Marc Staal vs. Ryan Parent

[mercury]

nomorekids, to be honest with you, it would depend on the player, and for me Peter Forsberg who is always an injury waiting to happen, isn't that guy... Joe Sakic, a proven big game player like Chris Drury yes. but not Forsberg.... I respect your belief that he is worth it, but for me the Injury history makes it too great a risk, and the few times that I've had dealings with David Poile in the past, he really doesn't strike me as a foolish risk taker, in fact when I knew him (back in washington dc) he was one of the shrewdest executives in the NHL.

Like I said its a subjective opinion and I respect that you disagree, and things may be such in Nashville that he feels he needs to do this at this time, but it would be out of character with the man I knew. (though I admit player transactions and Tax administration for the league are 2 different kettles of fish) I will say this however aside from David Conte in New Jersey, David Poile was always the quickest study in the room. The man had a head for finance.

The Preds may disgree with your assessment of Forsberg, though. I doubt that they gave up Parent and a 1st lightly. If they do not win the Cup (or at least come out of the West), then they will be criticized mercilessly. I don't think Parent fell out of favor at all in Nashville. I think that they took a calculated risk because they wanted Forsberg THAT badly.

 

[Isles_Guy*]

you could be right, It may just be that, I wouldn't say in any case that Parent fell out of favor anyway, I was merely speculating that they perhaps didnt see him as a shutdown defender that most here seem to see him as. I know that most nashville people I've talked to hockey wise have told me that Shea Weber was the better prospect defensively, but once again, you could be right. time will only tell, but for me I'd say Staal,

 

[mercury]

you could be right, It may just be that, I wouldn't say in any case that Parent fell out of favor anyway, I was merely speculating that they perhaps didnt see him as a shutdown defender that most here seem to see him as. I know that most nashville people I've talked to hockey wise have told me that Shea Weber was the better prospect defensively, but once again, you could be right. time will only tell, but for me I'd say Staal,

I think that Shea Weber is their best prospect/young defenseman. He may be better than Suter.

 

[nomorekids]

a proven big game player like chris drury or joe sakic? peter forsberg is about the most proven "big game" player in the league at this point, injury history or not.

besides, drury and sakic weren't and aren't available. peter forsberg being available isn't an every year occurance.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

The fact that the Rangers wouldn't entertain offers for Staal says more about the organization's depth at D than the quality of the player, in my opinion.

Are you just completely oblivious to the quality D prospects that the Rangers currently have or what?

 

[xander]

Are you just completely oblivious to the quality D prospects that the Rangers currently have or what?

I'm excited about the Rangers young defensemen and prospects too, but lets be honest here, the ranger's stable doesn't hold a candle to: Suter, Weber, Hamuis, (Parent), Klein, Franson, Laakso.

Again, I like what the rangers have got coming down the pipeline (Tyutin, Staal, Sauer, Sanguinetti, Baranka, Pock) but Nashville's collection of young defensemen, even with the loss of parent, is just on another level.


At the same time, I still hold that Staal is a discernibly better prospect than Parent.

 

[Isles_Guy*]

Xander, I agree with you, I just tend to think people were over rating Parent as a shutdown defender, 2nd pairing yes, but Staal, Weber, Jack Johnson, they all are clearly to me one level better.

 

[Novak Djokovic]

Marc Staal.... In offensive abilities and also defensive abilities. He's a better shutdown guy!

Parent comes close! Philly got a great prospect....They both will be like Lidstrom and Pronger!

 

[xander]

They both will be like Lidstrom and Pronger!

This is a bit of an overstatement. Neither Staal nor Parent has shown the offensive abilities that those 2 did at the same age. You're talking about two hall of famers there, lets not heap such expectations on 19 year olds.

What we're most likely looking at is somthing along the lines of Matias Ohlund (Staal) and Chris Phillips (Parent.) But making projections is always a risky business, and these could easily be wrong.

 

[xander]

Xander, I agree with you, I just tend to think people were over rating Parent as a shutdown defender, 2nd pairing yes, but Staal, Weber, Jack Johnson, they all are clearly to me one level better.

The question is whether or not Staal is on the level of Weber and Johnson.

For the record, I wouldn't trade Staal for Johnson, but there's no question that Johnson is the better prospect. The question with Johnson is whether or not he puts it all together and lives up to his potential, but if he does then he projects to be an elite, top 5 in the league kinda guy.

Staal, who is about as sure a thing as it gets in the world of prospects, projects quite comfortably into that #2 defensemen that is rock solid in his own end and chips in 30 to 35 points a year. If Staal really maxes out his offensive potential then maybe he becomes a legit number 1 who puts up 40 to 50 points while being a rock in his own end, but this is not likely. Even if Staal does really kick up the offense, he probably won't be ther terror that Johnson can be if he puts it all together, though it's also fair to think that Staal might always be the better defender.

 

[CharlieGirl]

Are you just completely oblivious to the quality D prospects that the Rangers currently have or what?

No, not at all, and that's not what I was implying. I was saying that Nashville's D prospects and young defensemen are unreal.

 

[DarthSather99]

No, not at all, and that's not what I was implying. I was saying that Nashville's D prospects and young defensemen are unreal.

must be tough with all those top 10 picks they had ...

 

[xander]

must be tough with all those top 10 picks they had ...

oh come on, lets not be bitter. Only one of they're dmen (Suter) was a top 10 pick.

 

[thedjpd]

oh come on, lets not be bitter. Only one of they're dmen (Suter) was a top 10 pick.

Agreed, and I think he's very overrated.

Weber is a beast, though. Phenomenal drafting.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

No, not at all, and that's not what I was implying. I was saying that Nashville's D prospects and young defensemen are unreal.

Seemed like you took a shot at the d depth of the team, but I guess not.

 

[Greg7]

My two favourite defense prospects from their draft at the time of the draft, and still now. It is a difficult decision; they are similar defensemen with similar strengths. Both are extremely intelligent in all zones, rock solid positionally, mobile, both have good size, both provide a physical presence, and both have upside as top four and possibly top pairing shutdown defensemen.

Staal is closer to the NHL right now imo, and currently better offensively, but I don't really think his offensive game is going to translate to the NHL remarkably well. Not that he won't pick up some points, I just think that he is going to primarily be a defensive defenseman. He can still pass the puck well and makes good decisions in all three zones which will help him generate a bit of offense, but the bottom line is that I think the offensive gap between Staal and Parent will narrow once they are both in the NHL. That said, I do think Staal still has a higher offensive upside than Parent, just not as much higher as a lot of people believe. Parent's biggest advantage over Staal is his elite skating. His agility, acceleration and speed in both directions, pivots, and stability are first class. Staal is good in all these areas, but Parent is excellent. Combined with his size, intelligence, positioning and in particular his outstanding angling, that skating should make him a perfect candidate for shutting down speedy forwards off the rush.

Well, I thought it out and still have trouble deciding. If forced, I guess would choose Staal because I think he is closer to the NHL right now, but I might as well be flipping a coin long term.

 

[nomorekids]

must be tough with all those top 10 picks they had ...

Shea Weber - second round(03)
Kevin Klein - second round(03)
Teemu Laakso - third round(05)
Cody Franson - third round(05)
Janne Niskala - fifth round(04)
Denis Kulyash -eighth round(04)


Dan Hamhuis- TWELTH overall(01

For the record, Ryan Parent was 18th overall in 05, as well.

Good thing we had all those top ten picks

 

[CapGoodie]

Staal hasn't been as impressive as he should have been this year, but I think he's had a little trouble getting up for another year of junior. Parent's been Parent, and I expect he'll be pretty much the same player with the same success in any league he plays in.

Parent is something of a curious skill-set. Absolutely beautiful skater, I mean his picture should be in the dictionary next to the perfect stride - yet he has virtually zero instincts in the offensive zone while playing immacualte in his own zone. One of the best defensive coverage guys you could ever ask for in his own end and brings a package of speed, mobility, and phyiscallity to that coverage that Marc Staal doesn't IMO.

Then the little issues start for Parent, who I'd have to disagree with anyone inisting he's a great first pass d-man. When the two were partnered in the WJC's these past two years they provided incredible play and dominant coverage in their own zone but Parent often had difficulties moving the puck. It was like night and day to the Bourdon-Letang pairing who at times got caught running around but moved the puck brilliantly when they got hold of it. Staal in both WJC's moved the puck better than Parent IMO, and does so fairly regularly in the OHL as well. Staal-Parent dominated without the puck at the WJC, but neither was great with it on their sticks although I'd only classify Parent as having stuggled at times.

Staal has more poise with the puck on his stick and is a big time phyiscal player, though not as nimble as PArent or as dominant with his defensive zone coverage (though were compairing two of the CHL's best in that regard). Staal has a little more young Rob Blake potential in him, Parent has a little more of what Cory Sarich would be if he had jet engines in his skates (a pretty unique combo for a pure defense first physical d-man).

I'd choose Staal over Parent, but it's a tough call. I expect Parent's tranistion to the NHL to be seemless while I expect Staal to struggle a little more with rookie mistakes but long term I'd say Staal.

Parent might be a better fit for Pitkanen down the road though....so I wouldn't worry about it if I were a Flyers fan. Parent is the kind of player who will free up a player like Pitkanen to explore his skills and make the rest of the game easier to play (see Drew Doughty for the kind of impact a guy like Parent can have on his partner).

 

[toastman344*]

For sure I would say Marc Staal...without thinking twice...