Marc Bergevin: Redemption Song Part 19

[Deebs]

I see the last real Bergy thread was closed, so here's a new one. If there is a new one, mods please merge.

LeBrun: Canadiens' Marc Bergevin praised for vision by NHL GMs, rival coaches impressed with team's play

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[Kriss E]

I see the last real Bergy thread was closed, so here's a new one. If there is a new one, mods please merge.

LeBrun: Canadiens' Marc Bergevin praised for vision by NHL GMs, rival coaches impressed with team's play

It's pretty pathetic how they're praising this incredible vision when we haven't won jack. What happens if we lose to COL/VGS in 5?
Not to take anything away from our performances so far, it's been impressive no doubt. But..the Leafs have choked in the first round time and time again I was told, and we still needed Price to be insane. The Jets were disappointing, no amount of trapping can really explain how bad they looked.
But as I said, kudos to our team. They played remarkably well since down 1-3 vs Leafs.

That being said, sending praise for this vision is a tad premature imo. Let us get through the next round first.

 

[beowulf]

It's pretty pathetic how they're praising this incredible vision when we haven't won jack. What happens if we lose to COL/VGS in 5?
Not to take anything away from our performances so far, it's been impressive no doubt. But..the Leafs have choked in the first round time and time again I was told, and we still needed Price to be insane. The Jets were disappointing, no amount of trapping can really explain how bad they looked.
But as I said, kudos to our team. They played remarkably well since down 1-3 vs Leafs.

That being said, sending praise for this vision is a tad premature imo. Let us get through the next round first.

Exactly, I will praise his vision and stuff when I see a 25th Cup banner.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Never forget he was 1 goal away twice to be fired , now he is praised

lmfao. Unless we win the cup , this season will be meaningless , becuase next season we won't be protected by the canadian border.

Enjoy the ride
Enjoy watching Caufield making god like plays , Suzuki growing up. KK getting tougher and rising his level . A bit more of Romanov perhaps? He played a good game in game 4.

I hope we think more about the future next offseason than re-signing the players we have right now and move on positively
Perhaps Bergevin should open his eyes for once and get actual offensive talent during the offeseason

 

[Saxon]

Promote him to president!!

 

[Censored Toad]

Never forget he was 1 goal away twice to be fired , now he is praised

lmfao. Unless we win the cup , this season will be meaningless , becuase next season we won't be protected by the canadian border.

Enjoy the ride
Enjoy watching Caufield making god like plays , Suzuki growing up. KK getting tougher and rising his level . A bit more of Romanov perhaps? He played a good game in game 4.

I hope we think more about the future next offseason than re-signing the players we have right now and move on positively

Umm your just a h8ter!! I got my pomp pomps out!! why cant you?!



If he wins the cup, I'll eat all the crow all those bergie ppl would like.

I hope , HOPE HOPE that I eat Crow. Leafs choked themselves out of the PO's Winnipeg isn't as good as us but the next series? Well that is gonna be something to watch.

Remember every season start, the habs come out flying only to sputter and fall. This is exactly what is happening again. All our guys are playing awesome (Which is great) but we've seen this before that they are STREAKY as STREAKY comes. They could continue winning but they are currently punching above the weight class. They could continue and I certainly hope they do. If they get swept by Col or Vegas in 4 games that is OK in my books. I had no expectation they would be this far!

This postseason was a huge asset for player development. From these games, we've learned that KK is a great player who steps up in the PO. We've learned that Philly D (although overpaid) is a super effective shut down player. Corey Perry has found a great niche on the 4th line and PP. The experience for Cole and Nick etc and to stuff a sock into all the price haters mouth. His contract is huge but if we ever decided to trade him, he still has mega value when he's motivated (Which I think he is right now hence the great play). Its been an amazing post season for them for sure.

The downside for me is More bargin bin.

Anyways, Go habs go and I hope they put out either Col or Vegas. Lets gooo boys!!! Drive for 25!!!! LETS DO THIS

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Umm your just a h8ter!! I got my pomp pomps out!! why cant you?!

If he wins the cup, I'll eat all the crow all those bergie ppl would like.

I hope , HOPE HOPE that I eat Crow. Leafs choked themselves out of the PO's Winnipeg isn't as good as us but the next series? Well that is gonna be something to watch.

Remember every season start, the habs come out flying only to sputter and fall. This is exactly what is happening again. All our guys are playing awesome (Which is great) but we've seen this before that they are STREAKY as STREAKY comes. They could continue winning but they are currently punching above the weight class. They could continue and I certainly hope they do. If they get swept by Col or Vegas in 4 games that is OK in my books. I had no expectation they would be this far!

This postseason was a huge asset for player development. From these games, we've learned that KK is a great player who steps up in the PO. We've learned that Philly D (although overpaid) is a super effective shut down player. Corey Perry has found a great niche on the 4th line and PP. The experience for Cole and Nick etc and to stuff a sock into all the price haters mouth. His contract is huge but if we ever decided to trade him, he still has mega value when he's motivated (Which I think he is right now hence the great play). Its been an amazing post season for them for sure.

The downside for me is More bargin bin.

Anyways, Go habs go and I hope they put out either Col or Vegas. Lets gooo boys!!! Drive for 25!!!! LETS DO THIS

Even if we ever win the cup , that wouldnt be because of Bergevin team. It will most likely because Price stopped 2 war machine and saved our ass. Seriously our D-squad played good against Winnipeg because Winnipeg did not even try anything , alteast Toronto when they dumped the puck they went for it.

Let's see where they go , im most likely happy for the future who are our best players rn

 

[Mudz]

Exactly, I will praise his vision and stuff when I see a 25th Cup banner.

Makes a lot of sense.

He wins the cup, he's a great gm. MTL lose in the finals, he's the worst gm ever, such a tool.

So logical. Now I get it.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Makes a lot of sense.

He wins the cup, he's a great gm. MTL lose in the finals, he's the worst gm ever, such a tool.

So logical. Now I get it.

dude he missed the playoffs 4 years in a row
He has 2 regular players in the lineup that he drafted in 9 years
The player that save his ass was drafted in 2005.
We needed a canadian division to barely make the playoffs.

I mean what's positive with his lineup? No 70 points scorer since his arrival I mean. Took him years to find top centers , still hasnt found a top LHD . Took him 5 years to find a backup for Price.

Man if you think his tenure is good enough for another extension , then no wonder why we have no stars in montreal.

 

[Habs Halifax]

It's pretty pathetic how they're praising this incredible vision when we haven't won jack. What happens if we lose to COL/VGS in 5?
Not to take anything away from our performances so far, it's been impressive no doubt. But..the Leafs have choked in the first round time and time again I was told, and we still needed Price to be insane. The Jets were disappointing, no amount of trapping can really explain how bad they looked.
But as I said, kudos to our team. They played remarkably well since down 1-3 vs Leafs.

That being said, sending praise for this vision is a tad premature imo. Let us get through the next round first.

Back handed complements type narrative. We are dong well but, but, but....

 

[beowulf]

Back handed complements type narrative. We are dong well but, but, but....

But it is the truth after almost a decade with him as GM, the team has made the 3rd round of the playoffs and nothing is won yet. The season was a short one and under normal circumstances I am not sure they even make the playoffs. As fans we can love the ride and love the way the team is currently playing but still not trust Bergevin as GM.

 

[Kriss E]

Back handed complements type narrative. We are dong well but, but, but....

Not surprised. Winning two rounds is like getting the cup to some.
Same mentality as ''we won therefore no changes to line up needed''...as if winning equates perfection.

 

[Habs Halifax]

dude he missed the playoffs 4 years in a row
He has 2 regular players in the lineup that he drafted in 9 years
The player that save his ass was drafted in 2005.
We needed a canadian division to barely make the playoffs.

I mean what's positive with his lineup? No 70 points scorer since his arrival I mean. Took him years to find top centers , still hasnt found a top LHD . Took him 5 years to find a backup for Price.

Man if you think his tenure is good enough for another extension , then no wonder why we have no stars in montreal.

Just drop it. He's not the idiot many of you were trying to say he is years ago. Not a genius GM but certainly has groomed into a solid one. He got us here to this point without mortgaging the future. His retool/reset is going according to plan. Some of you need to come to grips that Molson didn't fire him in 2016/2017 and move on from it

I find the Bergevin debate war is a major distraction and it's stupid. Nobody wins that debate. What is clear as day is he has learned from mistakes but that is in the past. The last thing we need to do is make a change for the sake of it and hire another GM that learns on the job. There is only so many good ones to hire.

Pressure needs to be on Molson to change his title to CEO and hire a President who can bridge the business and hockey operations. That's where our focus should be and we all need to drop the Bergevin hate or like narrative. We are where we are today and our youth is solid and the vets are still around.

 

[Habs Halifax]

But it is the truth after almost a decade with him as GM, the team has made the 3rd round of the playoffs and nothing is won yet. The season was a short one and under normal circumstances I am not sure they even make the playoffs. As fans we can love the ride and love the way the team is currently playing but still not trust Bergevin as GM.

I don't care about the past. I care about where we are today. Even without a final 4 result, I like our youth core and how it's shaping up and our vets are still around to groom them.

It's not about like or hate Bergevin with me. He's made mistakes but has clearly learned and adapted. We need to move on from the past

 

[ottawa]

Just drop it. He's not the idiot many of you were trying to say he is years ago. Not a genius GM but certainly has groomed into a solid one. He got us here to this point without mortgaging the future. His retool/reset is going according to plan. Some of you need to come to grips that Molson didn't fire him in 2016/2017 and move on from it

I find the Bergevin debate war is a major distraction and it's stupid. Nobody wins that debate. What is clear as day is he has learned from mistakes but that is in the past. The last thing we need to do is make a change for the sake of it and hire another GM that learns on the job. There is only so many good ones to hire.

Pressure needs to be on Molson to change his title to CEO and hire a President who can bridge the business and hockey operations. That's where our focus should be and we all need to drop the Bergevin hate or like narrative. We are where we are today and our youth is solid and the vets are still around.

You didn't actually address any of the points he made - which were all very good.

I don't care about the past. I care about where we are today

I care about the future more than I care about the past or the current cinderella run we're on, we're headed for another decade of failure if we keep Bergevin

 

[beowulf]

Just drop it. He's not the idiot many of you were trying to say he is years ago. Not a genius GM but certainly has groomed into a solid one. He got us here to this point without mortgaging the future. His retool/reset is going according to plan. Some of you need to come to grips that Molson didn't fire him in 2016/2017 and move on from it

I find the Bergevin debate war is a major distraction and it's stupid. Nobody wins that debate. What is clear as day is he has learned from mistakes but that is in the past. The last thing we need to do is make a change for the sake of it and hire another GM that learns on the job. There is only so many good ones to hire.

Pressure needs to be on Molson to change his title to CEO and hire a President who can bridge the business and hockey operations. That's where our focus should be and we all need to drop the Bergevin hate or like narrative. We are where we are today and our youth is solid and the vets are still around.

And as a paying fan, I have the right to complain because the guy is not up to snuff. He learns from old mistakes but constantly makes new ones....If he is around this off-season, it will be an interesting one to see what he does and if he truly has learned. With a number of UFAs and a flat cap, we shall see if he can improve the team or not.

 

[Habs Halifax]

You didn't actually address any of the points he made - which were all very good.

I care about the future, we're headed for another decade of failure if we keep Bergevin

You think those points were good cause you don't like Bergevin as our GM.

The reset/retool is on a good track. You can't tell me you don't like the youth core and how we still have vets around to mentor them. I'm trying to play middle ground here and as a result, I'm going to get labeled a supporter or lover. Reality

Give me your concerns in point form on how Bergevin is going to have us fail for another 10 years? Do you really think he is a human that can't learn from mistakes? Come on

What moves do you hate that he made since the retool/reset?

 

[beowulf]

You think those points were good cause you don't like Bergevin as our GM.

The reset/retool is on a good track. You can't tell me you don't like the youth core and how we still have vets around to mentor them. I'm trying to play middle ground here and as a result, I'm going to get labeled a supporter or lover. Reality

Give me your concerns in point form on how Bergevin is going to have us fail for another 10 years? Do you really think he is a human that can't learn from mistakes? Come on

What moves do you hate that he made since the retool/reset?

Which of the retool/resets? He has more than one....

 

[Habs Halifax]

Not surprised. Winning two rounds is like getting the cup to some.
Same mentality as ''we won therefore no changes to line up needed''...as if winning equates perfection.

The general feeling would be horrible if we lost game 5 to the Leafs. I get that. I'm personally not trying to pump up the final 4 but you will try to say I am. Lets set that aside.

What moves do you hate from the Reset/Retool point in time? Or are you going to rehash things prior to that when he was trending low and Molson didn't fire him? Can you tell me with a straight face that he has not learned from mistakes?

The real issue here is Molson didn't fire him in 2016 or 2017 cause he was extended and his next contract didn't start yet. Molson allowed him to learn on the job. We all need to get past that and look at what he has done since his retool/reset.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Which of the retool/resets? He has more than one....

I think you know the point in time I am talking about. Don't be disingenuous. If you don't know, I'm not having this conversation with you. Bergevin spoke to his reset/retool and I feel confident you know that point in time

 

[MSLs absurd thighs]

We shall see this summer if he's learned anything from 2014, where he spent the offseason after a promising playoffs run shuffling deck chairs on the Titanic instead of adding the missing piece.

 

[Habs Halifax]

And as a paying fan, I have the right to complain because the guy is not up to snuff. He learns from old mistakes but constantly makes new ones....If he is around this off-season, it will be an interesting one to see what he does and if he truly has learned. With a number of UFAs and a flat cap, we shall see if he can improve the team or not.

This is the important part I feel some of you will not want to consider or debate in good faith... Prove me wrong

What moves do you think he has made since his retool/reset that would be evidence to you in supporting he has not learned from his mistakes and the same mistakes will be made? I'm not saying there isn't any. I'm asking a genuine question cause this to me is the important part. The 2016/2017 point in time was his low point but our Owner/President didn't fire him. That was the right time but he didn't even start his extension at that point. So if you are not happy about that, blame Molson for not wanting to write off $25M+.

If you are not willing to evaluate it fairly in terms of Bergevin making adjustments, I feel your frustrations with him from the past are clouding your true judgement or willingness to set that aside and look at it as a whole today. I feel confident in saying that if Bergevin is gone, the new GM would love his starting point

I need to see new evidence to support that he has not learned from past mistakes and he will make the same ones in the future

 

[Miller Time]

you'd swear that some have a deep emotional tie or connection to MB lol

where was all this praise and celebrating of his success when the team was teetering on the edge of missing the playoffs?

hanifin not getting hurt when he does, and the flames likely extinguish the season, leaving him firmly on the firing block. 8 wins, as fun as they are, doesn't fundamentally change anything about the work and decision making behind it. Good for him and great for us that lady luck showed up at just the right time... enjoy the ride!

 

[beowulf]

I think you know the point in time I am talking about.

Mistakes from last offseason to now,
Anderson's contract - the length in particular. I don't mind the trade but $5.5M for another 6 years ouch...
Not finding a puck moving LHD, hasn't found one since Markov left.
Merrill trade, thankfully it didn't cost much but was really a useless move, rather have the 5th
Same with Gustafsson, thankfully a UFA after the season but his offence is overshadowed by his bad defense.
Drouin trade comes back to haunt the team yet again with his 2 goals and him out and the need for the guy he was traded for on D
$4M of dead cap thanks to Alzner signing and buyout.

Good moves
Signing Toffoli, especially with a good contract that should not hamstring the team in the coming years.
Perry for the taxi squad which turned out way better than anyone could have imagined so far.
The extension for Allen

Neutral
Allen, nice to see a quality backup/1B but the cap his this season was an issue that the team was barely able to manage.
Edmundson, overall liked his play but he was not the type of dman the team needed.

 

[Kriss E]

The general feeling would be horrible if we lost game 5 to the Leafs. I get that. I'm personally not trying to pump up the final 4 but you will try to say I am. Lets set that aside.

What moves do you hate from the Reset/Retool point in time? Or are you going to rehash things prior to that when he was trending low and Molson didn't fire him? Can you tell me with a straight face that he has not learned from mistakes?

The real issue here is Molson didn't fire him in 2016 or 2017 cause he was extended and his next contract didn't start yet. Molson allowed him to learn on the job. We all need to get past that and look at what he has done since his retool/reset.

Can you wait until this team actually accomplishes something before making all your claims? You've been saying this for a while and if we played under normal circumstances, just off points, we don't even make the POs this year.
If it weren't for COVID, we also miss out on some of the roster changes we were able to do.
Good on Bergevin for recognizing the opportunities and taking advantage of them.
Praising him though as some visionary, especially now where we still didn't play another division yet, is premature for me.

The Northern division was weak AF. What was said before this season even started? Aside from the Leafs, it's wide open. So we almost shot ourselves in the foot keeping KK-Co on the sideline to start that series, they lost Tavares, Price played Conn Smythe level. We end up getting through them in an epic comeback, freaking great.
The Jets have not been impressive all year, sweeping them was impressive nonetheless though.

So things look pretty good right now but pump the breaks a bit. We didn't win f*** all.
Again, what will you say about that vision if we lose in the next round?
A team that wouldn't have made the POs under normal circumstances loses the moment they play out of their weak division. So awesome.
Maybe we will go through, I f***ing hope we will, but until that happens I'm not gonna sing praises to Bergey.