Post-Game Talk: Marner loses it, 4-3 OT

[ShaneFalco]

Mitch has built more credit with Leaf fans but he will run out if he continues to make bone headed plays like last night's. The other difference is that he makes lots of good plays in between brain farts so fans tend to forget.

Those brain farts won't be forgiven so easily now. He made his bed...

 

[rumman]

Toronto Maple Leafs in one picture:

 

[Sniper99]

You are right. Let's this team wallow in mediocrity for the next 5 or 10 years and then make the change. Management has blown it! Let's get them out and get a real leadership team in there or watch your fans disappear and then I guess it won't matter. Dubas is a disaster and Shanny put him there that = goodbye to both.

Nice to see you fail to answer my question. Yes thats exactly what Shanahan did. A little too much tin foil on your hat.

 

[Trapper]

Those brain farts won't be forgiven so easily now. He made his bed...

For some reason Marner is the guy I expect the most from. We will see.

That being said, a major problem I'm seeing is the group that Dubas has committed to all have the same type of issue behind the skill.

While more talented, it still reminds me of the JVR/Kessel days. Very talented, very, very frustrating. And when committing to a core, you can't really go all in with guys who suffer the same affliction. Draisaitl plays different from McDavid who plays different from MacKinnon or Crosby and different from Rantanen etc.

All our guys have the same issues from intensity, physical, D, etc. That in itself might require a change. We need skill of different styles/results.

 

[Apotheosis]

For some reason Marner is the guy I expect the most from. We will see.

That being said, a major problem I'm seeing is the group that Dubas has committed to all have the same type of issue behind the skill.

While more talented, it still reminds me of the JVR/Kessel days. Very talented, very, very frustrating. And when committing to a core, you can't really go all in with guys who suffer the same affliction. Draisaitl plays different from McDavid who plays different from MacKinnon or Crosby and different from Rantanen etc.

All our guys have the same issues from intensity, physical, D, etc. That in itself might require a change. We need skill of different styles/results.

This would be a lot easier if Matthews decided to do what Gauthier did and started throwing the body down low. It would completely change a lot of things.

 

[Trapper]

This would be a lot easier if Matthews decided to do what Gauthier did and started throwing the body down low. It would completely change a lot of things.

He doesn't have to throw the body but guys like Rantanen and Draisaitl use it to protect the puck so well down low and on the wall. We've seen Matthews do that (he can be a beast) but that is just to infrequent.

People like Muzzin. Muzzin doesn't play like Rielly. It's different skill.
The 3 forwards have the same troubles. That's a problem. Attention to detail, focus, board/wall play, intensity, etc.

If you have a Muzzin - Rielly, you need a Marner - Tkachuk. A Matthews something.
It's too much incomplete up front. 3 guys that don't really forecheck that hard, attention to D that hard and get lost in the clouds. 1 guy at least needs to be intensity skill.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

This would be a lot easier if Matthews decided to do what Gauthier did and started throwing the body down low. It would completely change a lot of things.

I think after all those early shoulder and back injuries in his career Matthews is a little more hesitant to play that style of game. Maybe he will get some more confidence in his body back if he remains healthy for a while

 

[TMLS]

You do realize he was Assistant GM since 2015 right?

His work in the past rebuilding teams such as the Greyhounds and the Marlies, all align with rebuild in Toronto. There's a reason the first main management piece Shanny went after before we began the rebuild, was literally Kyle Dubas.

ALL on the team and developed under Dubas from the Marlies: Kapanen, Johnsson, Hyman, Dermott, Moore, Nylander, Timashov, Gauthier, Holl

ALL on the team from Dubas trades: Muzzin, Barrie, Kerfoot, Mikheyev, Ceci, Marincin

ALL being developed currently on the Marlies: Sandin, Lilijegren, Engvall, Robertson, SDA, Bracco, Scott, etc.

Matthews (1OV), Marner (4OV) were super-obvious picks AND caused by the rebuild (which as I mentioned Dubas was a major part of).

Andersen and Rielly were fantastic moves by the previous management (Lou). But outside of that, what on earth has he 'inherited'.

Baby boomers always hating on Dubas. When Lou is one of the most overrated GM, just like the coch Babcock. Dubas easily top 5 GM in the league, will be top 3 if he fires Babcock.

 

[Ratboy]

We got wrecked against Tampa bay and we're still playing the same shinny style hockey. They didn't learn from that game.

You're right. I'm not sure what will wake them up, if anything at all.

 

[ACC1224]

You do realize he was Assistant GM since 2015 right?

His work in the past rebuilding teams such as the Greyhounds and the Marlies, all align with rebuild in Toronto. There's a reason the first main management piece Shanny went after before we began the rebuild, was literally Kyle Dubas.

ALL on the team and developed under Dubas from the Marlies: Kapanen, Johnsson, Hyman, Dermott, Moore, Nylander, Timashov, Gauthier, Holl

ALL on the team from Dubas trades: Muzzin, Barrie, Kerfoot, Mikheyev, Ceci, Marincin

ALL being developed currently on the Marlies: Sandin, Lilijegren, Engvall, Robertson, SDA, Bracco, Scott, etc.

Matthews (1OV), Marner (4OV) were super-obvious picks AND caused by the rebuild (which as I mentioned Dubas was a major part of).

Andersen and Rielly were fantastic moves by the previous management (Lou). But outside of that, what on earth has he 'inherited'.

Another main piece Shanahan brought in was Babcock.
I wonder when the heat starts to turn towards Teflon Shanny?

 

[Notsince67]

He's also a big minus! In other words he's a liability at even strength.

Barkov was a minus all last year. Him too?

 

[sparxx87]

Baby boomers always hating on Dubas. When Lou is one of the most overrated GM, just like the coch Babcock. Dubas easily top 5 GM in the league, will be top 3 if he fires Babcock.

You mean in contract dollars signed? Couldn’t possibly be ranking unless you meant bottom when you said top.

I think many in the analytics crowd have blind loyalty to Kyle Dubas and can’t or won’t recognize that he’s done a pretty poor job so far.

 

[MyBudJT]

You mean in contract dollars signed? Couldn’t possibly be ranking unless you meant bottom when you said top.

I think many in the analytics crowd have blind loyalty to Kyle Dubas and can’t or won’t recognize that he’s done a pretty poor job so far.

You probably have a point here.

Had Brian Burke signed Matthews and Marner at 11.6 and 10.9 respectively, this place would be absolutely livid.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

Another main piece Shanahan brought in was Babcock.
I wonder when the heat starts to turn towards Teflon Shanny?

He just signed a new 6-year extension. Doubt the heat turns on him for a while.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I think many in the analytics crowd have blind loyalty to Kyle Dubas and can’t or won’t recognize that he’s done a pretty poor job so far.

I think many can't see past the Marner contract and acknowledge that overall, Dubas has done a really good job so far. What the reason for this blindness is, now that I don't know.

 

[ShaneFalco]

I think many can't see past the Marner contract and acknowledge that overall, Dubas has done a really good job so far. What the reason for this blindness is, now that I don't know.

He let Mcbackup go! He sucks

 

[Gary Nylund]

He let Mcbackup go! He sucks

LMAO. I swear I saw someone actually complaining about this even today.

 

[RoadWarrior]

Barkov was a minus all last year. Him too?

Relative to his teammates Marner has been a defensive liability.

Barkov is better defensively relative to his teammates.

Got it?

 

[Hustlr]

Lol did someone call out Shanahan? Wtf

 

[sparxx87]

I think many can't see past the Marner contract and acknowledge that overall, Dubas has done a really good job so far. What the reason for this blindness is, now that I don't know.

Maybe.

For me it’s not just one thing. I can usually reason with most decisions I don’t agree with but he’s made a few I just can’t comprehend.

I don’t like his philosophy, I don’t think he’s addressed the weaknesses and I don’t have confidence he can find the right mix with this core under the current cap constraints.

 

[LeafsLegendAkiBerg]

He still tried to grab the puck with his glove, just because Anderson got there first, doesn't make it less dumb.

No he didn't, he was pushing down on Andersen's glove to prevent the Columbus player from knocking it free. I get it's popular to hate on Marner now but this is a pretty stupid thing to attack him for.

 

[Hustlr]

Maybe.

For me it’s not just one thing. I can usually reason with most decisions I don’t agree with but he’s made a few I just can’t comprehend.

I don’t like his philosophy, I don’t think he’s addressed the weaknesses and I don’t have confidence he can find the right mix with this core under the current cap constraints.

Not a fan of Muzzle?

Mikheyev?

Our drafts?

Ya there’s a couple head scratchers but the tradeoff would be a net loss imo. Dubas is carrying as hard as he can minus contract negotiations.

 

[BurnsBlue]

Ruined my perfect prediction....maybe. lol

 

[ACC1224]

He just signed a new 6-year extension. Doubt the heat turns on him for a while.

I don't mean by his boss but by the media, fans

 

[sparxx87]

Not a fan of Muzzle?

Mikheyev?

Our drafts?

Ya there’s a couple head scratchers but the tradeoff would be a net loss imo. Dubas is carrying as hard as he can minus contract negotiations.

Muzzin - Nah, not really. Hard to say that was a bad trade right now but I’d be curious to know what else was available.

Mikheyev - Yeah. I’m not sure how much credit he gets on the signing. I read Babcock was pretty involved in it.

Drafts are too soon to tell. I’m definitely discouraged seeing a bunch of squirts. Not that they can’t/won’t make it, but this team needs a better mix and he seems to target only one player type.