Player Discussion Marner Talk - Fresh, insightful comments are welcome

[Darcy Tucker]

He’s played the better half of that contract with Matthews.
Please stop.

I'm aware but the discussion was the Boston series where he played on Tavares' wing and was crap. Maybe taking him off of Matthews wing was the wrong move because Domi and Bert didn't do much in crunch time either.

 

[Superstar]

I'm aware but the discussion was the Boston series where he played on Tavares' wing and was crap. Maybe taking him off of Matthews wing was the wrong move because Domi and Bert didn't do much in crunch time either.

The Domi-Matthews-Bertuzzi line single-handedly won game 2 for the Leafs...and then Matthews missed almost 2 and a half games due to illness/injury...wasn't 100% in game 7, yet still assisted Willy for the first goal in game 7...Willy also won game 6 for the Leafs after missing a few games from the start due to illness...meanwhile in game 7, Swayman gifted Marner the puck for a goal, but instead of tucking it shortside for a goal, Marner decides to take the long route around the back of net missing the opportunity entirely...all because he was afraid to take a hit...this is game 7, and that's how Marner still plays...it's embarrassing that he wears an "A" and makes so much money.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

I'm not convinced they trade Marner anymore.

There's still too many fans who see him as an integral part of the team. They'd rather run it all back with a different coach and hope for better results. We've moved from the “denying it’s happening" phase, through the “forget that it ever happened” phase, and now on to the “who cares that it happened again” phase.

The complacency in this fan base is mind numbing.

The season ticket holders and corporate sponsors should be furious. Imagine spending all that money on expensive seats. Only to not attend any playoffs games.

Because you already know this team is a loser.

The saddest thing is we have no reason to believe this pathetic pack of losers and liars have turned a corner. My best guess is these incompetent lunatics are still up to the neck in their delusions. They'll only make a couple of so-so moves in order to shut a few fans up for now.

Marner will get his raise halfway through the year in the middle of a hot streak, same as Nylander this year, and the team will underachieve once again.

 

[Confucius]

Marner has played with Matthews every series we've played, except this year. Nylander has played with Tavares and he's been just fine. 24, 25 and 26 year old Marner has barely outscored 31, 32 and 33 year old Tavares in the playoffs. Last year was the only time and he got all his points in the 1st 3 games and 2 of them were blowouts by each team. Well, Tavares is 33 and making 11 million towards the cap which nobody is gonna want to take on. We could eat half that salary but it's probably better to keep him for the final year because we aren't gonna get much even if we eat 50% of that salary. Marner on the other hand is still young so I'm sure we could get a C who could be Tavares replacement and move Tavares down to 3C for the year.

Well 3 time rocket winner Mathews has the same number of Leaf career playoff goals as 33 year old JT. And nobody on the team has more.

 

[1specter]

Wyatt Johnston has as many playoff goals in his two year career as Marner does his entire 8 year career. Mitch has 27 more playoff games played...

 

[Racer88]

Was it really unfortunate though? Did it even matter? Did we really need that spanking from Florida again?

Sigh……good point

 

[Confucius]

I'm not convinced they trade Marner anymore.

There's still too many fans who see him as an integral part of the team. They'd rather run it all back with a different coach and hope for better results. We've moved from the “denying it’s happening" phase, through the “forget that it ever happened” phase, and now on to the “who cares that it happened again” phase.

The complacency in this fan base is mind numbing.

The season ticket holders and corporate sponsors should be furious. Imagine spending all that money on expensive seats. Only to not attend any playoffs games.

Because you already know this team is a loser.

The saddest thing is we have no reason to believe this pathetic pack of losers and liars have turned a corner. My best guess is these incompetent lunatics are still up to the neck in their delusions. They'll only make a couple of so-so moves in order to shut a few fans up for now.

Marner will get his raise halfway through the year in the middle of a hot streak, same as Nylander this year, and the team will underachieve once again.

Its not the players it is the coaching. There is no way 4 players well really all players underperformed at the same time. Has any Leaf consistently played better during the playoffs than they have during the regular season over the last 8 years?

Even when we parachute guys in for the playoffs, they fail. When we trade for guys the 1st few games they are here it's yeah this is what we need. A month later what happened to his Game? Lol

Its coaching man, finding the right coach is key.

 

[Confucius]

The Larry Murphy treatment

2 Cups before we got him, 2 cups after he leaves. Was the player the problem or was it the team?

 

[Dayjobdave]

Is there a world where an inspiring coach and a new system creates a playoff Mitch that delivers? And once JTs contract is up and he returns on a cheap deal, all the boys get along, there’s no whining, and we get the D and goalie help we need?

 

[ashs]

Maybe ditching Tavares means Marner doesn't have to play with him and actually comes through on his potential? We need to tie our ship to the 27 year old (fkin all star) that if we re sign we can get something back for. What are we holding onto with Tavares ?

Tavares has been clutch for us. Can't day the same about marner

 

[ToneDog]

I'm not convinced they trade Marner anymore.

There's still too many fans who see him as an integral part of the team. They'd rather run it all back with a different coach and hope for better results. We've moved from the “denying it’s happening" phase, through the “forget that it ever happened” phase, and now on to the “who cares that it happened again” phase.

The complacency in this fan base is mind numbing.

The season ticket holders and corporate sponsors should be furious. Imagine spending all that money on expensive seats. Only to not attend any playoffs games.

Because you already know this team is a loser.

The saddest thing is we have no reason to believe this pathetic pack of losers and liars have turned a corner. My best guess is these incompetent lunatics are still up to the neck in their delusions. They'll only make a couple of so-so moves in order to shut a few fans up for now.

Marner will get his raise halfway through the year in the middle of a hot streak, same as Nylander this year, and the team will underachieve once again.

He needs to be gone before July 1st so we know who we can resign. Most in the media think he will waive once he realizes he is no longer wanted.

 

[Darcy Tucker]

Tavares has been clutch for us. Can't day the same about marner

That's not the point of my post. In terms of a pure hockey asset. Doest it make sense to resign Marner to a reasonable contract (now that he feels the heat and sees reality) or hang onto a slow roasted Tavares for a few more years of faceoff percentage points and learning lessons?

I'm not deluding myself that Marner is some clutch performer or can be (although he can) but I'm also not saying my 33 year old captain who has put up the least playoffs points of the core 4 has been clutch and needs to be retained. Keeping Tavares is lunacy. Keeping Marner is asset management.

 

[Dayjobdave]

That's not the point of my post. In terms of a pure hockey asset. Doest it make sense to resign Marner to a reasonable contract (now that he feels the heat and sees reality) or hang onto a slow roasted Tavares for a few more years of faceoff percentage points and learning lessons?

You make a good point about the only way Mitch could be re-signed. If he sees reality and signs a reasonable contract. It's pretty binary. Mitch's camp comes to the table and says they want Mitch to be a leaf and they will do a team friendly deal, or Mitch's camp comes to the table and says "Mitch is worth as much as Matthews, and certainly more than Nylander." The only question is which of those two things happens.

 

[ToneDog]

You make a good point about the only way Mitch could be re-signed. If he sees reality and signs a reasonable contract. It's pretty binary. Mitch's camp comes to the table and says they want Mitch to be a leaf and they will do a team friendly deal, or Mitch's camp comes to the table and says "Mitch is worth as much as Matthews, and certainly more than Nylander." The only question is which of those two things happens.

Not a chance in hell and even if he did his number would still be too high to keep him IMO. At this point he needs to be gone. Period.

 

[ACC1224]

You make a good point about the only way Mitch could be re-signed. If he sees reality and signs a reasonable contract. It's pretty binary. Mitch's camp comes to the table and says they want Mitch to be a leaf and they will do a team friendly deal, or Mitch's camp comes to the table and says "Mitch is worth as much as Matthews, and certainly more than Nylander." The only question is which of those two things happens.

It's going to be a long summer of redundancy waiting to find out.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Its not the players it is the coaching. There is no way 4 players well really all players underperformed at the same time. Has any Leaf consistently played better during the playoffs than they have during the regular season over the last 8 years?

Even when we parachute guys in for the playoffs, they fail. When we trade for guys the 1st few games they are here it's yeah this is what we need. A month later what happened to his Game? Lol

Its coaching man, finding the right coach is key.

There's only three possibilities.

It's either the coaching. The players. Or the roster construction.

The fact it could plausibly be all three tells us just how poorly this team has been run for years.

He needs to be gone before July 1st so we know who we can resign. Most in the media think he will waive once he realizes he is no longer wanted.

He's more valuable after July 1st when his signing bonus is paid.

They'll probably have to re-sign him first though. Like Nylander I expect other teams will want Marner extended before trading for him. But I think you are right that now fans have started to turn on him it's only a matter of time before he's moved.

It's very telling Marner's jersey was the one that got burned.

 

[Kazparov]

That's not the point of my post. In terms of a pure hockey asset. Doest it make sense to resign Marner to a reasonable contract (now that he feels the heat and sees reality) or hang onto a slow roasted Tavares for a few more years of faceoff percentage points and learning lessons?

I'm not deluding myself that Marner is some clutch performer or can be (although he can) but I'm also not saying my 33 year old captain who has put up the least playoffs points of the core 4 has been clutch and needs to be retained. Keeping Tavares is lunacy. Keeping Marner is asset management.

What's reasonable? He will want a raise from his last contract. Chances of him taking a steep home town discount seem low considering how he did in the last contract negotiation

 

[ToneDog]

There's only three possibilities.

It's either the coaching. The players. Or the roster construction.

The fact it could plausibly be all three tells us just how poorly this team has been run for years.



He's more valuable after July 1st when his signing bonus is paid.

They'll probably have to re-sign him first though. Like Nylander I expect other teams will want Marner extended before trading for him. But I think you are right that now fans have started to turn on him it's only a matter of time before he's moved.

It's very telling Marner's jersey was the one that got burned.

Absolutely. In a perfect world you have a trade worked before July 1st and you announce it July 2nd after his bonus is paid. This way you know how much extra cap space you have to spend on July 1st.

 

[LeafEgo]

You make a good point about the only way Mitch could be re-signed. If he sees reality and signs a reasonable contract. It's pretty binary. Mitch's camp comes to the table and says they want Mitch to be a leaf and they will do a team friendly deal, or Mitch's camp comes to the table and says "Mitch is worth as much as Matthews, and certainly more than Nylander." The only question is which of those two things happens.

Might be right but there may not be a practical path forward.

Constructing a new look to overcome the bad 'patterns', and with Matty and Willy already locked up, they may decide they don't have more than say 6M in the budget for a small playmaking winger with a soft game, whereas another team might have double that.

The mgmt team sure set the scene for a trade. I'll be a bit surprised if that was just a negotiating tactic.

 

[Tak7]

Wyatt Johnston has as many playoff goals in his two year career as Marner does his entire 8 year career. Mitch has 27 more playoff games played...

Marner also plays on line 1, PP1, and lots more minutes than Wyatt Johnson.

 

[IPS]

Its not the players it is the coaching. There is no way 4 players well really all players underperformed at the same time. Has any Leaf consistently played better during the playoffs than they have during the regular season over the last 8 years?

Even when we parachute guys in for the playoffs, they fail. When we trade for guys the 1st few games they are here it's yeah this is what we need. A month later what happened to his Game? Lol

Its coaching man, finding the right coach is key.

You guys really are deadset about blaming everyone around Marner instead of Marner himself. Tre's acquisitions actually outscored Marner there buddy.

Good grief that's pathetic.

 

[TheGreenTBer]

You guys really are deadset about blaming everyone around Marner instead of Marner himself. Tre's acquisitions actually outscored Marner there buddy.

Good grief that's pathetic.

It's pathetic to see so much emotional attachment to players that take, take and take some more and don't give us shit to cheer for in return. It's like Stockholm Syndrome tbh.

 

[IPS]

It's pathetic to see so much emotional attachment to players that take, take and take some more and don't give us shit to cheer for in return. It's like Stockholm Syndrome tbh.

Just curious too where all this defense was during the series. None of these guys showed their faces to defend Marner when the games were actually happening because you literally couldn't with the way he was performing.

Wait a week and a half when the games aren't so fresh in everyone's mind and somehow this bullshit is able to fly again.

 

[ACC1224]

Marner also plays on line 1, PP1, and lots more minutes than Wyatt Johnson.

Hadn't seen much of Johnson until the playoffs, great young player.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Maybe ditching Tavares means Marner doesn't have to play with him and actually comes through on his potential? We need to tie our ship to the 27 year old (fkin all star) that if we re sign we can get something back for. What are we holding onto with Tavares ?

Nylander came through on his potential playing with Tavares, while Marner was playing with Matthews. Which is more of an all-star?

Or were you specifically talking about these playoffs, where Marner played with Tavares, while Nylander came through playing with third liners?

By keeping Tavares one more year we are holding onto the assets (likely a first or more) we would have to give up to get someone to take on his contract.

I agree that if we can re-sign Marner to a more reasonable amount without an NMC we are more likely to get a good return.