Discussion in 'Montreal Canadiens' started by Doc McKenna, Aug 17, 2017.
Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression and Acceptance
Currently, the fanbase is going through denial and anger simultaneously. And as many like to call him BargainBin, then I'd say bargaining was the stage that set it all off. It should be first.
It's been a bad off-season, for sure. I don't have much faith in Clod. We shouldn't confuse the relief of losing that dummy Therrien with any good from Clod... he was effectively brutal and our team scored even less when he took over. Our showing in the first round was poor and it felt like the team was skating uphill.
All that said, we have Carey Price so no one will turn on the bargaining GM for some time. And maybe Drouin will really surprise. And Chucky has a fair bit to prove. We'll see.
I want the Habs to win and be good but I'm convinced that everything needs to change before it happens. From Timmins to Sly in the AHL to the entire roster. For the first time in a long time the Habs haven't made incremental upward progress and have actually trended down. Gainey's era was all about that upward progress. Now? Not at all. No good rookies coming up and the team lost a lot of talent.
The Hockey News
#NHL teams: Wins over past five seasons
What are you grieving for exactly?
Do the same thing with playoff series won please.
Regular season doesn't matter. Are the Rangers as good as the Pens Hawks, Kings? Are the current bruins same level as the habs? Why count the past 5 seasons when we have 1 Dman that was on our team from 2016 ONE, and not a single dman that the habs developed.
11th out of 26 teams. Not as good as the regular season record but still in the top half. Its not like we are completly at the bottom in playoff wins.
Interesting enough kings miss playoffs twice (though they won a cup) Bruins missed twice, Preds missed twice, and TBL missed twice. SJS missed once like the habs.
4 out of the 11 teams ahead of us missed the playoffs at least once and have no cup to show for it. I guess its nice to make a long run but in the end 1st round exit or SCF exit no cup is no cup.
Yeah we are awesome!
PO wins over the last 5 years:
Preds 23 14 of those wins this year.
Should it not worry you that they are then out performing us even more given this context. And 10 of those 19 came in a single year leaving 9 for the other 4 years. Slightly over 2 wins/year in the post season* On average
That means we are barely making a game 6 with a first round exit each year.*On Average
It took the Preds one playoff run to surpass our successes(or lack there of) over the last 5 seasons.
Remind me how this is acceptable?
wow they really stunk when Weber was their captain and anchor on D.
And we just stink no matter who anchors our D lol.
Subban and we went to ECF
Weber 2 wins this spring. (Very close to what the preds achieved with him.) And we are worse on D going into next year
The Preds had a great PO run this year what's your point? They had 9 PO wins in the 4 previous years.
The picture can be different next year at the same time of the year.
Yeah, they didn't advance last year because of Weber, it had nothing to with Forsberg's 4 points in 14 games and Arvidsson's 2 points in 14 games. It was all Weber's fault.
That might not be a bad thing, in the end.
Really comparable sample sizes. One year with the Habs for Weber and, let's just say, somewhat more than one year for Subban...
Forsberg was 21 years old.
It was literally Arvidsson's rookie season.
You're focusing on those two instead of the captain? You might have had people agreeing with you if you brought up Ribeiro.
weber and subban were a wash in the first year. because the preds made the final isnt all because of subban. get a grip
Regarding Weber. I feel in Nashville he was treated similar to how Subban was treated in MTL. Both went to arbitration, Nashville not wanting to pay up despite labeling him one of the best in the league at the time. The difference is MTL paid Subban last minute instead of actually going through with the 1 year deal.
The next year Weber wanted out. I figure he wasn't pleased they wouldn't give him fair value and to make matters worse, he was in his prime when Nashville was looking at a rebuild(hence their young players today). His agent is on record saying he doesn't want to go through a rebuild at that stage of his career.
Nashville decided to keep him and he endured rebuilding years, the only reason they had some success was their pipeline of prospects, Weber and Rinne in his prime.
When all was said and done and Nashville finally had a good young team...they traded him. I don't blame them, they got a younger player who will make them contend longer. If I'm Weber, that pretty much sucks.
So we look at Weber, see his poor playoff record in Nashville but that's also a result of where they were in contending. Weber's contract kicked in 2012-13. Nashville was one of the worst in the league, 2013-14 they weren't a playoff team. 2014-15 they were 3rd in conference followed by 7th the next season(where Nashville made 2nd round in playoffs mind you.)
They kept him during his prime for no reason and were smart to trade him when they had an option for a younger equally(arguably better) talent. So Weber got a little screwed but that's business I guess.
The grieving is due to a GM who came on board with excellent young pieces such as pacioretty, subban, and price (followed by the immediate drafting of galchenyuk), only to be left 5 years later with the same players either moving on (subban), or players not expected to get any better (price, pacioretty), and in chucky's case, a player that has yet to prove himself at a position that the habs desperately need help.
It feels like a team trying hard to maintain their competitive status as opposed to a team that is primed for a jump into the upper echelon of Stanley Cup threats.
Its about not being able to insulate those pieces well enough over the years when the team was on the rise. The thought of not capitalizing with these assets, and the realization that the best chance to turn into a long term contender is to start again is sobering.
In his 8 seasons in the NHL, Subban went to the ECF twice and to the Stanley Cup finals once. All on teams that were kinda overachieving.
At some point, you have to accept that there's a pattern and not just pure luck.
OK so Subban on teams : 17 wins in montreal and 14 wins in Nashville.
Weber 9 Nashville and 2 Habs
Subban 31 Playoff wins in last 5 years (Including missing 2015-2016 season entirely, price and subban injured)
Weber 11 Playoff wins in last 5 years. (Including missing 2 seasons 2012-2014)
Just to simplify.
And yes I do understand they aren't the only players on the ice, but since we are comparing, lets just compare how each players team did while EACH PLAYER was on said team
Separate names with a comma.