LW Arseniy Gritsyuk - SKA St.Petersburg, KHL (2019, 129th, NJD)

Zine

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He was never even included in the list of candidates, because he is MHL player.

But that’s a disgusting talent handling by Avangard’s management. They want to win KHL and MHL titles both and leave all their best young talents in MHL team and don’t even let them play in VHL.

Oh please. Gritsyuk wasn't a WJC candidate because he didn't deserve to be.

He's currently NOT on the level of the 2000 born offensive winger candidates. He's not even on Amirov's level and Amirov didn't make it either.
Gritsyuk was given an opportunity to show his stuff at the 4 nations in November but didn't do much of anything.

Bragin has quite a few faults, but one thing he's brilliant at is talent evaluation. That said, I do think Gritsyuk has a chance to play a significant role on next year's team.
 
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Pavel Buchnevich

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Oh please. Gritsyuk wasn't a WJC candidate because he didn't deserve to be.

He's currently NOT on the level of the 2000 born offensive winger candidates. He's not even on Amirov's level and Amirov didn't make it either.
Gritsyuk was given an opportunity to show his stuff at the 4 nations in November but didn't do much of anything.

Bragin has quite a few faults, but one thing he's brilliant at is talent evaluation. That said, I do think Gritsyuk has a chance to play a significant role on next year's team.

He might evaluate talent well, but he always seems to build teams poorly. His fourth line was talentless. The players sucked and were clearly below the level of the fourth liners from other teams. They might’ve filled grinder roles, but was it so impossible to find some different players to fill those roles?

He could’ve selected another three players instead who had more talent and can actually play against the best in their age group. Russia suffered in this tournament from being a three line team. Other teams sometimes do this, and it almost never results in winning gold for teams that do, but Bragin does it every year.

I don’t know why Russia keeps bringing him back. He doesn’t understand how to win this tournament. I’d want him gone by now, if I was a fan of Russia.
 

greasysnapper

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He might evaluate talent well, but he always seems to build teams poorly. His fourth line was talentless. The players sucked and were clearly below the level of the fourth liners from other teams. They might’ve filled grinder roles, but was it so impossible to find some different players to fill those roles?

He could’ve selected another three players instead who had more talent and can actually play against the best in their age group. Russia suffered in this tournament from being a three line team. Other teams sometimes do this, and it almost never results in winning gold for teams that do, but Bragin does it every year.

I don’t know why Russia keeps bringing him back. He doesn’t understand how to win this tournament. I’d want him gone by now, if I was a fan of Russia.

The only player I thought that was an omission from that lineup was Spiridonov and he was hurt right before the team was assembled (though he'd return to play before as well). Who were the 3 players you would have put into that lineup?

As for Gritsyuk, I think he wasn't good enough this season to play in a role that would be beneficial for him and the team, the Russians were stacked on the wing this year. It's very rare 17 or 18 year olds get into a Bragin lineup at the WJC. Next year he and Spiridonov will be on the team.
 

SoundAndFury

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I don’t know why Russia keeps bringing him back. He doesn’t understand how to win this tournament. I’d want him gone by now, if I was a fan of Russia.
I thought he showed he understands he does by well, winning it. Also Russia has won medals in 5/6 last WJC despite being generally considered to be 5th hockey power. Russia keeps bringing him back because he is the best man for the job, by far. But, evidently, to you, like many NHL fans, there is no such thing as a good hockey coach.

Just for curiosity, out of Russian coaches, who would you pick to replace Bragin?
 

Pavel Buchnevich

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The only player I thought that was an omission from that lineup was Spiridonov and he was hurt right before the team was assembled (though he'd return to play before as well). Who were the 3 players you would have put into that lineup?

As for Gritsyuk, I think he wasn't good enough this season to play in a role that would be beneficial for him and the team, the Russians were stacked on the wing this year. It's very rare 17 or 18 year olds get into a Bragin lineup at the WJC. Next year he and Spiridonov will be on the team.

I would've structured the team differently.

Marchenko-Morozov-Podkolzin
Denisenko-Khovnanov-Sokolov
Amirov-Voronkov-Dorofeyev
Nikolayev-Spiridonov-Alexandrov
Firstov/Afanasyev/Khusnutdinov

Russia isn't talented enough to leave a definite first round pick off the team like Amirov. You only see Canada and USA do that with regularity, and that's because they have the most players to pick from and the most high picks. I also would've had players like Nikolayev and Spiridonov filling grinder roles this year to get them a number of WJC games in a smaller role, which I think will help when they are among the leaders next year.
 

Pavel Buchnevich

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Dec 8, 2013
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I thought he showed he understands he does by well, winning it. Also Russia has won medals in 5/6 last WJC despite being generally considered to be 5th hockey power. Russia keeps bringing him back because he is the best man for the job, by far. But, evidently, to you, like many NHL fans, there is no such thing as a good hockey coach.

Just for curiosity, out of Russian coaches, who would you pick to replace Bragin?

Medals don't matter for the big five, unless they are gold. Russia was the favorite this year, and they lost. They should've won it this year, but didn't. Silver shouldn't be good enough. And I don't know who considers them to be 5th. Thats not my opinion. I don't know why Russian fans would be happy with getting a medal 5/6, if they aren't Gold Medals. This guy has shown recently that he can't win the tournament. He's not a winner because he can win a QF or SF. He's a winner if he can win Gold. Thats my opinion, at least.
 

SoundAndFury

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May 28, 2012
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Medals don't matter for the big five, unless they are gold. Russia was the favorite this year, and they lost. They should've won it this year, but didn't. Silver shouldn't be good enough. And I don't know who considers them to be 5th. Thats not my opinion. I don't know why Russian fans would be happy with getting a medal 5/6, if they aren't Gold Medals. This guy has shown recently that he can't win the tournament. He's not a winner because he can win a QF or SF. He's a winner if he can win Gold. Thats my opinion, at least.
0 rationale behind this thinking.

1)Medals do matter if you coach the teams that shouldn't even sniff one. For examples, see 14/15 roster. That basically was the tournament that made Bragin's career (the later part of it) as it showed he gives Russia a chance to win with almost any team. A bigger part of that roster capped out as depth-level KHL players. If you are going to slander him for losing finals where he was "favorite", at the same time acknowledge his successes with the teams that were legitimately terrible. Oh but of course, as long as he didn't win gold with those it doesn't matter, right?
2) Russia was the favorite this year? How? According to whom?
3) So who is this "the winner" you talk about? Russia should open the revolving door of C-list candidates because one of them might eventually luck into gold? To replace the coach who produces consistently good results with bad teams just because he didn't win gold in a tournament where his opposition has 5 times more first-rounders on the roster?

When the team underachieves, the first person fans go after is the coach. That's the same everywhere. And yet, Bragin, for the most part, is backed and admired by most in Russia. That should tell you your judgment is missing something.
 
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Pavel Buchnevich

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Dec 8, 2013
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0 rationale behind this thinking.

1)Medals do matter if you coach the teams that shouldn't even sniff one. For examples, see 14/15 roster. That basically was the tournament that made Bragin's career (the later part of it) as it showed he gives Russia a chance to win with almost any team. A bigger part of that roster capped out as depth-level KHL players. If you are going to slander him for losing finals where he was "favorite", at the same time acknowledge his successes with the teams that were legitimately terrible. Oh but of course, as long as he didn't win gold with those it doesn't matter, right?
2) Russia was the favorite this year? How? According to whom?
3) So who is this "the winner" you talk about? Russia should open the revolving door of C-list candidates because one of them might eventually luck into gold? To replace the coach who produces consistently good results with bad teams just because he didn't win gold in a tournament where his opposition has 5 times more first-rounders on the roster?

When the team underachieves, the first person fans go after is the coach. That's the same everywhere. And yet, Bragin, for the most part, is backed and admired by most in Russia. That should tell you your judgment is missing something.

The 14/15 team was one of Russia's best recent teams. Shestyorkin and Sorokin in goal. Provorov and Gavrikov on the back-end. Buchnevich, Barbashev, Goldobin, Kamenev, Mamin among the forwards. How many good NHL'ers do you think the average non-Canadian WJC team among the other four big five countries usually ends up having? Thats a very good return from that roster. Every roster will end up having some guys who don't make it as high level pro hockey players.

And yes, Russia was the favorite, in my opinion. I said it at the beginning of the tournament, and throughout. I thought they had the best crop of 2000 born players among the four teams, and they had a lot of returning players. They had a very deep defense, they had some standout forwards, and their goaltending was one of the better duos on paper.

If you prefer average results instead of winning Gold every now and then, that's your right to think that way. I'd rather be like Finland where its often Gold or bust. Thats my own opinion, and I think the coach should be judged on winning the tournament. There are five teams that can realistically win. It's not asking a lot to win the tournament a few times every 10 years.
 

SoundAndFury

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The 14/15 team was one of Russia's best recent teams. Shestyorkin and Sorokin in goal. Provorov and Gavrikov on the back-end. Buchnevich, Barbashev, Goldobin, Kamenev, Mamin among the forwards.
When the team which had 1 forward with NHL top-6 upside gets called "one of the best", yeah that's not a discussion worth having. Provorov and Kamenev were both 18 and had fairly limited impact, Tolchinsky, Sharov, Leshchenko and the likes played key roles on the team. Yeah, I will just walk away from this, have it your way dude.
 
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Favin

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28 goals, many of them a joy to watch. Appears his ceiling is higher than his draft position.

(unrelated - why is there no thread on Alexander Gordin?)
 
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Jason MacIsaac

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Not the best place to look for this type of information.

Managers of Avangard said that Arseniy will get a chance in KHL this year. VHL is the worst scenario, MHL is almost impossible.
This is wonderful news, I have him much higher on the Devils prospect list than most.
 

Favin

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Any news why he hasn't appeared for Avangard Omsk yet? Sounds like he did well in pre-season...3 pts in his first 5 KHL games.
 

SoundAndFury

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Any news why he hasn't appeared for Avangard Omsk yet? Sounds like he did well in pre-season...3 pts in his first 5 KHL games.
They are basically competing for the roster spot with Chinakhov and he has won out.
 

Atas2000

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Jan 18, 2011
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Any news why he hasn't appeared for Avangard Omsk yet? Sounds like he did well in pre-season...3 pts in his first 5 KHL games.
Avangard and AkBars will probably fight out the East. Avangard is stacked. It will be hard for young players to get a spot. Don't expect Gritsyuk to get many games in the KHL this season.
 
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