I believe the premise of this though stems from the idea that terminating the contract, even as a 35+ cap hit, would remove the cap hit. I was arguing against that as well.
Sportsnet: Marleau only wants to play in SJ, will require direct trade or trade to team who buys him out.
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I believe the premise of this though stems from the idea that terminating the contract, even as a 35+ cap hit, would remove the cap hit. I was arguing against that as well.
Quid Pro Clowe
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llamateizer
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Divine
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It cost Detroit 1.13M in salary back + a 1st (#16) overall for a 1st (#20) and a 2nd (#53)
Datsyuk had 7.5M in cap hit. Marleau has 6.25. So essentially Detroit traded down 4 spots, got rid of Datsyuk and got a 2nd round pick back. Arizona basically took him for free to get to the cap floor.
mouser
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sharkhawk
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Divine
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After the Leafs pay Marleau's bonus, real dollars is 1.25M. Let's not forget the Chris Pronger trade either.
1.25M for a 6.25M hit is captivating for a team on a budget. It saves 5M in cash.
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CupInSIX
My cap runneth over
mouser
Business of Hockey
Online reports are Marleau’s bonus is split into two payments on July 1st and December 1st. No reports on exactly how the payments are broken down, but the sensible assumption would be half on each date. If that’s the case then real dollars for that Marleau trade would be $2.75m.
Chris Pronger doesn’t matter here. Pronger was LTIR and his contract was covered by insurance, so the real dollars were less then a million.
Divine
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You still pay for insurance.
Those reports are inaccurate, and it's the first I've heard of them. As far as I'm aware, all signing bonuses have to be paid on July 1st.
mouser
Business of Hockey
You seem to espouse a lot of extreme beliefs without researching if you’re correct beforehand.
Divine
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mouser
Business of Hockey
Well, you’re wrong. Instead of telling some of us folks we’re wrong in this thread, perhaps you could read the responses and learn.
CupInSIX
My cap runneth over
I'm sure there's a way to compensate Melnyk for the 3.8m buyout.
Which is to say, make it worth his while to help out a rival.
Which is to say, make it worth his while to help out a rival.
Divine
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Stephen
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The way the NHL's hard cap is so punitive has always confused me, especially those recapture penalties looming on the Weber, Luongo deals and punitive 35 year old + deals.
I get that you want to level the playing financial field and whatnot but when you have a stagnant economic climate all it means is you punish teams by forcing their dismantling, dishonest circumventing and you punish fanbases. All good from a schadenfreude kind of way, but in the long run it just turns the entire hockey conversation into conservative budgeting and prevents big market teams like the Leafs from building a team that goes deep in the playoffs, or teams like LA and Chicago from keeping their playoff teams intact, which hurts total revenue totals. If the Raptors gate receipts were any indication, a lot of money is being left off the table.
I get that you want to level the playing financial field and whatnot but when you have a stagnant economic climate all it means is you punish teams by forcing their dismantling, dishonest circumventing and you punish fanbases. All good from a schadenfreude kind of way, but in the long run it just turns the entire hockey conversation into conservative budgeting and prevents big market teams like the Leafs from building a team that goes deep in the playoffs, or teams like LA and Chicago from keeping their playoff teams intact, which hurts total revenue totals. If the Raptors gate receipts were any indication, a lot of money is being left off the table.
mouser
Business of Hockey
Which section of the CBA? I’ve read I’d back and forth a dozen times. Would be happy to educate you on the CBA details.
mouser
Business of Hockey
Seriously?
What world are you living in?
Hint: Teams can’t offer to pay signing bonuses in a trade. It’s barred by the CBA.
Divine
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TSN was talking about it, maybe they were incorrect. Let me find the section in the CBA pertaining to signing bonuses having to be paid in the summer.
To Toronto:
Rights to Brendan Gaunce
To Vancouver:
Patrick Marleau (1M retained)
53rd overall pick
Toronto gets 5M cap relief and if they choose to re-sign gaunce, a league minimum cheap depth player that can hold his own on the 4th line. If not they just shed 5M for a late 2nd
To San Jose:
Patrick marleau (2.5M retained)
53rd overall pick
To Vancouver:
41st overall pick
San Jose gets their old captain back and he gets to retire a shark. At 2.5M and still being a 30-40 point guy, he provides good value. Probably would get this kind of contract if he was bought out anyways.
Rights to Brendan Gaunce
To Vancouver:
Patrick Marleau (1M retained)
53rd overall pick
Toronto gets 5M cap relief and if they choose to re-sign gaunce, a league minimum cheap depth player that can hold his own on the 4th line. If not they just shed 5M for a late 2nd
To San Jose:
Patrick marleau (2.5M retained)
53rd overall pick
To Vancouver:
41st overall pick
San Jose gets their old captain back and he gets to retire a shark. At 2.5M and still being a 30-40 point guy, he provides good value. Probably would get this kind of contract if he was bought out anyways.
Empoleon8771
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I'm pretty sure that the Sharks can't afford Marleau unless it's at like $1 million or less, so this deal probably doesn't work for them. I also don't see how Marleau has any positive value for anyone.
Divine
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To revert to this, not much said about signing bonuses at all in the CBA. Mainly player bonuses, so I assume it could be split.
Where does it say a team cannot agree to pay the signing bonus on a current player?
mouser
Business of Hockey
Since you’re obviously not interested in listening, here’s my challenge to you:
Name one player who was traded since 2005 when the salary cap went into effect where the trading team agreed to pay the signing bonus.
Thats 15 years of trades where many teams would have loved to paid the signing bonus money for a better return but weren’t allowed to.
Ouroboros
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The easiest way to do this would be for the Leafs to take Mike Condon and Ben Harpur - who just so happen to have a combined salary of 3.8M - as part of the trade return. A Marleau buyout would then be cash neutral for the Sens.
The Leafs could buy Condon out for a minimal cap hit [400k this season, 1.0M the following year] and bury Harpur in the AHL with no cap penalty.
Then it just comes down to negotiating the sweetener for Ottawa bailing the Leafs out of a jam.
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