Marc Bergevin: 5 stages of grief edition

Discussion in 'Montreal Canadiens' started by Doc McKenna, Aug 17, 2017.

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  1. Doc McKenna

    Doc McKenna Registered User

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    Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression and Acceptance

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Adam Michaels

    Adam Michaels Registered User

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    Currently, the fanbase is going through denial and anger simultaneously. And as many like to call him BargainBin, then I'd say bargaining was the stage that set it all off. It should be first.
     
  3. WhiskeySeven*

    WhiskeySeven* Expect the expected

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    It's been a bad off-season, for sure. I don't have much faith in Clod. We shouldn't confuse the relief of losing that dummy Therrien with any good from Clod... he was effectively brutal and our team scored even less when he took over. Our showing in the first round was poor and it felt like the team was skating uphill.

    All that said, we have Carey Price so no one will turn on the bargaining GM for some time. And maybe Drouin will really surprise. And Chucky has a fair bit to prove. We'll see.

    I want the Habs to win and be good but I'm convinced that everything needs to change before it happens. From Timmins to Sly in the AHL to the entire roster. For the first time in a long time the Habs haven't made incremental upward progress and have actually trended down. Gainey's era was all about that upward progress. Now? Not at all. No good rookies coming up and the team lost a lot of talent.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2017
  4. JAPPO

    JAPPO previously Goalchenyuk

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    The Hockey News

    @TheHockeyNews

    #NHL teams: Wins over past five seasons

    Pens 228
    Blues 227
    Ducks 227
    Hawks 227
    Caps 221
    Rangers 218
    Habs 210
    Bruins 209
    Sharks 208

    :shakehead
     
  5. Fozz

    Fozz Registered User

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    What are you grieving for exactly?
     
  6. King In Glory

    King In Glory Getting Schwifty

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    Do the same thing with playoff series won please.
     
  7. Doc McKenna

    Doc McKenna Registered User

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    Regular season doesn't matter. Are the Rangers as good as the Pens Hawks, Kings? Are the current bruins same level as the habs? Why count the past 5 seasons when we have 1 Dman that was on our team from 2016 ONE, and not a single dman that the habs developed. :shakehead
     
  8. scrubadam

    scrubadam Registered User

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    Pens 48
    CHI 46
    NYR 36
    Ducks 34
    LA 26
    SJS 26
    TBL 25
    Bruins 23
    Caps 23
    Preds 23
    STL 22
    MTL 19

    11th out of 26 teams. Not as good as the regular season record but still in the top half. Its not like we are completly at the bottom in playoff wins.

    Interesting enough kings miss playoffs twice (though they won a cup) Bruins missed twice, Preds missed twice, and TBL missed twice. SJS missed once like the habs.

    4 out of the 11 teams ahead of us missed the playoffs at least once and have no cup to show for it. I guess its nice to make a long run but in the end 1st round exit or SCF exit no cup is no cup.
     
  9. King In Glory

    King In Glory Getting Schwifty

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    Yeah we are awesome!

    www.imgur.com/pXhlfH9
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2017
  10. Belial

    Belial Registered User

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    PO wins over the last 5 years:

    Pens 48
    Hawks 46
    Rangers 36
    Ducks 34
    Kings 26
    Sharks 26
    Tampa 25
    Boston 23
    Caps 23
    Preds 23 14 of those wins this year.
    Blues 22
    Habs 19
     
  11. Doc McKenna

    Doc McKenna Registered User

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    Should it not worry you that they are then out performing us even more given this context. And 10 of those 19 came in a single year leaving 9 for the other 4 years. Slightly over 2 wins/year in the post season* On average

    That means we are barely making a game 6 with a first round exit each year.*On Average
     
  12. King In Glory

    King In Glory Getting Schwifty

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    It took the Preds one playoff run to surpass our successes(or lack there of) over the last 5 seasons.
    Remind me how this is acceptable?

    [​IMG]
     
  13. Doc McKenna

    Doc McKenna Registered User

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    wow they really stunk when Weber was their captain and anchor on D. :popcorn:
     
  14. DangerDave

    DangerDave Suzuki's Sidekick

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    And we just stink no matter who anchors our D lol.
     
  15. Doc McKenna

    Doc McKenna Registered User

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    Subban and we went to ECF
    Weber 2 wins this spring. (Very close to what the preds achieved with him.) And we are worse on D going into next year :cry:
     
  16. Bryson

    Bryson #EugeneMolson

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    :handclap:
     
  17. Belial

    Belial Registered User

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    The Preds had a great PO run this year what's your point? They had 9 PO wins in the 4 previous years.

    The picture can be different next year at the same time of the year.

    Yeah, they didn't advance last year because of Weber, it had nothing to with Forsberg's 4 points in 14 games and Arvidsson's 2 points in 14 games. It was all Weber's fault.
     
  18. Scriptor

    Scriptor Registered User

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    That might not be a bad thing, in the end. ;)
     
  19. Scriptor

    Scriptor Registered User

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    Really comparable sample sizes. One year with the Habs for Weber and, let's just say, somewhat more than one year for Subban...:sarcasm:
     
  20. Captain Subban

    Captain Subban Registered User

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    Forsberg was 21 years old.

    It was literally Arvidsson's rookie season.

    You're focusing on those two instead of the captain? You might have had people agreeing with you if you brought up Ribeiro.
     
  21. glenbuis

    glenbuis Registered User

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    weber and subban were a wash in the first year. because the preds made the final isnt all because of subban. get a grip
     
  22. LyricalLyricist

    LyricalLyricist Retired

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    Regarding Weber. I feel in Nashville he was treated similar to how Subban was treated in MTL. Both went to arbitration, Nashville not wanting to pay up despite labeling him one of the best in the league at the time. The difference is MTL paid Subban last minute instead of actually going through with the 1 year deal.

    The next year Weber wanted out. I figure he wasn't pleased they wouldn't give him fair value and to make matters worse, he was in his prime when Nashville was looking at a rebuild(hence their young players today). His agent is on record saying he doesn't want to go through a rebuild at that stage of his career.

    Nashville decided to keep him and he endured rebuilding years, the only reason they had some success was their pipeline of prospects, Weber and Rinne in his prime.

    When all was said and done and Nashville finally had a good young team...they traded him. I don't blame them, they got a younger player who will make them contend longer. If I'm Weber, that pretty much sucks.

    So we look at Weber, see his poor playoff record in Nashville but that's also a result of where they were in contending. Weber's contract kicked in 2012-13. Nashville was one of the worst in the league, 2013-14 they weren't a playoff team. 2014-15 they were 3rd in conference followed by 7th the next season(where Nashville made 2nd round in playoffs mind you.)

    They kept him during his prime for no reason and were smart to trade him when they had an option for a younger equally(arguably better) talent. So Weber got a little screwed but that's business I guess.
     
  23. Hackett

    Hackett BAKAMAN

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    The grieving is due to a GM who came on board with excellent young pieces such as pacioretty, subban, and price (followed by the immediate drafting of galchenyuk), only to be left 5 years later with the same players either moving on (subban), or players not expected to get any better (price, pacioretty), and in chucky's case, a player that has yet to prove himself at a position that the habs desperately need help.

    It feels like a team trying hard to maintain their competitive status as opposed to a team that is primed for a jump into the upper echelon of Stanley Cup threats.

    Its about not being able to insulate those pieces well enough over the years when the team was on the rise. The thought of not capitalizing with these assets, and the realization that the best chance to turn into a long term contender is to start again is sobering.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2017
  24. Brainiac

    Brainiac Registered Offender

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    In his 8 seasons in the NHL, Subban went to the ECF twice and to the Stanley Cup finals once. All on teams that were kinda overachieving.

    At some point, you have to accept that there's a pattern and not just pure luck.
     
  25. Doc McKenna

    Doc McKenna Registered User

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    OK so Subban on teams : 17 wins in montreal and 14 wins in Nashville.
    Weber 9 Nashville and 2 Habs

    Subban 31 Playoff wins in last 5 years (Including missing 2015-2016 season entirely, price and subban injured)
    Weber 11 Playoff wins in last 5 years. (Including missing 2 seasons 2012-2014)

    Just to simplify.

    And yes I do understand they aren't the only players on the ice, but since we are comparing, lets just compare how each players team did while EACH PLAYER was on said team
     
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