Friedman: Lucic on the move?

[Habs Halifax]

I would suggest that the 3rd point is a non issue. The list of teams he wouldn’t accept a trade to is quite small.

How do you know that?

 

[WesMcCauley]

I posted this in another thread but it is very relevant here.

From David Staples, Edmonton Journal

"If Lucic is moved after July 1, the Oilers will have paid his $3.5 million bonus. The team that gets him will have to take his full $6 million cap hit for five more years, but won’t have to pay him $30 million over that time. Instead, they’ll owe just $22.5 million over the five years, $4.5 million a year. It’s also possible Lucic and his new team will agree to drop his No Movement Clause, which will protect that team if they don’t want to protect Lucic in an expansion draft. For a team on a budget, for a team where capping out isn’t an issue because they don’t intend to ever spend that much, Lucic projects as a decent winger earning $4.5 million per year. He doesn’t have to play on the top line to be OK value for that kind of pay."

Edmonton Oilers "confident" they can move Milan Lucic, but where might he end up?

The overall gist is that Lucic won't cost as much in actual dollars as everyone on here believes he will. Lucic at $4.5 Million is much more palatable than Lucic at $6 Million.

Not many teams care more about actually $ than the cap hit. He still has alot of term which isnt exactly something you want with a declining player. Tons of teams would take him at 6 mill for a year, longterm though its not exactly a contract you want.... He doesnt exactly fit in with speed game most teams wanna play either.

 

[Aceboogie]

I would suggest that the 3rd point is a non issue. The list of teams he wouldn’t accept a trade to is quite small.

Very true. Probably 95% of the NHL teams are most desirable to Lucic than Edmonton, so a NMC isnt the main concern. Its the party on the other end of a deal

 

[ChaoticOrange]

I'm interested in this type of a deal but not all Habs fans are...

Oilers trade
- Lucic
- 10th pick
- Yamamoto or Puljujarvi

Habs trade
- Patch (pre-negotiated deal that the Oilers are OK with)
- Lindgren
- One of (Bitten, Ikonen, or a 2018 4th)

The base for the deal is Patch+ for 10th and Lucic+. If you think the plus on each team can even it out a bit, we have a base to negotiate with and I do think Lucic would waive his NMC to come to Montreal to play with Gallagher and Weber. He is already on record at saying he considered this when he signed the deal with the Oilers.

Cut out the spare parts (Lindgren+middling prospect). No chance both 10 and Yamamoto/JP move.

Lucic + for a prenegotiated extension with Patch - which I think is risky as all hell but hey...

 

[justafan22]

Would basically have to be another gargantuan bad contract in need of a change of scenery for another.

or..... the oilers retain 15-20% and get say a mediocre contract + a mid round pick for him.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

How do you know that?

Pretty widely reported by Edmonton insiders.

 

[Kaibur]

McKenzie, Friedman and Dreger have all said there’s some interest in Lucic league wide - I honestly think he’s got more value than people think.

I can think of half a dozen teams with contract space and a reason to pick him up.

I'm curious which teams you're thinking here.

 

[Aceboogie]

Not many teams care more about actually $ than the cap hit. He still has alot of term which isnt exactly something you want with a declining player. Tons of teams would take him at 6 mill for a year, longterm though its not exactly a contract you want.... He doesnt exactly fit in with speed game most teams wanna play either.

I think youd be suprised. Probably 6-7 of the lower revenue teams in the NHL care more about actual $. That is money coming out of the owners pocket. Numerous deals have been made to save actual $ at the expense of cap hit, which they dont really care about much as they are not up against the cap anyway

 

[Dan Kelly]

Not disagreeing with you there. He is the worst GM overall, but sometimes GMs can be dumber is different circumstance. There is probably a pool of 5 GMs I could see being dumber when it comes to Lucic. Some GMs still have a hard on for these type of players and will act totally irrationally when it comes to them. The usual cast of dumb GMs were making hard runs at Lucic back in 2016, so maybe they are still as eager as they were back then

Maybe wishful thinking on my part, but I wouldnt be shocked if it happened

Fans are WAY too obsessed with the size and length of contracts on these boards! What people are missing when they chime in on Lucic and whether or not he's "worth" his contract is that playoff teams saw what Tom Wilson and Ryan Reeves brought to the table in the playoffs and cup finals and want a similar type of player on their team and Lucic would absolutely fill that bill, large contract or not, and he has enough offensive talent to be able to score like Wilson did in the playoffs and has the physical tools to play as tough a game as Wilson and Reeves did. That has tremendous value!

 

[Habs Halifax]

Cut out the spare parts (Lindgren+middling prospect). No chance both 10 and Yamamoto/JP move.

Lucic + for a prenegotiated extension with Patch - which I think is risky as all hell but hey...

Well, the + needs to be the 10th pick at the very least. Some Habs fans say the 10th pick = Patch. So you get where I am going here. If you are not willing to make us happy, try pawning off Lucic to another team.

But like I said... This is the base. Lucic and the 10th + for Patch +. If you are interested, the + on both sides can be negotiated.

 

[milehigh11]

I think youd be suprised. Probably 6-7 of the lower revenue teams in the NHL care more about actual $. That is money coming out of the owners pocket. Numerous deals have been made to save actual $ at the expense of cap hit, which they dont really care about much as they are not up against the cap anyway

They will care when they are forced to protect him when the next expansion team comes in a few years.

 

[TFHockey]

They will care when they are forced to protect him when the next expansion team comes in a few years.

If you had bothered to read the article or my post you'd see that Lucic is willing to waive his NTC and for the new team they would probably ask him to keep it waived... thus no protection requirement.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Pretty widely reported by Edmonton insiders.

It still limits things and it's a factor. It's anybodies guess where Lucic will accept a trade too. Considering its hard to negotiate trades, when you reduce the amount of teams you can negotiate with, it becomes even harder.

The other players I will throw out there is Alzner or Shaw. Lots of options to explore between the Habs and Oilers. I'm willing to help the Oilers out but you need to be willing to help the Habs out. Takes two sides to work a deal and I'm pretty sure Lucic approves a deal to the Habs.

 

[Habs Halifax]

If you had bothered to read the article or my post you'd see that Lucic is willing to waive his NTC and for the new team they would probably ask him to keep it waived... thus no protection requirement.

Waive his NMC you mean. NTC don't have to be protected. First I hear of this story. Makes him easier to move in this case but it's still difficult cause you will need to add on top of him.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

I'm curious which teams you're thinking here.

Carolina, Vancouver, Montreal, Vegas, Colorado, Columbus and Arizona immediately jumped to mind.

The first three’s GM’s have all said they want to get tougher and have bad contracts of their own they could ship out (Darling/Rask, Eriksson/Sutter, Shaw/Alzner). Vegas might see value in Lucic’s leadership and Cup ring and has shown a willingness to take bad contracts for extra assets, ditto for Arizona. Colorado has all the cap space, is losing Comeau most likely, may want some protection for their young guns and also has a couple undesirable contracts they could offload (Wilson/Soderberg)

Columbus was the last one and a similar vein of thinking - habitual playoff early exits and a couple seriously underperforming contracts in Foligno and Dubinsky. Perhaps they’d look at a change in their leadership group - again if Edmonton made it worth their while.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Getting rid of Lucic and adding Patch would be a massive upgrade for the Oilers... even if they had to unload the 10th pick and Yamamoto while getting grade B prospects like Ikonen or Bitten in return. And no idea if you are interested in Lindgren.

What are the Oilers intentions? To build a winner now or later? This matters in trade discussions

 

[TFHockey]

Waive his NMC you mean. NTC don't have to be protected. First I hear of this story. Makes him easier to move in this case but it's still difficult cause you will need to add on top of him.

Yes, right on the money there. NMC.

 

[Dan Kelly]

I'm interested in this type of a deal but not all Habs fans are...

Oilers trade
- Lucic
- 10th pick
- Yamamoto or Puljujarvi

Habs trade
- Patch (pre-negotiated deal that the Oilers are OK with)
- Lindgren
- One of (Bitten, Ikonen, or a 2018 4th)

The base for the deal is Patch+ for 10th and Lucic+. If you think the plus on each team can even it out a bit, we have a base to negotiate with and I do think Lucic would waive his NMC to come to Montreal to play with Gallagher and Weber. He is already on record at saying he considered this when he signed the deal with the Oilers.

Unfortunately neither Yamamoto nor Puljujarvi are in play unless Gallagher is in play. Just the way it appears to be .

 

[Habs Halifax]

Parts that I would put on the table from the Habs... If the Oilers are willing to talk Lucic and the 10th pick. I just don't see the Oilers getting an asset like Patch in return for Lucic in any sort of deal.

- Patch
- Lindgren
- B type prospects in Ikonen and Bitten
- 4th round pick
- Schlemko, Shaw, Alzner, Benn

 

[TimThomas24]

David Backes...

 

[Aceboogie]

It still limits things and it's a factor. It's anybodies guess where Lucic will accept a trade too. Considering its hard to negotiate trades, when you reduce the amount of teams you can negotiate with, it becomes even harder.

The other players I will throw out there is Alzner or Shaw. Lots of options to explore between the Habs and Oilers. I'm willing to help the Oilers out but you need to be willing to help the Habs out. Takes two sides to work a deal and I'm pretty sure Lucic approves a deal to the Habs.

I do think the two could be good trading partners. I would be interested in a deal around Lucic + 10th and Patches. Id want a solid prospect or pick added to Patches given that hes a UFA after next year.

Id it would take ~25th overall pick to have a team to take on all of Lucics contract. So the 10th is too high of cost for me

TL;DR- Id do Lucic + 10th for Patches + 2nd

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Well, the + needs to be the 10th pick at the very least. Some Habs fans say the 10th pick = Patch. So you get where I am going here. If you are not willing to make us happy, try pawning off Lucic to another team.

But like I said... This is the base. Lucic and the 10th + for Patch +. If you are interested, the + on both sides can be negotiated.

Maybe. My main problem is I don’t know if Patches just had a bad year or is sliding.

Pacioretty likely commands - based on what he’s done in the past - a 7 million dollar AAV on his new deal. We’re treating Lucic like negative value, which may or may not be the case depending on which version of Jekyll and Hyde Lucic you get. We’re also paying a premium asset, two in the original one you proposed. Pacioretty and Lucic are the same age.

So, my problem is we 1) give up huge pieces of the future for 2) a guy who may or may not be in decline 3) add salary rather than shedding it and 4) may not be better off short term and are definitely worse long term.

Is Pacioretty signed at, say, 7x7 really that much of a better contract than Lucic on the books for 6x5?

 

[Habs Halifax]

Unfortunately neither Yamamoto nor Puljujarvi are in play unless Gallagher is in play. Just the way it appears to be .

Habs already have Patch in play and many think he is worth the 10th alone. So we have no base for a deal if you are not willing to add on top of Lucic and the 10th. How about future picks?

 

[PromisedLand]

Lol. Edmonton and lucic already trying to sever ties when everyone knew from day 1 that contract was atrocious

Chia is the man

 

[bsu]

How does a GM f*** up so many times and still have a job....I really don't get it lol