Marc-Andre Fleury

Discussion in 'National Hockey League Talk' started by sanitysrequiem, Apr 16, 2018.

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  1. HowsUrBreath

    HowsUrBreath Nostalgia... STOP DWELLING ON THE PAST

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    never liked him

    people make excuses for his failures because he's a very nice guy

    some of the most critical writers and radio guys in town even make excuses for him, because he's so nice

    it's "never" his fault

    he's the guy at work that's lazy or screws up all the time, but it gets ignored or he even gets promoted because the boss thinks he's fun to hang out with

    the more i think about it, i hate his guts

    pens win back to back cups when he gets benched after years of underachieving, gee what a coincidence...
     
  2. HowsUrBreath

    HowsUrBreath Nostalgia... STOP DWELLING ON THE PAST

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    guy is thought as the weak link for years, but yeah sure lets put him in the hall of fame...
     
  3. seafoam

    seafoam Registered User Sponsor

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    I think he's definitely turned a corner in the last ~2 years or so.

    It's not unordinary for goalies to actually get better with age.

    Love MAF, he's such a likable guy.
     
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  4. Sens of Anarchy

    Sens of Anarchy Registered User

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    Showing up Big Time... Who doesn't like Flower
     
  5. HowsUrBreath

    HowsUrBreath Nostalgia... STOP DWELLING ON THE PAST

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    all the locker room pranks makes him seem annoying too

    some players say guys like that help loosen up the team, that's funny considering he was by far the tightest during big games
     
  6. ImporterExporter

    ImporterExporter I troll harder than Poppy

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    First bold. I love this one. Still makes me chuckle to this day. The Flyers series is 99% on MAF. What. A. Load. Of. ****. He was putrid, no doubt about it. But in case you don't remember, so was the entire ****ing team. That was the height of Dan Bylsma being a moron who had lost the team completely. Sid was a whiny *****. Letang and company were pathetic. The defense repeatedly let the Flyers have glorious chance after glorious chance. You would have needed Pat Roy or Jacques Plante to stand a chance at getting out of that round.

    Second bold part. Did you watch that playoff run? MAF was Conn Smythe great that year. You're picking out 1 damn goal from a run all the way to the Cup finals against a far superior team. You think he's the only goalie to ever knock a puck into his own net? Or 2? I'll save you the trouble. He isn't.

    MAF was a headcase from 2010 to 2013 specifically. I never said otherwise. But where else was he the main reason for our failures? I'll save you the trouble again. He wasn't. We're not in the finals in 2008 if it weren't for MAF. We probably lose the Cup in 2009 if MAF doesn't have a huge game 6 and 7 in back to back wins. Not to mention, how many goalies get across to make that save against Lidstrom? Do you honestly think the Pens would have won that game if it had gone to OT?

    People on the Pens board were willing to **** on him any chance they got, but when he did play out of his mind didn't get near the same adulation from the masses. Pot meet kettle. I've been on these forums for a long time. I saw it repeatedly, year after year.

    And FTR, I was one of the very few (count on one hand) who said MAF would waive and the Pens wouldn't trade or loose Matt Murray, under any circumstance. And I agreed with the decision 100%. But it was hilarious (and frankly sad) to watch Pens fans **** on MAF simply because of paranoia. That's where I lost a lot of respect for certain posters. I'm not some fair weather facebook fan who loves MAF simply because he was a great guy. The dude was a major reason why we were able to celebrate multiple Cups. Yes, he had a bad stretch there over a few seasons (many players have also dealt with this). He deserved a lot of critisism. As did Sid, Geno, the coaching staff, Ray Shero, etc. 2010 to 2013 specifcally was on the entire Pens org. Selling MAF down the river without the rest of the idiots is a cop out and lazy analysis.
     
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  7. HowsUrBreath

    HowsUrBreath Nostalgia... STOP DWELLING ON THE PAST

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    why wouldn't they? the pens outplayed the wings in most of that series, sounds to me you weren't as confident in fleury as you claim because why else would you think the wings would win in OT?

    he was the weak link, coach sullivan agrees which is why when he had one bad game in the playoffs last year he didn't hesitate to replace him

    pens scored a ton of goals against philly in 2012, putting the blame on any player but fleury is wrong

    your name calling is just proof of how people are personally biased towards him because he is so "nice"
     
  8. MetalheadPenguinsFan

    MetalheadPenguinsFan Disco Is Dead!!!

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    Oh bull****. There were and are plenty of people who love Fleury and always have. Hell there are tons of people on Facebook who still think we should have kept him over Murray. Fleury was (and probably still is) one of the most beloved athletes in Pittsburgh. Just look at the ovation when he came back to Pittsburgh this past season for the first time.

    All this post of yours is is a pathetic thinly veiled disguised potshot at the Pens fanbase.
     
  9. BeastMode

    BeastMode Miro-acle

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    If MAF ends up in the HHOF then Osgood would have to be as well which will allow every goalie without any individual award to gain access.
     
  10. Dying Alive

    Dying Alive Phil = 2x Champ

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    :rolleyes:


    Try having some idea what you're talking about. MAF is one of the most universally liked & respected athletes in Pittsburgh sports history, and this town has a lot of sports history.
     
  11. nbonaddio

    nbonaddio BELLOWS: THE BEST

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    True, except Fleury will have more wins, more All-Star appearances, more medals, a better career save percentage (even era-adjusted), and a better career GAA (ditto). But yeah, they're the same.
     
  12. MetalheadPenguinsFan

    MetalheadPenguinsFan Disco Is Dead!!!

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    Umm, you do know he didn't play in the 2015-16 playoffs until he was subbed in for Murray in the 3rd period in game 4 of the ECF (vs. Tampa) because of post concussion syndrome right?? He then started game 5 of that series and lost it 4-3 in OT, prompting us to stick with Murray the rest of the way.

    And last year he won 9 out of the 15 games he played in before Murray came back from injury.

    He was a huge reason why we got that back to back Cup win last year.
     
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  13. billybudd

    billybudd 1for the other thumb

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    I'm willing to entertain the idea that Bylsma did something to Flower's confidence (though it's more likely Gilles Meloche is simply an incompetent goaltending coach), but the bolded is absolutely not the case. Flower was letting in unscreened floaters from 50 feet and throwing off-net shots into the net. There's no defensive configuration designed to stop the types of chances that were beating him.
     
  14. ImporterExporter

    ImporterExporter I troll harder than Poppy

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    Weak link? LOL. The Pens aren't even playing in the Conference Finals last year if it werent' for MAF. Way to focus on 1 game there bub. Matt Murray was the starting goalie and healthy then. I agreed with Sullivan putting him back in there. Doesn't take away at all from the impact Fleury had in the first two rounds. Not giving MAF huge props for him holding the fort down until Murray got healthy is pathetic.

    Pens also played no defense against Philly. Took a slew of moronic penalties. Putting all the blame on MAF is wrong.

    I didn't name call anywhere btw. Feel free to report me otherwise and I'm sure the mods will tell you the same thing. I'm not biased in any manner. I simply choose to respect the player for the good he did over the course of 13 years. MAF was a big reason why the Pens were able to win multiple Cups. Sure he had a big hand in some postseason flops but acting like he's the sole reason for the Pens failures between 2010 and 2013 is ridiculous. Personally I put a ton of blame on Ray Shero and Dan Bylsma. Because MAF was plenty good once those clowns were finally sent packing.
     
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  15. bukwas

    bukwas Stanley Cup 2022

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    I'll give a round of applause to Mr. Fleury. :clap:
    He's earned it.
     
  16. molon labe

    molon labe Registered User

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    Great season in Vegas - something every Pens fan was hoping for. Twitter dolly's were hoping for more than that - most post on their social media pages daily describing how desperate this organization needs him back.

    I hope he has a great time there - and even some success (barring it is not against the Pens) - but, if we're being rational here can we wait until he plays a team with some offensive capability? Keeping games close against the Kings is more of their doing and less of anyone elses'... that's been their MO for years. He also played lights out last playoffs for us until...he didn't (he also had a horrendous start to the season..similar to MM this year but less criticized)-- He had that putrid start against Ottawa ...something Pens fans were all too familiar with. You're talking a top 10 goalie on a good day, but who on a bad day tries way too hard to do too much and has mental collapses. THAT is what Pens fans criticized and rightfully so. To say the fans hated him for some unstated reason is just a fallacy. If he finally got over that, good for MAF.

    Would be something worth discussing had we not had a goalie of MM's caliber in the pipe to replace. MAF was never abandoned here, he was replaced with someone who got the job done, was up and coming, cheaper, younger, and built more for a system like Sully's Pens. MAF is a goalie who would have been great on a team like the Kings or Blues all these years - coaches who may get hemmed in their own zone, but would have a goalie who could cover the crease on cross-ice passes in a blitz.
     
  17. Sidney the Kidney

    Sidney the Kidney 3-Peat + 1

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    I think how Fleury does in Vegas will go a long way toward cementing his legacy. If he does well in Vegas, the one knock on him (playing for a dominant team) can't be used as the catch-all argument against his success.
     
  18. BlueBrunswick

    BlueBrunswick Registered User

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    I don't know if Fleury gets into the Hall, but there really isn't a comparison between he and Osgood - Osgood retired at 38 with 401 wins, Fleury has more than that now and is only 33. Realistically, he'll play another 4 or 5 years, even if he only gives you two more years as a starter - that's probably 70 wins, and three years as a serviceable backup for another 45 wins. He's going to retire with 500 wins, and maybe close to 550 wins - a 150 win differential is pretty steep. Of the course of his career, he's put up above average numbers, not every year, but on a whole... he's career numbers may look a little better, if the Pens hadn't brought him up as a 19 year old. He payed about 70 games over those first few years for a terrible team, finished last in the league the first year and second last the second year... those 70 games got him 17 wins - but that pain did get them Crosby.
     
  19. Riptide

    Riptide Registered User Sponsor

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    Many many Pens fans said that he'd do very very well once he was away from Pittsburgh. The success he's having in LV isn't really a surprise. I'm happy (for multiple reasons) that he had a great playoffs last year, and I'm happy that he's followed that up by having a great season and so far a great post season in LV.
     
  20. Riptide

    Riptide Registered User Sponsor

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    And yet the reality was that the team in front of him was never good or deep enough to really be a true contender (yes I know they were always labelled as such). And if they were good/deep enough, then they played like ****. But yes, it was always MAFs fault. Pittsburgh only scores 3 goals in 3 games... yep all MAFs fault.
     
  21. ImporterExporter

    ImporterExporter I troll harder than Poppy

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    Hockey is a team sport, period. It's why all these fancy WAR like stats are hard to get a read on and simply don't matter nearly as much, like they do in baseball. Very rarely can you ever put all the blame on one guy. If a goalie gives up a goal you need to look at the entire sequence leading up to that goal. It's very likely one (or more) skater made a mistake that led to a glorious chance. Yes, goalies let in bad goals. MAF let in plenty over 13 years, but acting like he was somehow the ultimate king at this or was alone in that "statistic" is absurd.

    And guess what?

    From the 2013-14 postseason until now MAF has 1062 saves on 1149 shots. That's a .924 SV%. I wouldn't say elite, but that's a number you can certainly win with most nights out. MAF hasn't been a legit liability in 5 years now. If all you want to do is focus on the 4 year stretch from 2010-2013 then you folks are the ones who are showing TRUE bias.
     
  22. ZeroPucksGiven

    ZeroPucksGiven Registered User

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    MAF #1 Fan

     
  23. BeastMode

    BeastMode Miro-acle

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    Fine then replace Osgood with Barrasso, you know his Vezina, Calder and 2 Stanley Cups. However please lets continue to talk about ASG's as a determining fact to hall worthy. Hell if you wanna throw longevity in as a defense then what about Mike Vernon who played 20 seasons, won 2 cups, a Conn Smythe and appeared in 5 of those deciding factor ASG's.

    The fact remains is that MAF is NOT better than some goalies that are on the outside looking in regarding the HHOF.
     
  24. HowsUrBreath

    HowsUrBreath Nostalgia... STOP DWELLING ON THE PAST

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    uh yeah i know that, what does that have to do with winning the cup with fleury on the bench

    9 out of 15? that's a bit short of the 16 you need to win the cup
     
  25. HowsUrBreath

    HowsUrBreath Nostalgia... STOP DWELLING ON THE PAST

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    why did the team look good when vokoun replaced him against the islanders?

    how convenient and what a coincidence the team gets "good and deep enough" when murray becomes the goalie
     

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