If it makes more sense, the team's mental fragility could be blamed. Peters' gets scored on, and it's "Oh, here we go again".

The problem is Peters gets scored on when the team does everything right trying to keep Peters from being scored on. The Tampa game, they had given up 6 shots? before Justin banged home the puck off the end boards. They are fragile for sure, but there's also some justifiable hopelessness in there.

The offense isn't ticking, but in hockey, that's okay. They showed it was okay in the first 9 games. You play games like the game against the Kings. Grind out a few points until things get sorted.
 

snakepliskin

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Jan 27, 2005
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images


WWBBD?
 

Finlandia WOAT

js7.4x8fnmcf5070124
May 23, 2010
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The offense isn't ticking, but in hockey, that's okay. They showed it was okay in the first 9 games. You play games like the game against the Kings. Grind out a few points until things get sorted.

Agreed.

I think it needs to be said again, but last year, no team in the bottom 10 of GA/G made the playoffs, while 3 teams in the bottom 10 of GF/G made the playoffs.

Don't know if defense wins you championships, but it will get you into the playoffs.
 

get tanked

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Apr 8, 2011
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I doubt Muller is fired anytime soon, but if the scoring woes continue, who knows. For better or for worse this team is heavily invested in "scoring forwards" so any success will most likely revolve around a high goals for rather than a low goals against, IMO.

FWIW Guelph is leading the OHL at 15-3 while averaging over 5 goals a game, with 19 more goals than any other team in the league. I wonder if their coach might be on our radar :sarcasm:
 

Drivebytrucker

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Jan 8, 2011
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<rant>
If we could get rid of both Staals or Semin and get a reasonable return, I'd love it.

When we miss the play-offs this season, that will be 4 out of 4 seasons of E. Staal's captaincy that we have accomplished that.

Your captain has to the be guy who brings it every night. He gets outworked nearly every game. We have the laziest two first line players in the league with Semin / Staal.


That's why we lose.... The guys with skill don't work and the guys who do work don't have enough skill.

</rant>
 

jstaal

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Apr 14, 2009
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I think Semin is the best puck carrier at times, just at times his no look passes to other team are a KILLER..THIS TEAM IS FRAGILE AS THEY THEY COME.. HUMPTY DUMPTY HANGING ON THE WALL.. sorry, caps
 

Sens1Canes2

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May 13, 2007
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Yeah I don't know where you can see Semin as lazy...he might try some weird passes and pass up what I think are clear shooting opportunities, but he's working hard, backchecking, etc.
 

gocanes88

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Jan 14, 2007
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Over the last two years:
Justin Peters = 4-16-1
Not Justin Peters = 19-16-6

There are a lot of what ifs and speculation about a lot of things. But it's tough to get around those numbers.

While there are surely many factors involved, you have to have an agenda to not pinpoint the epicenter at Justin Peters being terrible beyond all terribleness.
THIS. /thread
 

Zezima

Registered User
Jul 28, 2012
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Charlotte, NC
Just echoing here. Semin is one of the hardest workers on the team, and arguably the most consistent performer. He and Skinner have been our best two forwards this year by a pretty large margin.
 

Anton Babchuk

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Nov 3, 2005
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Semin's on-ice shooting percentage at 5-on-5 last year was 12.50, this year it's 6.19. Last year he was lucky, this year he is unlucky. There has been no change in his play.

Similarly, Jeff Skinner's on-ice shooting percentage was 5.04 last year, this year it's 13.33%.

I think people need to stop judging players as "lazy" based on production during limited sample sizes in which luck plays a big factor. Do you think opposing goalies have a .972 save percentage when Jordan Staal is on the ice because he's lazy? Do you think opposing goalies have a .855 save percentage when Radek Dvorak is on the ice because he's such an elite offensive presence?

Step off the ledge plz.
 

dogbazinho

Registered User
May 24, 2006
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I'd vote my preference of changes something like; player(s), GM and then coach. We've been through too many coaches with similar results to think the issue is solely coaching. I think we have an overall personnel strategy issue that I'd lay at the feet of Rutherford and what I'll call a motivation issue for several of our players. I say motivation but it's a bit more complicated. I don't think the Staals have the top end talent in some areas like quickness or skill (shooting accuracy, dangle) to overcome lack of effort that some "star" players can get away. Staal needs to outwork his matchups and that doesn't seem to happen for large stretches of games.
 

FlyingSquirrels

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Jul 5, 2011
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Let's see, Rutherford is Owner/President/GM.

Hmmmmmmmm, me thinks he isn't going anywhere and even if he was I'm not sure who has the power to fire him, except Karmanos. Except for getting his own kid fired I'm not sure PK has been involved in even one single hockey decision.
 

golfpro827

Registered User
Jun 30, 2013
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Raleigh, NC
It's certainly panic button time.

This 5 game home stand we are starting tomorrow is a make or break situation for this season.

You can still save it if you win 3 or 4 of these - but 1-4 or something and this season is over before it started.
 

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