Matthews vs Bergeron

Matthews vs Bergeron

  • Matthews

  • Bergeron


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Regal

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Mar 12, 2010
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Its just another way to look at it, how doesn't it have any relation to the thread? can you not read and comprehend? the thread is about which player will be better in the next few seasons, a GM is going to want to pick the better player. Potato potato. Stop trying to over complicate things.

Pretty sure the expansion team is going to take the elite center who is 21 over the elite center who is 33, regardless of whether the 33 year old will be better the next two seasons. The difference in age and potential is too great, and expansion teams aren't usually focused on winning the first two years anyway, despite Vegas's early success.

A more apt comparison would be which player would a cup contender add at the same cap hit if they could only keep him for this season and next. But even then it becomes more based on team needs.

And if by complicating things you mean applying basic logic amd reasoning instead of agreeing with terrible analogies, then I'm sorry for bringing a gun to a knife fight
 

WetcoastOrca

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Jun 3, 2011
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There is a simple way to put this, if Seattle had the opportunity to select ANY player from Toronto vs Boston right now, but could only take 1 Centre who would their GM take? the nearly 34 year old centre or the 21 year old 6'3" 220 lbs franchise centre?

99.9% Seattle is taking Matthews, and so would all of you if you were a GM in that position and you know it.

End of discussion.
Sure. End of discussion if you completely ignore the poll question.
The poll question is who you’d take for the next few years.
 

Regal

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Mar 12, 2010
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As for the topic, I think Matthews might bring more value over 82 games due to his production advantage with lesser linemates (I don't buy that Bergeron stays PPG this year), but Bergeron is such a uniquely skilled player and so frequently outplays "better" top centers head to head that he closes the gap when the games matter more. He's a really difficult player to rank. He's also 33 though and while he doesn't look to be declining, I would feel more confident taking the 21-22 year old who has the potential for an even higher level
 

authentic

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Jan 28, 2015
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Pretty sure the expansion team is going to take the elite center who is 21 over the elite center who is 33, regardless of whether the 33 year old will be better the next two seasons. The difference in age and potential is too great, and expansion teams aren't usually focused on winning the first two years anyway, despite Vegas's early success.

A more apt comparison would be which player would a cup contender add at the same cap hit if they could only keep him for this season and next. But even then it becomes more based on team needs.

And if by complicating things you mean applying basic logic amd reasoning instead of agreeing with terrible analogies, then I'm sorry for bringing a gun to a knife fight

I think what he's really getting at is that Matthews will obviously be the better player for even just the next two seasons, and I also believe every GM in the league would agree.
 

razkaz

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Oct 3, 2013
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authentic

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Jan 28, 2015
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As for the topic, I think Matthews might bring more value over 82 games due to his production advantage with lesser linemates (I don't buy that Bergeron stays PPG this year), but Bergeron is such a uniquely skilled player and so frequently outplays "better" top centers head to head that he closes the gap when the games matter more. He's a really difficult player to rank. He's also 33 though and while he doesn't look to be declining, I would feel more confident taking the 21-22 year old who has the potential for an even higher level

Yep I hear you with this one, that's basically how I feel about it.
 

Zegs2sendhelp

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Due to age, its a bit tough.

I think Matthews will outscore him(goals/points)…. but idk if it will be a large enough amount to counter everything else Bergeron brings to the table.

Over 2-3 years id prob take Matthews.
Just this year I think id go with Bergeron.
 

wintersej

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As for the topic, I think Matthews might bring more value over 82 games due to his production advantage with lesser linemates (I don't buy that Bergeron stays PPG this year), but Bergeron is such a uniquely skilled player and so frequently outplays "better" top centers head to head that he closes the gap when the games matter more. He's a really difficult player to rank. He's also 33 though and while he doesn't look to be declining, I would feel more confident taking the 21-22 year old who has the potential for an even higher level

I take Bergeron against the best teams in the league and Matthews against everyone else.
 
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Halla

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Jan 28, 2016
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Do we need threads on Matthews vs everybody? Bergeron is 33 years old. We don't need a thread on who will be better for the next few years.

i bet you say the same thing when its matthews vs schiefele and matthews is losing right?

no, probably not
 

Halla

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Jan 28, 2016
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I’d probably take Bergeron for the games that actually matter.

fun fact. patrice had a whopping 1 goal in 18 games his first two playoff appearances.
he wasnt actually decent in the post season until he was 24, so am34 has lots of time.

PB: 1g/8pts in 19 games vs AM34: 5g/7pts in 13 games

lets see how both do this year if they meet, hopefully matthews wont be banged up this time.
 

Regal

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Mar 12, 2010
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fun fact. patrice had a whopping 1 goal in 18 games his first two playoff appearances.
he wasnt actually decent in the post season until he was 24, so am34 has lots of time.

PB: 1g/8pts in 19 games vs AM34: 5g/7pts in 13 games

lets see how both do this year if they meet, hopefully matthews wont be banged up this time.

Im sure Matthews will be good in the playoffs, but Bergeron's experience is still a plus right now.

I also think when people talk about Bergeron in the important games, it's more about his matchup ability against other top centers rather than simply his playoffs as a whole.
 

TGWL

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i bet you say the same thing when its matthews vs schiefele and matthews is losing right?

no, probably not


No, I don't. I wonder the same thing why a thread for or against Matthews vs everybody is needed.
 

Bedards Dad

I was in the pool!!
Nov 3, 2011
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Toronto
Due to age, its a bit tough.

I think Matthews will outscore him(goals/points)…. but idk if it will be a large enough amount to counter everything else Bergeron brings to the table.

Over 2-3 years id prob take Matthews.
Just this year I think id go with Bergeron.

The defensive gap isn't what you are making it out to be. Skip to 2:48.

 

b in vancouver

Registered User
Jul 28, 2005
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Matthews is great but I still take Bergeron the next two seasons as honestly seems to be getting better lately. Going to be a sad day when he starts trending down - but it hasn't happened yet.
 

BruinsBtn

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Dec 24, 2006
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In the playoffs, Bergeron settled who is better now (by a long shot).

But time catches up to everyone and in 1-3 years Bergeron will slow down and Matthews will undoubtedly pass him.
 

Tim Vezina Thomas

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Jun 4, 2009
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This is how I look at it...

I would NOT trade Bergeron for Matthews if I knew it would only be for this season, but Matthews is 21 years old and might already have an argument for being better than Bergy. Matthews for the long run here AINEC, but I think Bergy is the more complete talent as of right now.
 

Goose312

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May 15, 2015
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Bergeron for at least the next season or two. Uniquely dominant defensively while producing offensively.
 

PatriceBergeronFan

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Jul 15, 2011
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fun fact. patrice had a whopping 1 goal in 18 games his first two playoff appearances.
he wasnt actually decent in the post season until he was 24, so am34 has lots of time.

PB: 1g/8pts in 19 games vs AM34: 5g/7pts in 13 games

lets see how both do this year if they meet, hopefully matthews wont be banged up this time.

Again... education time : there is more to hockey than points!!

Also, context is important. 4 points in 7 games as an 18 year old is impressive. In 08-09 Bergeron was still recovering his career from the concussions. A convenient sample size to choose from.
 
Last edited:

Regal

Registered User
Mar 12, 2010
24,545
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Vancouver
All you have proven is you post without watching the video that's posted. Welcome to the ignore list, I have no time for ignorance.

Yes, not giving much weight to the video that showed a single stat and didn't even show the gap between Bergeron and Matthews is a sign of ignorance. I love that Leafs fans keep parroting whatever stats someone throws out that make Matthews sound good regardless of any meaning behind it. Suddenly defensive plays per game is the most important when no one has ever used it in any defensive discussions around here, especially when it includes things like blocked shots when defensemen like Kris Russell are simultaneously criticized for them because it shows a lack of possession. Bergeron is in his own league defensively, and an actual thorough look at all the stats regularly show that. Matthews is an active defensive player (hence the stat) and very good, especially for his age, but Bergeron is an all time great defensively.
 

BigBadBruins7708

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Dec 11, 2017
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Yes, not giving much weight to the video that showed a single stat and didn't even show the gap between Bergeron and Matthews is a sign of ignorance. I love that Leafs fans keep parroting whatever stats someone throws out that make Matthews sound good regardless of any meaning behind it. Suddenly defensive plays per game is the most important when no one has ever used it in any defensive discussions around here, especially when it includes things like blocked shots when defensemen like Kris Russell are simultaneously criticized for them because it shows a lack of possession. Bergeron is in his own league defensively, and an actual thorough look at all the stats regularly show that. Matthews is an active defensive player (hence the stat) and very good, especially for his age, but Bergeron is an all time great defensively.

just for fun,

Matthews has yet to post a CFrel over 2.5 in a season.

Bergeorn posted a CFrel of 9.6, 8.7, 9.7, 5.6 the last 4 years
 

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