Salary Cap: Marner Deal Discussion Part V

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A1LeafNation

Obsession beats talent everytime!!
Oct 17, 2010
27,284
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On the day of a Raptors championship parade, Dubas and Marner still nickel and diming each other.

Shameful.

Both of them need to get their act together and come to an agreement.
 
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BallardEra

Leafs&Caps Since 1982™
Dec 26, 2017
7,159
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East York, Ontario
What's the latest rumour of asking term/price out of Marner's camp?

Really hope this is resolved before the draft but I don't expect it to.
 

SHANNYPLAN

Registered User
Nov 24, 2016
5,208
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if he wants over 10 million, trade him for a young RHD +.

Or

Marner & Brown
For
Werenski & Anderson
 
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ITM

As Long As It Takes
Jan 26, 2012
4,536
2,509
This is madness!

This. Is. Not Sparta. Sooooo, mindful of the lack of leverage we have Mr.Marner could you do us a solid and not completely hamstring any future viability for a championship club?

Oh to be able to kick financial constraints right in the middle of the chest and into a bottomless pit.
 
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Socreges

Registered User
Oct 10, 2013
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Father was buoyed by today's Raptors celebration and says Mitch will see how great it is to be in Toronto and sign soon!
:handclap::handclap::handclap:
 

Heisen

Registered User
Mar 27, 2019
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Marner still demanding 13x4 to sign before july 1. Dubas still crying in a corner.
 

Advanced stats

Registered User
May 26, 2010
11,641
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Curious...
What happens if multiple offer sheets come in?
The leafs have to match the highest or lowest one?
 

HappyJoy

Registered User
Jun 17, 2019
86
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I kinda hope Marner gets what he wants and Nylander gets traded away from this dumpster fire of an organisation.
 

Throw More Waffles

Unprecedented Dramatic Overpayments
Oct 9, 2015
12,889
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There is a line somewhere, but we aren't there yet. Not even close.

Marner has been nothing but spectacular during his ELC years for his age. Its mind boggling to me how so many people here are trying to diminish what he's done, and what he will become.

Maybe not, but there are some very close. Without looking very hard:

2009/2010 Penguins (Malkin's first post-ELC year): 21.4/56.8M cap (38%)
Malkin(8.7M)
Crosby(8.7M)
Staal(4M)

2010/2011 Capitals : 22.24 /59.4M cap (37.5%)
Ovechkin(9.54)
Backstrom (6.7)
Semin (6)

2015/2016 Blackhawks: 26.275 /71.4 (37%)
Kane: 10.5
Toews: 10.5
Hossa: 5.275

Hmmm... makes me feel a little better actually.

Those teams actually had pretty successful seasons those years as well. So at least there is some precedent at this working.

Curious though (without the motivation to look all of it up) if any those teams above had to trade/let go of any big names to fit under the cap.
 

Nineteen67

HFBoards Sponsor
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Dec 12, 2017
22,364
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Curious...
What happens if multiple offer sheets come in?
The leafs have to match the highest or lowest one?

I would imagine they negotiate with a team prior to them giving them the offer sheet to sign.
I highly doubt they fax them and you pick and choose which one you want or take them to Leafs as a negotiating tool.
 

MyBudJT

Registered User
Mar 5, 2018
7,429
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Hmmm... makes me feel a little better actually.

Those teams actually had pretty successful seasons those years as well. So at least there is some precedent at this working.

Curious though (without the motivation to look all of it up) if any those teams above had to trade/let go of any big names to fit under the cap.

Yeah, I’m not going to pretend to know. Didn’t Pittsburgh have Hosea a season or two before? Also, Didn’t Chicago trade Saad around then?
 

Superstar

"Be water, my friend."
Jun 25, 2008
12,398
8,450
This. Is. Not Sparta. Sooooo, mindful of the lack of leverage we have Mr.Marner could you do us a solid and not completely hamstring any future viability for a championship club?

Oh to be able to kick financial constraints right in the middle of the chest and into a bottomless pit.

Don't forget...he wants Matthews money...so that's like $10 million for 3 years...$11.6 for 5 years...$14 million for 8 years...and better front-load that contract with 93% in signing bonuses every year too! This team is going nowhere in a hurry...can't believe after all these years, we finally have a bunch of young talent...only that they are also a bunch of greedy kids...blood sucking piranhas! They're sucking this organization dry and haven't delivered anything!
 

Stamkos4life

Registered User
Oct 25, 2018
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@mavis "5v5 doesn’t trump production it gets considered alongside it when determining offensive value. Marner at 10x8 would be a good deal for both sides."

Nylander signed for 6 years. Not 8.

Using arvidsson, who you and nith both think is worth ~2.75 mil less then nylander, you should have no issue with marner at 10-11 mil for 6 years.

Nith cant seem to face this because he seems to be overly attached to nylander. He's swedish so there is some conflict of interest there. I'm not sure what your problem is though.
 

kb

Registered User
Aug 28, 2009
15,200
21,497
@mavis "5v5 doesn’t trump production it gets considered alongside it when determining offensive value. Marner at 10x8 would be a good deal for both sides."

Nylander signed for 6 years. Not 8.

Using arvidsson, who you and nith both think is worth ~2.75 mil less then nylander, you should have no issue with marner at 10-11 mil for 6 years.

Nith cant seem to face this because he seems to be overly attached to nylander. He's swedish so there is some conflict of interest there. I'm not sure what your problem is though.
Neither one of them has a problem.
 

YearsintheWilderness

Registered User
Jul 15, 2007
2,111
1,101
Seems like Dubas negotiates scared. Even if that's not true, the perception is there and agents are trying to take him for all he's worth/the Leafs are worth. Now, as July 1st approaches, Dubas is likely regretting the statement about "imperative to sign him by July 1st." Marner and his entourage are possibly going to go beyond July 1st for leverage.

So it comes down to Dubas's humiliation threshold. I would love to see Dubas shock everyone by trading this punk.
 
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EXPECT THE LEAFS

Registered User
May 7, 2016
1,902
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Seems like Dubas negotiates scared. Even if that's not true, the perception is there and agents are trying to take him for all he's worth/the Leafs are worth. Now, as July 1st approaches, Dubas is likely regretting the statement about "imperative to sign him by July 1st." Marner and his entourage are possibly going to go beyond July 1st for leverage.

So it comes down to Dubas's humiliation threshold. I would love to see Dubas shock everyone by trading this punk.

A bold move like that equates to a lot of risk. A guy like Dubas, young GM, is probably first and foremost looking out for his career trying to mitigate risk. You stand pat, don't make the bold move, and nobody even knows there was a high risk/reward scenario that was passed up. I know people like to think of this guy as some hockey genius, but personally I don't see the genius at all. He seems more like one of those guys that rehearses a lot and throws around a few big words trying to make you think he's intelligent.
 

Stamkos4life

Registered User
Oct 25, 2018
2,955
2,630
Neither one of them has a problem.

Like I said earlier, I'm just looking for consistency. Something they are lacking.

I personally think 10-11 mil at 6years is to much for marner. But that also 7 x 6 is to much for nylander.

Where as they seem to think the nylander contract is fine but marner needs to sign at 10 x 8.

If you saw the arvidsson part you will know they have no issue with nylander making ~2.75 mil more. Well using the same scale marner is worth 10-11 mil for 6 years.
 

duffy9748

Registered User
Nov 26, 2007
4,842
688
Flyers fan coming in peace. If it comes to Dubas having to make a trade, I think the Flyers match up well and here are some of the main pieces I could see being available from the Flyers POV.

Gostisbehere
Oskar Lindblom
Farabee
Frost
11th overall
2020 Picks
Large Group of prospects with NHL futures.
 

Throw More Waffles

Unprecedented Dramatic Overpayments
Oct 9, 2015
12,889
9,737
Like I said earlier, I'm just looking for consistency. Something they are lacking.

I personally think 10-11 mil at 6years is to much for marner. But that also 7 x 6 is to much for nylander.

Where as they seem to think the nylander contract is fine but marner needs to sign at 10 x 8.

If you saw the arvidsson part you will know they have no issue with nylander making ~2.75 mil more. Well using the same scale marner is worth 10-11 mil for 6 years.
Why is Nylander the only benchmark from which to assess Marners worth? There are dozens and dozens of other comparables at play. There is a firmly held precedent for elite wingers coming off their elc. 10-11x6 is FAR above that precedent. Ridiculously far above that precedent. If you're going to counter decades of precedent with just Nylanders contract... well... that seems like a folly.
 

Mr Hockey

Toronto
May 11, 2017
11,156
3,660
Flyers fan coming in peace. If it comes to Dubas having to make a trade, I think the Flyers match up well and here are some of the main pieces I could see being available from the Flyers POV.

Gostisbehere
Oskar Lindblom
Farabee
Frost
11th overall
2020 Picks
Large Group of prospects with NHL futures.
are you talking a trade involving Marner?
 

TheKrebsCycle

Throwing Confetti for Perfetti
Jun 1, 2011
6,383
1,984
Barrie
Flyers fan coming in peace. If it comes to Dubas having to make a trade, I think the Flyers match up well and here are some of the main pieces I could see being available from the Flyers POV.

Gostisbehere
Oskar Lindblom
Farabee
Frost
11th overall
2020 Picks
Large Group of prospects with NHL futures.

None of those pieces would be the centre piece to a Marner trade. It would be provorov and continue adding..
 
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