Marners start..

[Al14]

He now needs to be something extra, extra special that, at present, he is not.

Fixed!

 

[killer1980]

At the beginning of the last two seasons, I told my wife how exciting this Leaf team is. Even she would watch. They were fun, freewheeling and high scoring. They were driven by their young stars. Now, their grinders have been doing a great job, but the game itself is pretty boring. Even with a win against Detroit, the game itself was not fun. The kids look like they aren't enjoying themselves anymore. Something is definitely off with Marner, but Tavares and Reilly as well. Nylander is looking better but not worth his $$$$. Mathews is the only one playing like he has something to prove and he does. He's gotta be pissed he's not captain, not even an'A'. He's showing them he can be just as exciting with his pants up as down. In the meantime, my wife says we're not staying home just to watch these "same ole boring Leafs".

 

[Leafsfan74]

At least Matthews and Nylander playing up to their value so far...

Marner looking like a greedy little player. He should have taken what Rantanen got.

Why should he have taken less when he got more? He didn't force the Leafs to overpay him, nor did he have any leverage other than costing himself money by sitting out a year. Ditto for Nylander.

It's a business. As I've said, only Tavares can say he came here and was well paid when he didn't have to. All these other players are restricted, the Leafs held the rights.

You can bet this will be repeated over and over in T.O. It used to be an annual free agent overpayment season when there was no cap, but nobody cared since it didn't hurt the team for the future (just lower profits for a chance at much bigger profits if they won the Cup). Now with the cap, it's overpayment of young stars who have no leverage and it can have drastic implications for the future, especially if the cap doesn't increase.

The Leafs are a corporate team, and only the most hardened die hard Leafs fans growing up (like Tavares) will come here at a discount. That's just the world we live in.

 

[Leaf Fans]

Great, Leafs paid almost 11m a year to a ppg winger. That's the problem.

He has been a point per game to start the season. It hasn't been five years yet.

 

[Babcocks Marner]

His point production is good. His underlying numbers are honestly quite fine too. But you can really see that something is wrong. People talk about his slow start before but he's always been playing rather good, just not getting results. Now he is making so many bad decisions with the puck. He's killed offense in a way I honestly don't think I've seen from him as an NHLer. He throws weak shots from bad positions way, way too much. He's missed passes in a way we didn't see all season last year, and some of them haven't been close.

I think we need to acknowledge that while also acknowledging how little a 6 game sample actually means. I'm willing to bet that our worries will look silly sooner rather than later. He didn't stop being a star and one of the best playmakers in the league. A slump is just a slump. But right now he's a PP specialist for us, and to be honest he's been mostly a beneficiary of other peoples play there too.

I was honestly shocked looking at his advanced stats. Besides the 5v5 stuff, it's actually in line with previous years. It doesn't help when your goalie has a .850 save % when you are on the ice.

Overall though, you're right, there is something wrong. Mitch has suffered confidence issues his whole career. He might be going through it again after the contract blow back. He took a big hit to his ego.
I'm sure he will bounce back, but he is feeling the pressure, big time.

 

[TML Dynasty]

Shouldn’t be being used on pk. I like him shooting more since it prevents goalies from cheating on the pass, but I hope his shot improves. Give him time

 

[Beyonder91]

Could be worse.... Barzal (2 assists) Aho (1 goal) come to mind.
6 games is a very small sample.

 

[A1LeafNation]

Why should he have taken less when he got more? He didn't force the Leafs to overpay him, nor did he have any leverage other than costing himself money by sitting out a year. Ditto for Nylander.

It's a business. As I've said, only Tavares can say he came here and was well paid when he didn't have to. All these other players are restricted, the Leafs held the rights.

You can bet this will be repeated over and over in T.O. It used to be an annual free agent overpayment season when there was no cap, but nobody cared since it didn't hurt the team for the future (just lower profits fo a chance at much bigger profits if they won the Cup). Now with the cap, it's overpayment of young stars who have no leverage and it can have drastic implications for the future, especially if the cap doesn't increase.

The Leafs are a corporate team, and only the most hardened die hard Leafs fans growing up (like Tavares) will come here at a discount. That's just the world we live in.

Right he didn't force the Leafs to do the offer, but he was also being petty in negotiations.

Leafs having fans turn on their player and have their player missing camp does nothing good for the team...so yeah blame is on the team, but Marners camp was the driver of that shitty contract.

 

[sparxx87]

I agree, just for his selfishness alone, he should find himself playing elsewhere.

I also think his dad will be poisonous to the team for the duration of his career. Get rid of them both.

Now, having typed the above, my preference is that he lives up to his contract for the duration.

Mine as well, I just don’t think it’s realistic on that term. By the time the cap goes up enough for it to make more sense, he’ll be up for renewal.

I think now is the best time to deal with a team like Columbus. They’ve got their top 3 D and a number 1 centre that theoretically fits well with Marner. They’re also one of the teams who reportedly presented an offer sheet so you know the interest is there.


Not on the same level but the Bruins traded Blake Wheeler to help fill out the roster and won a cup because of it - I think a similar move from the Leafs should be considered.

 

[ULF_55]

Tavares has to start scoring.

If Tavares doesn't score his linemates don't get points.

Simple, the producer on the line has to produce so the beneficiaries of that production can point at their own totals.

On the PP Matthews is going to have keep producing.

 

[ULF_55]

Could be worse.... Barzal (2 assists) Aho (1 goal) come to mind.
6 games is a very small sample.

Barzal 2 even strength points.
Marnr 2 even strength points.

Islander 12 goals
Leafs 24 goals

Aho huge OUCH, 1 goal 'Cane 24 goals.

They'll both come back, but I haven't watched the 'Canes so I don't know if he looks bad or just having bad luck.

 

[Clark4Ever]

The sooner they get rid of him the better.

Hard to win with selfish players and he’ll never provide good value-per-dollar in a cap world. The team is far more unlikable with him on it and would be better served trading him for players that actually affect winning in more than just the assist column.

David Savard
Josh Anderson
Boone Jenner

for

Mitchell Marner
___________ ?

I'd rather give him the chance to turn things around and start earning his contract. I do think he's capable.

If it does get to that point though, keep in mind that his trade value would be severely impacted by his salary.

 

[Clark4Ever]

At least Matthews and Nylander playing up to their value so far...

Marner looking like a greedy little player. He should have taken what Rantanen got.

He's not earning Rantanen's salary yet either, not even close.

 

[Clark4Ever]

He’s looked awful despite picking up some PP points. Most concerning to me is that he has frequently looked uninterested and disengaged. He’s shown sparks at times, but he’s largely been a passenger and completely ineffective. It’s bizarre to see him throwing pucks away with low percentage shots and brutal passes. Whatever the genesis of this slump is, be it pressure, bad luck, or another slow start, we need him to get going.

He hasn’t been helped by his linemates slow starts either, but he argued for enough money that the expectations are sky high. Matthews is playing like a man possessed, Marner needs to get his head out of his butt and get playing.

This.

It's that much more frustrating because all the issues you mentioned are very uncharacteristic of him.

Show some heart, stop being selfish with the puck, and everything should take care of itself.

 

[sparxx87]

I'd rather give him the chance to turn things around and start earning his contract. I do think he's capable.

If it does get to that point though, keep in mind that his trade value would be severely impacted by his salary.

Definitely, and that’s why it’d have to be a team like Columbus who was presumably willing to pay in that range when they presented an offer sheet.

They lost Panarin. How much do they want an elite talent to pair with Dubois?

 

[DarkKnight]

Reminds me of last year when JT wasn’t scoring for a few games, line looked disjointed. People were actually saying he was on the decline, other complete nonsense. If people want to get wound up for an uneven start in October have it, mighty waste of time to me, not to mention pretty fickle.

It’s like we never learn.

 

[Menzinger]

Simply put, Marner burned a lot of good will and patience this offseason.

Mitch may be a point-per-game, but his points play out as:

5v4 - 4 pts
6v5 - 1 pt
4v4 - 1 pt
5v5 - 0 pts

He's been a total passenger at even strength, his line (the one he supposedly drives) has been arguably our most underwhelming one and his general decision-making has been poor.

His primary point output and possession has been meh too.

With that said, we know hes capable of being better than this.

 

[Mess]

Simply put, Marner burned a lot of good will and patience this offseason.

Mitch may be a point-per-game, but his points play out as:

5v4 - 4 pts
6v5 - 1 pt
4v4 - 1 pt
5v5 - 0 pts

He's been a total passenger at even strength, his line (the one he supposedly drives) has been arguably our most underwhelming one and his general decision-making has been poor.

I think this shows just how valuable Zach Hyman is to his line at ES in making it operate at a high rate because of all the things he does for his linemates.

When you're missing the glue, its hard to hold things together.

 

[Superstar]

I'm kind of indifferent to him too at this point. He used up a lot of goodwill this summer, and it would take a lot to earn that back.

I just watch hockey for fun and entertainment. What actually happens doesn't mean much, if anything, to me beyond that.

If Marner should crash and burn I couldn't really care less, but if he succeeds and wins the Conn Smythe Trophy any time soon I will shamelessly jump back on that bandwagon.

$10,9893,000 is a lot of bananas, but it can't buy you success, respect or peace of mind. You have to earn those things in other ways.

I will say that he is the champion of the contract-negotiaton and screw-your-teammates events.

If he crashes and burns at that cap hit, the Leafs will be in a boat load of trouble. Haven't you viewed the video of why he wanted "93" in his AAV? He definitely earn those things in other ways...blame Gilmour.

 

[Superstar]

Tavares has to start scoring.

If Tavares doesn't score his linemates don't get points.

Simple, the producer on the line has to producer so the beneficiaries of that production can point at their own totals.

On the PP Matthews is going to have keep producing.

But some folks will tell you that the primary assist is closely related to a goal, so who needs the goal scorer? Marner could simply pull the primary assists out of his a55, right?

 

[Superstar]

I agree, just for his selfishness alone, he should find himself playing elsewhere.

I also think his dad will be poisonous to the team for the duration of his career. Get rid of them both.

Now, having typed the above, my preference is that he lives up to his contract for the duration.

Does Marner's dad even travel with the other Leafs players' dads? What a great sense of comradery and community, eh?

 

[Fogelhund]

It would seem as though if you were resigned in the summer, you aren't having a good start for the Leafs. Kapanen and Johnsson only have two points as well... though Johnsson should probably have more.

Yes, Marner is PPG, but it's his and JT's 5v5 play that need improvement. Marner has 2 points 5v5 so far, thankfully the PP has been clicking.

We need guys like JT and MM to be at their best, against the better teams. We don't have the team to grit it out, so they better being using their talent, or we just won't compete.

 

[PromisedLand]

I think this shows just how valuable Zach Hyman is to his line at ES in making it operate at a high rate because of all the things he does for his linemates.

When you're missing the glue, its hard to hold things together.

True.

But it also shows that the coach is trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. I don't see why Kapanen has to play on that line to begin with....

In addition, Kapanen usually switches to RW on that line leaving Marner to play on the LW trying to make plays on his backhand; it kills that line IMO

They could easily have one of Moore or Mikheyev on that line until Hyman is back and drop Kapanen on the third line

Mikheyev-Tavares-Marner
Johnsson-Matthews-Nylander
Moore-Kerfoot-Kapanen
Timashov-Goat-Shore/Spezza

Once Hyman is back Leafs have two options:

1. Move Moore to the 4th line, Mikheyev to the third line
OR
2. Trade Kapanen for futures, cap flexibility or D-man

 

[PromisedLand]

If he crashes and burns at that cap hit, the Leafs will be in a boat load of trouble. Haven't you viewed the video of why he wanted "93" in his AAV? He definitely earn those things in other ways...blame Gilmour.

that extra 34K from Matthews and 93K from Marner = total 127K on the cap at the moment is too much!!!

 

[Superstar]

that extra 34K from Matthews and 93K from Marner = total 127K on the cap at the moment is too much!!!

It could have been $9.3939393939393 if he was really that obsessed...