Management Thread | Is a Reckoning coming?

[logan5]

We've been hearing about crap contracts coming off the books for about a half decade now, to free up cap space.

And yet here we are.

Cap space. It matters.

If we can have a normal conversation for a bit here... For the new GM, is it not a fact that most of these bad contracts/buyouts/recapture come off the books next year and the year after? IMO that is fairly manageable for the new GM and shouldn’t hinder him too much.

 

[arttk]

If we can have a normal conversation for a bit here... For the new GM, is it not a fact that most of these bad contracts/buyouts/recapture come off the books next year and the year after? IMO that is fairly manageable for the new GM and shouldn’t hinder him too much.

This off season, we need to extend Hughes and Petey.
Next off season, we need to extend Boeser and his qualifier starts at 7.5?
The one after, Miller and Horvat and Hog and Ratbone.
Hughes and Petey will need extending because they will likey be on 3 year bridge oh and Pods need renew.
Demko the season after.
Bascially we will have massive salary increase every season that will eat the cap that comes off from bad contracts. We will also need to get better players to improve the team since we have no prospects in the pipe.
It’s going to take GM of the year performance to navigate this mess.

 

[Bubbles]

You missed #3: Let Ron Delorme pick McKenzie Stewart.

That one Benning was in full agreement with as he quickly gave him a pro contract and tried to force him on the AHL team when he wasn't even an ECHL level player.

It's like Benning cut the chains that Gillis had Delorme under. He was now free to pick the one useless WHL draftee that this organization loves to do.

Actually it's my belief that we have terrible drafting from the WHL BECAUSE Delorme is in charge of the WHL. Put in a qualified guy and we probably would have seen some more WHL alumni.

 

[Paulinbc]

There are so many people involved in the decision making for the team, how can you possibly assign blame or credit to one particular person? Just don’t buy the “it’s been confirmed” line. Could be true, but there is so much bs floating around, you really would be foolish to believe what some people are saying.

Probly a better way and more accurate way of phrasing it would be to say “the organization” or “the team”. It’s just way to complicated, or just downright impossible to calculate which one individual is responsible for what.

Win as a team. Lose as a team. Always.

 

[mouz135]

This season needs to end already. I’m craving for some news/rumours/actual shit cannings.

Let’s get the bloodshed started. The fans demand it

 

[Kryten]

It's like Benning cut the chains that Gillis had Delorme under. He was now free to pick the one useless WHL draftee that this organization loves to do.

Actually it's my belief that we have terrible drafting from the WHL BECAUSE Delorme is in charge of the WHL. Put in a qualified guy and we probably would have seen some more WHL alumni.

Personally I dont trust the WHL at all. Same with the Q recently. Its OHL or bust in Canada 99% for me

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

I don't think Benning has done a bad job at drafting. I will say this again, he is not a "master drafter". Nor does he have a magic system for identifying players. Drafting mostly comes down to draft position and luck. To see if a scouting team/GM are actually good at amateur scouting we need their lists. Every teams lists is going to have an assortment of hits and misses, with the likelihood of a bust increasing with draft position. If the hits line up with your pick you will make a good pick. If draft position lines up you will pick a bust. I'm not saying you can't identify a player. We had Hoglander really high, and Carolina took Aho like 30 spots before he was supposed to go. What I'm getting at is picking a player just as likely, if not more likely from luck than drafting ability. Especially in the later rounds.

If you pick top 10 year after year, it is very hard not to have a nice group of young players. For example, if after the draft a machine automatically traded our picks for the next player these would be our good young players:

Fleury
Pastrnak
Foegle
Konecny
Tkachuk
Glass
Hague
Boqvist
Romanov
Soderstrom
Korckzak.

 

[Bubbles]

Personally I dont trust the WHL at all. Same with the Q recently. Its OHL or bust in Canada 99% for me

That's your opinion I suppose. But there have plenty of players coming from the WHL and QMJHL for other NHL teams.

For example, Tampa Bay has no problems with WHL drafting.

 

[Jyrki21]

The 2017 draft video... like how can you watch this and conclude that Pettersson was actually Benning's guy all along?

Starting at 1:02:



Benning: That's him there, right? Right there?
Brackett: Who's that?
Benning: Patterson. [sic] The blue there, three rows up.
Brackett: Yep.
Benning: Right here at the end.
Brackett: Yep.

Benning isn't even sure who the guy is and doesn't really know his name.

 

[Canucker]

The 2017 draft video... like how can you watch this and conclude that Pettersson was actually Benning's guy all along?

Starting at 1:02:



Benning: That's him there, right? Right there?
Brackett: Who's that?
Benning: Patterson. [sic] The blue there, three rows up.
Brackett: Yep.
Benning: Right here at the end.
Brackett: Yep.

Benning isn't even sure who the guy is and doesn't really know his name.

I would LOVE to see the entire raw, unedited video of some of these drafts.

 

[Hit the post]

It's like Benning cut the chains that Gillis had Delorme under. He was now free to pick the one useless WHL draftee that this organization loves to do.

Actually it's my belief that we have terrible drafting from the WHL BECAUSE Delorme is in charge of the WHL. Put in a qualified guy and we probably would have seen some more WHL alumni.

Delorme : Who is this Brendan Gallagher guy? Sounds like he’s related to that “comedian” that smashes fruit with a hammer!



And we’re supposed to believe the story given by Jethro Bodine that gives the credit to Delorme for scouting Pettersson? Maybe that’s why our scout in charge of Western Canada misses so many players in our own background? He’s in Sweden!

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

I strongly advise you to avoid looking at this.

Again view this at your own peril:

List of Vancouver Canucks draft picks - Wikipedia

 

[Bubbles]

Delorme : Who is this Brendan Gallagher guy? Sounds like he’s related to that “comedian” that smashes fruit with a hammer!

And we’re supposed to believe the story given by Jethro Bodine that gives the credit to Delorme for scouting Pettersson? Maybe that’s why our scout in charge of Western Canada misses so many players in our own background? He’s in Sweden!

LOL yeah I found that a bit weird as well. Reading the article, it says Delorme was at the Ivan Hlinka when he first saw him. Delorme probably just said "This kid looks good in practise" and then Benning eats it up. Same guy that said "Peterson" a few times after saying Petterson at the announcement.

The Ivan Hlinka tournament is well known to scouts anyways.

 

[SamInVan]

For the new GM, is it not a fact that most of these bad contracts/buyouts/recapture come off the books next year and the year after? IMO that is fairly manageable for the new GM and shouldn’t hinder him too much.

2021-22 UFAs = $16.75m in cap space:
Edler $6m
Sutter $4.3
Hamonic $1.25
Baertschi $2.2
Depth players: Vesey ($900k), Boyd ($700k), Graovac ($700k), Chatfield ($700k)

2022-23 UFAs = $16.3m in cap space:
Roussell $3m
Motte $1.2
Holtby $4.3
Beagle $3m
Eriksson $4.8

(these numbers are from CapFriendly).

Next year we have roughly $17m to get BOTH Petey and Hughes under contract...and still need to back fill a top 4 D, 3C, bottom pair D and some depth.

Following year Boeser and Captain Bo are now looking for their next contract which will be prime years for both players.

Bottom line is the cap revenue from UFAs is being spent to keep roster players instead of investing in a scoring winger or another quality D.

 

[Cupless44]

This off season, we need to extend Hughes and Petey.
Next off season, we need to extend Boeser and his qualifier starts at 7.5?
The one after, Miller and Horvat and Hog and Ratbone.
Hughes and Petey will need extending because they will likey be on 3 year bridge oh and Pods need renew.
Demko the season after.
Bascially we will have massive salary increase every season that will eat the cap that comes off from bad contracts. We will also need to get better players to improve the team since we have no prospects in the pipe.
It’s going to take GM of the year performance to navigate this mess.

And the most damning statement of all concerning Benning...it is a total mess after missing the playoffs almost every year. It is one thing to be in cap hell after you have won the Cup and players want to be paid, this is another thing altogether. No excuse for salary cap hell when you should be rebuilding smartly.

 

[RobertKron]

The 2017 draft video... like how can you watch this and conclude that Pettersson was actually Benning's guy all along?

Starting at 1:02:



Benning: That's him there, right? Right there?
Brackett: Who's that?
Benning: Patterson. [sic] The blue there, three rows up.
Brackett: Yep.
Benning: Right here at the end.
Brackett: Yep.

Benning isn't even sure who the guy is and doesn't really know his name.

He's clearly throwing other teams off his trail.

As an aside, shouldn't he know him from the pre-draft interview process?

 

[Bubbles]

Since people are liking those BTS draft videos, here's another:



Interesting part at 3:02. Someone saids "It's up to Judd, we're getting value."

And later Weisbrod adds he saw someone at the WJ. LOL

 

[geebaan]

The 2017 draft video... like how can you watch this and conclude that Pettersson was actually Benning's guy all along?

Starting at 1:02:



Benning: That's him there, right? Right there?
Brackett: Who's that?
Benning: Patterson. [sic] The blue there, three rows up.
Brackett: Yep.
Benning: Right here at the end.
Brackett: Yep.

Benning isn't even sure who the guy is and doesn't really know his name.

“I wanna take Gunnarsson, I think he’s great”

Draft guru extraordinaire

 

[SamInVan]

I strongly advise you to avoid looking at this.

Again view this at your own peril:

List of Vancouver Canucks draft picks - Wikipedia

The 1990 draft still hurts for me.

Petr friggin Nedved over 6 future NHL All-stars including a HoF goalie.

Jagr or Brodeur would have changed this organization for decades.

 

[m9]

If we can have a normal conversation for a bit here... For the new GM, is it not a fact that most of these bad contracts/buyouts/recapture come off the books next year and the year after? IMO that is fairly manageable for the new GM and shouldn’t hinder him too much.

I agree with you that it isn't that bad long-term, other than the prospect pool that will be in the bottom third going into this draft.

The one truth Benning had is that the team is two years away. The only problem is that we are going to be perpetually two years away under him as new mistakes will keep cropping up. Two years ago the 2022-23 season looked like there were no bad contracts, now we are already at Myers & Ferland. Guys like Pearson & Schmidt are major question marks if they will be good enough to be worth their salary in two years. Plus, whatever is next on the horizon if Benning continues as GM.

 

[Bubbles]

The 1990 draft still hurts for me.

Petr friggin Nedved over 6 future NHL All-stars including a HoF goalie.

Jagr or Brodeur would have changed this organization for decades.

Hindsight is 20/20. A few teams were scared that Jagr had military service, so they stayed away. Also at the time goalies were rarely taken that early in the 1st round.

Numbers-wise, Nedved did a lot better than some of the 1st rounders.

 

[rypper]

I would LOVE to see the entire raw, unedited video of some of these drafts.

I would love to see the 2019 footage.

They do one of these every year. 2019 was at our home rink, they should have gone above and beyond with a behind the scenes video.

Instead it's likely buried deep under Rogers arena never to be seen because of all the alleged infighting that happened at the draft table. All the uncomfortable energy between Benning, Weisbrod, and Brackett.

How Jim apparently called an audible on the draft list on day 2. Gotta think it would be very very interesting.

 

[arttk]

I agree with you that it isn't that bad long-term, other than the prospect pool that will be in the bottom third going into this draft.

The one truth Benning had is that the team is two years away. The only problem is that we are going to be perpetually two years away under him as new mistakes will keep cropping up. Two years ago the 2022-23 season looked like there were no bad contracts, now we are already at Myers & Ferland. Guys like Pearson & Schmidt are major question marks if they will be good enough to be worth their salary in two years. Plus, whatever is next on the horizon if Benning continues as GM.

I don’t think we are 2 year away…. Reckoning will come in 2 years because Miller won’t re-sign and Horvat is going to demand term and money to stick around. Schmidt will probably decline soon so we’ll need 1 if not 2 top4 RD. We’ll need a good 3rd line guy and a top6 winger and it’s going to a lot of shrewd cap management to create space and get those pieces filled while maintaining a pipeline of prospects since we will need like 1 ELC guy to come in and contribute every year.

Best thing to do is to cut the cord and trade Miller for Newhook so at least we will have a cost controlled 3rd/2nd center behind Horvat and Petey. If we are going to suck next year anyways, might mot be a bad idea to trade him away, get a top4 D from the rangers or Chytil + prospect and extend the compete window when it opens up

 

[Cancuks]

Nedved got us Brown, Hedican and Lafayette. Without them, they wouldn't have gone to the Finals in 94.

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Some quotes from Courtnall on the current situation.