Confirmed with Link: Mark Stone to VGK

[stempniaksen]

That core could have been phenomenal. It doesn't have the skill TB's does, but honestly that core looks more suited for playoff hockey. Brady and Stone are bulldogs, and don't seem phased by anything. EK (when healthy) is a proven playoff performer and leader, and Duchene is showing he can be big in the playoffs in CBJ.

It's insane to see Tampa fold like a cheap suit after that game 1 loss. They are just so mentally fragile. Have you ever seen anyone of them show the intensity Stone does when he scores?

It's a very sad case of what could have been. You could have locked up that core, and cut off everything else that was useless. New coaches, new complimentary players, new culture. Commitment from ownership, and a hard reset (fire coaches, fire GM) after the garbage year that was 2017 was all the team needed imo, instead they got the exact opposite.

Yeah, the team (well, Eugene) doubling down on Dorion/Boucher at the expense of the core literally put this team back (at least) 5+ years. It's gonna be tough to build that kind of core again. Even if you assume Chabot = Karlsson and Tkachuk = Stone (already a stretch) we still need to hit big on a handful of guys to even get back to where we were.

 

[stempniaksen]

I don't think this was meant as a scud missile directed at the Sens org specifically (I think the guy is just excited to be where he is right now), but I certainly don't blame Sens fans for feeling reeeeeeal bad about the context this quote was made in.

... Because yeah, that's feels like a dagger. It might not have been an overt shot at Sens management, but it sure as hell tells volumes about his opinion of the management here.

Took ~20 minutes for the Golden Knights to give him $76 million and then they stuck him in front of (arguably) the best fans in the league (or best building in the league anyways). Pretty easy to see why the guy would be elated to be there.

 

[Upgrayedd]

I don't think this was meant as a scud missile directed at the Sens org specifically (I think the guy is just excited to be where he is right now), but I certainly don't blame Sens fans for feeling reeeeeeal bad about the context this quote was made in.

... Because yeah, that's feels like a dagger. It might not have been an overt shot at Sens management, but it sure as hell tells volumes about his opinion of the management here.

Management had excuses rightly or wrongly for other players shipped out, Stone being moved should have alerted the casual fan to what was truly going on here, of course most here who have been keen to uncle Eugene's crazy ride had come to terms with his movement shortly after that 1 year deal he signed last year. I assume it's common amongst the fan base here in that nobody is surprised by his performance this year and happy that he did the right thing for his career and left town. As you stated, even after acceptance it still hurts so very badly!

 

[BonkTastic]

Management had excuses rightly or wrongly for other players shipped out, Stone being moved should have alerted the casual fan to what was truly going on here,

You can find a "team-friendly" subjective excuse for any one player on why they left this org, if you try hard enough to look for one. It might not be a great excuse, but for the fan who isn't ready to admit that the team's problems have reached epidemic levels, finding that niche excuse and holding on to it can be a comfort, so I get the mindset involved in that rationalization (even if I don't agree with it).

When you look at the mass exodus, however, it becomes near impossible to rationalize using basic logic.

 

[supsens]

My signature was ‘2018/2019 worst to first’ for the longest time. We had the building blocks of a perennial contender. Maybe our window would have only been three or four years but everything you’d need or want was there.

We blew it up because we didn’t want to spend the money. It hurts a lot.

This feels like Alfredsson/Chara all over again - except this tone we lost both.

It could have been blown up because some of these guys didn’t want to live in the nations capital. I am not sure why everyone blindly thinks everyone wants to live in the area. There was a time when EM wasn’t a problem and I don’t recall everyone running to the sens then.

 

[BatherSeason]

It could have been blown up because some of these guys didn’t want to live in the nations capital. I am not sure why everyone blindly thinks everyone wants to live in the area. There was a time when EM wasn’t a problem and I don’t recall everyone running to the sens then.

This is a new approach, the "bad place to live approach" hasn't been used yet. At least the blame the fans approach has been scrapped for today. I applaud the change in narrative, as wrong as it is. A for effort!!

Funny that even the org's biggest water carriers have basically admitted that it had nothing to do with the city or the team and mostly to do with "he who shall not be named" not ponying up the cash and bonus structures required to compete in this league.

 

[stempniaksen]

It could have been blown up because some of these guys didn’t want to live in the nations capital. I am not sure why everyone blindly thinks everyone wants to live in the area. There was a time when EM wasn’t a problem and I don’t recall everyone running to the sens then.

Difference is that we could typically "keep our own". Ottawa will never be a hotshot free agent destination, but historically we could draft, develop and then sign our own players. Alfie stuck around, Redden stuck around, Phillips stuck around. As far as the recent players are concerned, Turris, Karlsson and Duchene all alluded to the fact they would have loved to make Ottawa their "forever" home. I also doubt they would have kept Stone around that long if they had an indication he wanted out at all cost.

It's kinda easy to see where the problem lies after this mass exodus and it certainly isn't on the players.

 

[Sens in Process]

You can find a "team-friendly" subjective excuse for any one player on why they left this org, if you try hard enough to look for one. It might not be a great excuse, but for the fan who isn't ready to admit that the team's problems have reached epidemic levels, finding that niche excuse and holding on to it can be a comfort, so I get the mindset involved in that rationalization (even if I don't agree with it).

When you look at the mass exodus, however, it becomes near impossible to rationalize using basic logic.

Ya, there are are overriding cost-cutting initiatives factored in to every trade/hire and it is disconcerting.

Brassard for Zibby trade was a prime example. Brassard was cheaper, had cost certainty(signed for a couple more years) and, on top of that, Sens included a 2nd rounder to avoid a signing bonus.

Cash considerations obviously have place in a cap world. But when you are hemorrhaging draft picks to save some cash, it is really a bad situation.

I think team is well on its way to amassing some serious talent, even with the missteps . However, I have little to no confidence ownership will commit to signing all these guys.

 

[lancepitlick]

Did we as fans underrate the possibility of Karlsson/Stone/Duchene/Chabot/Tkachuk as a core 5?

I really hope that Karlsson was actually a huge dick who only cared about his hair and instagram, or that the Sens knew something about the physical condition of his foot, because I look at that potential core, and if an owner was willing to spend, that looks like a pretty damn good top end of a lineup. It's difficult watching guys like Stone kill it in the playoffs, and consider the core we moved on from otherwise. It's not Tampa Bay, but that's a team that with the right drafting should have been able to be in it year after year for the next 5 or so years.

I don't think we can really use the "we have to be Tampa with Kuch/Stamkos/Point/Hedman/etc/etc" as a metric because it is nearly impossible to build that good of a team. So I look at what our potential core could have been, and man I sure hope Brannstrom knows how to be a good girlfriend here because we moved on from a potential great core.

I don't think fans thought it was a bad core, they are all great players. The issue was that the roster prior to Tkachuck/Chabot being contributors this season (and more likely to have a major impact next season) was terrible outside of the top guys. Overall the team stunk.

The remaining forwards, defense and even the goaltending were/are terrible.

Because the people running the show appear to be incompetent (Melnyk/Dorion/Boucher) nobody wanted to risk resigning as they didn't have confidence in those people to right the ship. If you listened to Pierre Dorion speak for 10 minutes would you want to attach your career to him? Then listen to Brendan Shanahan talk. Why would you pick Dorion?

The issue was never fans appreciation of Stone/Karlsson/Duchesne etc. Everybody knows they are great.

The issue has been with the ability of Melnyk/Dorion to build a team around them.

Building anything involving people is also about leadership. Melnyk and Dorion have no leadership skills.

If you had a competent owner and a Stevie Y level GM you could sell to players that you are the right person to turn things around and give them confidence enough to commit to you. Then you can ride out a bad season or two without implosion. As we can Ottawa doesn't have that level of leadership so when things went south everyone junped ship.

 

[supsens]

This is a new approach, the "bad place to live approach" hasn't been used yet. At least the blame the fans approach has been scrapped for today. I applaud the change in narrative, as wrong as it is. A for effort!!

Funny that even the org's biggest water carriers have basically admitted that it had nothing to do with the city or the team and mostly to do with "he who shall not be named" not ponying up the cash and bonus structures required to compete in this league.

I didn’t say bad place to live, if you are from western Canada or the USA or any country and you were a 27 year old with millions of dollars and you get to chose from 30 cities to live in why would you be choosing only this city?
Some people might decide it’s where they want to be, but a lot of guys might choose based on weather, some might because of the country, some party life, some where they can go out on the town and no one would even hassle them on the streets. Others find taxes an issue.

The whole idea you act like that is a ‘fake reason’ or an ‘excuse’ is unreal. What’s more likely, some grown men might have personal reasons to live elsewhere in this world or every little thing bad on this planet falls to the lap of one guy?

 

[DrakeAndJosh]

I didn’t say bad place to live, if you are from western Canada or the USA or any country and you were a 27 year old with millions of dollars and you get to chose from 30 cities to live in why would you be choosing only this city?
Some people might decide it’s where they want to be, but a lot of guys might choose based on weather, some might because of the country, some party life, some where they can go out on the town and no one would even hassle them on the streets. Others find taxes an issue.

The whole idea you act like that is a ‘fake reason’ or an ‘excuse’ is unreal. What’s more likely, some grown men might have personal reasons to live elsewhere in this world or every little thing bad on this planet falls to the lap of one guy?

Why does Karlsson live here in the summer then? Why did Phillips/Redden/Neil/Alfie/Spezza/etc stick around for over a decade? Why does EVERYONE all of a sudden want out? Sure, certain players will want to move on, but not EVERY player. Do you seriously not think something is obviously happening here?

 

[supsens]

Ya, there are are overriding cost-cutting initiatives factored in to every trade/hire and it is disconcerting.

Brassard for Zibby trade was a prime example. Brassard was cheaper, had cost certainty(signed for a couple more years) and, on top of that, Sens included a 2nd rounder to avoid a signing bonus.

Cash considerations obviously have place in a cap world. But when you are hemorrhaging draft picks to save some cash, it is really a bad situation.

I think team is well on its way to amassing some serious talent, even with the missteps . However, I have little to no confidence ownership will commit to signing all these guys.

I have little to no reason to think this market can support signing all these guys. Can I ask why you Think this market will generate enough cash to pay them all?

 

[BatherSeason]

What’s more likely, some grown men might have personal reasons to live elsewhere in this world or every little thing bad on this planet falls to the lap of one guy?

The most likely scenario has nothing to do with the fans, the weather or taxes and mostly due to an owner who won't spend any money. Even the homer-iest of Ottawa sports media has basically admitted these guys loved the city and left because of Melnyk without using his name.

 

[BatherSeason]

I have little to no reason to think this market can support signing all these guys. Can I ask why you Think this market will generate enough cash to pay them all?

Round and round we go.

Wait wait!! Can I go first?? I say BLAME THE FANS!!! Bad fans, good fans, they are all to blame.

 

[supsens]

Why does Karlsson live here in the summer then? Why did Phillips/Redden/Neil/Alfie/Spezza/etc stick around for over a decade? Why does EVERYONE all of a sudden want out? Sure, certain players will want to move on, but not EVERY player. Do you seriously not think something is obviously happening here?

these players stuck around under EM did they not? Could be the cap has outgrown the market and unless they find away to fix the issue between the haves and the have nots it’s only going to get worse.
How many summers has Karlsson spent since the trade? And what’s the weather like compared to winter?

 

[supsens]

Round and round we go.

Wait wait!! Can I go first?? I say BLAME THE FANS!!!

Yes answer the question and stop acting like you being nailed to a cross and ‘blamed’ for anything.

 

[supsens]

The most likely scenario has nothing to do with the fans, the weather or taxes and mostly due to an owner who won't spend any money. Even the homer-iest of Ottawa sports media has basically admitted these guys loved the city and left because of Melnyk without using his name.

So your most likely is everyone wants to live here?
Lol sure..that’s the most likely scenario

 

[BatherSeason]

I have little to no reason to think this market can support signing all these guys. Can I ask why you Think this market will generate enough cash to pay them all?

Not sure why this needs to continually be repeated on every page in every thread, but, this market generated enough cash in the past and they will again once the owner and the management team stops lying to the fanbase and admits whats actually going on here.

 

[BatherSeason]

So your most likely is everyone wants to live here?
Lol sure..that’s the most likely scenario

Did you actually read what I wrote or what other posters above wrote? Many players extended here and most under market value too.

And yes, I do believe that professional hockey players want to live here

 

[BatherSeason]

I have little to no reason to think this market can support signing all these guys. Can I ask why you Think this market will generate enough cash to pay them all?

Either way, no need to derail yet another thread!! Go Mark Stone! Go Vegas!! Hope he continues his role and that Dorion and Melnyk are embarrassed to have let this guy slip through their fingers!

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

So your most likely is everyone wants to live here?
Lol sure..that’s the most likely scenario

The most likely scenario is that our owner is cash-poor and can't afford to compete with other owners in the NHL. If you choose to bury your head in the sand that's your business but the option that requires the least speculation is usually the correct one.

 

[supsens]

Not sure why this needs to continually be repeated on every page in every thread, but, this market generated enough cash in the past and they will again once the owner and the management team stops lying to the fanbase and admits whats actually going on here.

Enough for a lower payroll/lower cap, not enough for this. It’s repeated every thread because money seems to be no issue for you and you talk about it all day, reality says it’s the biggest problem the team faces

 

[BatherSeason]

Enough for a lower payroll/lower cap, not enough for this. It’s repeated every thread because money seems to be no issue for you and you talk about it all day, reality says it’s the biggest problem the team faces

"You, you, you, you"....funny you point the finger solely at me when 99% of the board feels the exact same way.

Not sure what reality you are living in, but in actually reality, the biggest problem this team faces is not attendance and fan support. Quite the opposite actually.

 

[supsens]

"You, you, you, you"....funny you point the finger solely at me when 99% of the board feels the exact same way.

Not sure what reality you are living in, but in actually reality, the biggest problem this team faces is not attendance and fan support. Quite the opposite actually.

I say you because I’m speaking to you.
If you think the half price tickets and half empty barn has no impact on what the team can spend then you are thinking with your fan glasses and not thinking logically.
Do I think the teams actions and on ice product is a cause for this? Yesss. But it still does not change the fact that no money is no money

 

[coladin]

Why does Karlsson live here in the summer then? Why did Phillips/Redden/Neil/Alfie/Spezza/etc stick around for over a decade? Why does EVERYONE all of a sudden want out? Sure, certain players will want to move on, but not EVERY player. Do you seriously not think something is obviously happening here?

When Redden and company signed long term, Ottawa was a team going places. Would Redden sign that extension today, if the team was where it was? Would Spezza?

People like to win , and that is a factor going into UFA. Or at least be headed in the right direction. Back then, the team was always on an upswing